To think most managers are bad?

[Avisitboss]

I have worked for a few different companies and various teams within them and on the whole, I would say you get more bad managers than good managers in terms of line managing and actually being able to do the people management part of the job well (development, criticism when needed) and remain professional?

I have had managers / directors who either get too friendly and want to be liked and then struggle to be tough when needed or a total nightmare and their personal mood / happiness dictates the whole team culture.

IME, YABU. Most of my managers in over 30 decades have been ok to excellent. I can only remember one who was a waste of space but sufficiently ineffectual I could just go round him.

I think I’ve had more good managers than bad on the whole, but know what you mean. It’s difficult to get it right.

@ErrolTheDragon to be fair, I haven’t had any I think are a waste of space. Just not good people managers.

Did any of these companies give people training before promoting them to management? None of the ones I've worked for have. We're promoted based on our technical skills, given people to manage and expected to know how to motivate, develop, and give constructive feedback.

I've had two that were bloody awful, the last two and current one good and the others mediocre fence sitters at best.

Peter principle

Most of my managers in over 30 decades have been ok to excellent

I didn't know you were that old @ErrolTheDragon

Most of my managers in over 40 years of working have been good to excellent. In all honesty I have only worked for one manager who was awful.

I think a lot of people fall into people management and haven't had any real training or support in how to do it effectively

Therefore the situations you are seeing (& which are all over MN all the time) are so common

It can be very lonely being a "good manager" - so I can see why it's easy to fall into the trap of being too friendly with your reports

Nearly everyone I know had only had 1 or 2 decent managers in their whole working life.

I have only worked for 5 different organisations since I left school in 1977. I have moved departments within some though.

I’ve had some inspirational managers and some real idiots. I learnt how not to manage people by suffering those who see management as power, but ignore responsibility. More good than bad I’d say. I’ve managed teams, albeit at a low level, and its a rare joy if everyone pulls together.

However, after decades of work in different public sector organisations, I’ve also come to realise that some employees see managing as bullying, just because their manager was perhaps trying to get them to do their job?. They are often entitled (been there a long time, don’t like change) or bitter (how can someone outside the team got promoted over them?) or just lazy, inept etc.

This and the fact that very few are trained. They get promoted and just expected to get on with it. In teaching it's either good teachers or good blaggers who get promoted but very few have the actual skills set to manage others.

My current two (one is on Mat Leave, so he's covering for her) are brilliant. Very supportive and understanding. Our whole team is really happy with them and with each other. The morale is quite high.

The one before them drove me to a breakdown and near suicide.

My current two (one is on Mat Leave, so he's covering for her) are brilliant. Very supportive and understanding. Our whole team is really happy with them and with each other. The morale is quite high.

That describes my line manager and HOD. They are very approachable and flexible. We have no narcissists or dead wood in our team, and there is give and take on both sides.

I went for a promotion to a management role, my training consisted of 20 minutes chat in to how to write a 1-1.

I left because I knew I wasn't giving my team what they needed.

Ah....Just the way I'm feeling today maybe, RampantIvy

I've recently been promoted into a role with line management. To echo other comments, I have been given no training and don't feel I'm managing my team as effectively as I could.

I'm going to put together a development plan for 2023 and source training so I can get to where I want to be but this is completely self driven. I've received no negative feedback from my superiors.

OP are you a manager yourself? I am and find it the most challenging aspect of my role. I try to get a feel for the person I'm working with, and the situation and adapt my management style to suit. It's really hard to do it well and I def get it wrong sometimes.
I had some not so good managers but none truly awful. My current one isn't great as he never makes notes so comms lack clarity and he avoids conflict which means sometimes issues are left to fester.
The biggest issue is being measured on results/delivery which means there's often no incentive to people manage well but just to hammer a team for results.

I've had one exceptionally good manager. She was caring and strong, extremely knowledgeable and not afraid to get stuck in when needed. I loved her and was really sad when she left. Things when downhill after that!

I have two in a job share at the moment. One is too soft and doesn't deal with anything properly and the other is a robot who sticks to the party line with no deviation. Neither are terribly observant regarding the problems in the team and have failed to deal with a fairly significant bullying situation which has seen one of the team struggling mentally.

I've had managers who are lazy, childish and dictatorial. It can be very hard to get it right admittedly, but I've had far more terrible ones than good.

My last 2 before current job have been poor. One young , inexperienced, told a lot of lies to benefit himself etc, the one before that was frankly a bully. Current one is ok, a lovely person but ineffective, doesn't monitor her team properly and lets them get away with all sorts. On the whole most have been poor. They are either ogres and bullies or too soft and ineffective to manage.

I think quite often people get management jobs because they say the right things to the people above them, not because they are thought to have the right qualities. I had one manager who had this technique off to a fine art. She'd sit in meetings saying nothing until the most senior person there expressed an opinion. She would then back that person up.

She herself was an absolute nightmare to work with, chaotic, pushing blame for her own mistakes on to other people, spending most of her time on office politics.

I work in retail, the vast majority of managers are awful.

I’ve gotten on well with most of my managers and don’t have anything against them as people, but would say there was only one who was really good at being a manager.

I was rubbish at it in my last job too though so I can’t talk! Just taken a new job with no line management responsibilities, and so far really like my own manager!

YABU- I think a lot depends on industry too. I've had some horrendous managers but luckily my last couple at my current company have been great. I manage a team of 6 and use my experiences from having crap managers to try & be the best manager I could possibly be (and I love being a manager too!).

I have had both end of the scales - a couple of fantastic managers who behaved like a decent human beings to others who were utter monsters, who lied, bullied and blamed the team for their bad management and decisions.

Plenty of mediocre ones in the middle.