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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask why midwives try to prevent / discourage you having an epidural ?

328 replies

stripyspider · 16/11/2022 17:20

I recently had my daughter, ( six weeks old). I knew from the outset of the pregnancy I wanted an epidural, (I don't cope with pain well). Everyone I knew who had one, (including a midwife friend), spoke excellently of them, and had no side effects. Also, what was an important factor was, unlike pethidine, epidural does not cross the placenta and effect the baby.

However, at any antenatal appointment I had, (including the birth planning appointment), my midwife kept telling me I should see how I do, and kept saying, " but you might Suprise yourself and cope so well with gas and air you won't need an epidural," "be so much better if you didn't have one." She then kept telling me I should try and wait as long as possible before having one.....the implication being, that I was being a bit of a wimp for wanting/ being set on an epidural.

I just couldn't work out why it would be better for me to exhaust myself by going through hours of agony unnecessarily, ( which could potentially lead to PTSD/ birth trauma), when the hospital have epidurals that are proven to work, and don't have any ill effect on the baby ?

My anxiety was peeked by the fact a friend of mine had her first baby at the same hospital a few weeks before I had my daughter. She was also clear from the outset she wanted an epidural, and faced the same attitude of "well you are being a bit of a wimp," by midwives, ( she had such bad tokophobia she was referred to the mental health midwife, and the mental health midwife tried to persuade her against having an epidural when making a mental health birth plan !) In the end, this friend went to hospital , was found to be 2cm dilated and was sent home even though she was crying in agony and begging for pain relief. She returned a few hours later and had dilated to 9cm really quickly, so was then told it was too late for an epidural and she had to give birth with nothing. She is very traumatised and upset by this.

I tried to explain to my midwife I was worried about similar happening to me, and she just dismissed it and said, "but your friend is lucky she managed the majority of her labour at home and had an intervention free birth, that is a good thing. Don't worry yourself stripyspider, don't let your friend scare you, she actually had a good experience, and some people like to moan for nothing, she sounds like one of those people"

Anyway, in the end I went 13 days overdue so needed to be induced via drip. Even the NHS website states that induction via drip is likely to be a lot more painful than natural labour, and you may want to request an epidural at the start. I thought if this was standard NHS advice, it would be pretty mainstream.

The midwives kept trying to dissuade me from having an epidural before the drip ,saying it was an "unusual choice," and why would I not want to wait a while to see how it goes ? They also stated that an epidural at the beginning would prevent me from having an active birth and be able to move around.

I pointed out I was hardly likely to be bouncing on birth balls up the corridor given I was canulated, attatched via wires to a massive drip and several monitors, ( and therefore waterbirth would be out regardless). They said I should start the induction and try pethidine first, I pointed out I didn't see why it would be better to try pethidine when I have a family history of reacting extremely badly to opiate medication, the anaesthetists had already told me pethidine didn't really do anything to relieve labour pain and , unlike an epidural, could transfer via the placenta to the baby. In the end , they did agree to allow me to have an epidural before the induction drip started, but I was really upset to hear them laughing about how I was "demanding an epidural," in the corridor. When the shift changed, the next midwife said to me she would have likely had an epidural as she's not good with pain, but would have waited until 4/5 cm dilated. When I asked what the benefit of waiting was, she just shrugged her shoulders.

When I was actually giving birth , they invited a student doctor in to watch, ( he was on placement), and even said to him, ( in front of me ), "sorry you don't get to see a more normal/ natural birth."

I feel like i've been made to feel like a failure and not a "real," mother/ women for wanting an epidural, even though there appears to be nothing to suggest an epidural is damaging to baby at all.

Why are they so, so , so keen to stop you having one, ( to the extent of telling my tokkophobic friend she didn't need one). The only reason I can think of is it costs the NHS more as you have to stay in hospital longer with an epidural , but is there more to it ?

The being made to feel pathetic has really knocked my confidence as a mum tbh.

OP posts:
Twizbe · 16/11/2022 17:41

@Somuchgoo the pain in labour is different pain. It's designed to make you stop and listen to your body. That pain is part of a feedback loop designed to help you give birth. Removing that with an epidural can lead to more interventions.

HOWEVER, we have them and they can really help some women.

FWIW I had a third degree tear with my first and no tear with me second. I literally didn't feel any difference between both. I had no idea I'd torn with number one because I was expecting it to really hurt and it didn't.

stripyspider · 16/11/2022 17:41

wishing3 · 16/11/2022 17:38

Did your labour go okay in the end OP? Sounds stressful.

Yes, in the end she was born fine vaginally, but I was very uptight as I had obviously heard myself being gossiped about in the corridor and the comments to the student doctor ( said in front of me), really played on my mind and made me feel like a failure.

Physically the recovery afterwards was fine though, didn't feel it took me any longer to recover in the days /couple of weeks after than friends who hadn't had one.

OP posts:
Unicorn1919 · 16/11/2022 17:42

I was induced and had a drip. I opted not to have an epidural as I didn't want to risk the headache that it sometimes causes or the increased risk of interventions. I think if you can manage without it is generally thought safer.

Notanotherusername4321 · 16/11/2022 17:42

As above it’s because it often slows down progression, means you can’t feel to know when to push etc and often leads to increased intervention.

also many women manage fine up to a point past which it’s too late for an epidural. I have a health issue which meant I might not be able to have an epidural at all, in my meeting with the consultant anesthetist they said if you leave it til you feel you can’t cope that’s too late.

as it was my birth went to shit and I wasn’t coping at 1 cm. Fortunately I asked for an epidural even though the m/w said I couldn’t possibly be in that much pain. But they called the anaesthetist anyway, which was fortunate as she was already there when they realised I was in that much pain, but not from contractions and I needed a section NOW…

edwinbear · 16/11/2022 17:44

I'm all for women having choice, but the outcome wasn't great for me. I insisted on one, DS was a very long, (36h) difficult labour, presenting back-to-back so I was in a lot of pain. It definitely managed my pain, but also reduced the urge to push, so I ended up with forceps, a bad tear, retained placenta and a prolapse. DS also suffered bad bruising on his face and over his eye from the forceps. It obviously doesn't go that way for everyone, but I didn't have one for DD!

countbackfromten · 16/11/2022 17:44

I’m an anaesthetist who does a lot on labour ward. I come and explain the process, the risks and get consent for giving an epidural. Pain relief shouldn’t be a battle in Labour. It is a basic right and women should be trusted to choose what pain relief they want and be supported - in the very rare cases an epidural can’t be done or shouldn’t be done there are other options.

I am sorry that happened to you @stripyspider.

LBFseBrom · 16/11/2022 17:45

I didn't know maternity staff advised against epidurals. I didn't have one, neither did I want to or any drugs but I did not have a long labour and was very much in control all the time.

People should have what they need.

PlantsAndSpaniels · 16/11/2022 17:45

I was put off them by my mum who said she was terrified of them when she had me. My midwife tale

miltonj · 16/11/2022 17:46

They just don't have enough anaesthetists available a lot of the time.

Also I've experienced dural puncture and failed epidural which is hell on earth. Women are out of action having to lay on their backs or suffer suicidal headaches for days after labour. They say it's 1 in 500 but it's likelihood increases with late administration of epidural, so if they know the anaesthetist is busy and won't get round to a woman until their in pushing stage, they're unlikely to want to risk it perhaps. However they should not be condescending towards women and all the information and choices should be presented to all women without ideology or agenda.

DixonD · 16/11/2022 17:46

They tried to force one on me (induction) but I refused…of course until it started to hurt!

Katapolts · 16/11/2022 17:47

What a horrible experience! I'd actually write a complaint about the way the midwives spoke to/about you - absolutely no need for it.

I had 3 epidurals, all excellent and don't regret it at all.

The correlation between epidurals and other interventions is not clear by the way - it's not really possible to say epidurals cause interventions. It could equally be that women who have more painful labours (for example because the baby is badly positioned) are more likely to need interventions.

RidingMyBike · 16/11/2022 17:47

I found the antenatal/community midwives were very dismissive of whatever I wanted that didn't coincide with what they wanted. They spent weeks trying to force me to birth in the midwife-led unit, ignoring all my concerns about access to pain relief. They even told me I was booked for it 'by default'! Confused

Fortunately the obstetrician was very supportive and got me what I wanted (birth on labour ward with epidural) and the midwives in labour itself were fine.

The community ones were also dreadful postnatally!

miffmufferedmoof · 16/11/2022 17:48

Don’t let it knock your confidence OP - be proud that you stood up for yourself and got what you needed!
I absolutely would not go on the drip without an epidural first (if I have another baby), but I would prefer to aim for a natural birth if I wasn’t being induced in order to reduce the chances of needing further intervention (would def prefer to avoid c section if possible).
Sometimes they probably try and fob you off because they’re short of anaesthetists

AnneLovesGilbert · 16/11/2022 17:49

Congratulations on your new baby and I’m so sorry you had this experience. Your poor friend too, I hope she’s getting better support dealing with the aftermath.

I had the opposite, my waters broke and things weren’t progressing so I had the drip and was strongly encouraged to have an epidural by the consultant and midwife even though I didn’t want one. I was very calm but not really listening tbh and they had the anaesthetist on standby and it was in within about 20 minutes of me changing my mind when I stopped being able to wee and was in a lot of pain.

It then failed when I ended up in theatre for a section and had to have a GA, which wasn’t ideal.

Women should be informed of how different meds and procedures will affect them and their babies and then given a choice without any pressure or guilt tripping and respected as sensible adults.

bonnyrascal · 16/11/2022 17:50

OP, I was also induced via drip and don’t blame you at all for requesting an epidural upfront. I was scared of getting an epidural so resisted until I could not bare the pain any longer - it was intense! But I was so glad when I had the epidural set up, especially as then I required forceps and suffered a bad tear (not connected to me having the epidural though as far as I am aware). I still felt pain immediately after the birth so god knows what it would have been like had I not had it.

Maybe it was your particular Trust? No one bat an eyelid when I asked for the epidural, it was just arranged. I also know someone at the same hospital who asked for an epidural at the start of the induction (via drip) process and it was given without issue.

It should really be the woman’s informed choice as to if and when she wants one.

NotQuiteUsual · 16/11/2022 17:52

I'm sorry they made you feel like that. My hospital was really encouraging and not at all judgey. The anesthestist appeared at the start of my labour and asked if I fancied one, he had a little trolley and everything. It felt more like the tea and coffee ladies coming round than a surgical thing. My other labour I was telling them on Antenatal ward before I was wheeled into labour I wanted one and he was there waiting for me. Bloody lovely.

I'd encourage anyone to have one. Recovering from labour without was exhausting beyond words.

Somuchgoo · 16/11/2022 17:53

Anotherdayanotherdollar · 16/11/2022 17:33

It begins the cascade of intervention, and reduces the liklihood of having a normal delivery.

@somuchgoo it's not really would you prefer to feel yourself tearing or not, it's more would you prefer to reduce your chance of tearing/needing an epis

The likelihood of a tear is very high shear, so yes, I'd personally rather take even a certainty of a tear reduce was painless, over a high chance of feeling one of the most sensitive bits of my body ripping apart.

Then again, I chose sections instead, because that way I had no labour pains either, and near enough a pain free experience overall. Yes, I got sliced open and stitched up, but I didn't feel it at least 😊

I'm a firm believer that every woman should be allowed tov try to give birth in the way that's right for them, whether that's low intervention, epidural from the outset or by section.

We all get the same prize at the end - there are no extra rewards for being brave/ enduring pain.

Magssss · 16/11/2022 17:53

Oh I could write a book on this OP. I can’t understand it either. I had a birth without an epidural despite it being in my birth plan (in fact it was the only thing in my birth plan!!) and I screamed for an epidural the entire time, no one ever came. It massively traumatised me, especially as he was born sunny side up at 4kg.

For my most recent baby I booked a C-section but made it crystal clear that the only reason I was opting for it was because of fear of being denied an epidural again. I wanted them to know the lack of decent pain relief in my last birth was leading me to choose major surgery instead of taking the risk of that happening again.

As it happened I went into labour whilst in hospital waiting for my C-section and I said that if I could have an immediate epidural I would crack on and they arranged it really quickly. I don’t think that would have happened if I’d opted for a natural birth from the outset - I think I’d have been told to go home or given the “you’re too early” “oh sorry now you’re too late” spiel.
Im glad I had a natural birth with epidural in the end because this baby was also 4kg and sunny side up. I had no problems whatsoever and no trauma.
My advice to anyone is if you want an epidural, ask v early, don’t take no for an answer, take it higher in management if necessary and write it all over your notes. It’s YOUR choice if you want to take the risk of further intervention, not their choice to make for you.

Somuchgoo · 16/11/2022 17:55

Twizbe · 16/11/2022 17:41

@Somuchgoo the pain in labour is different pain. It's designed to make you stop and listen to your body. That pain is part of a feedback loop designed to help you give birth. Removing that with an epidural can lead to more interventions.

HOWEVER, we have them and they can really help some women.

FWIW I had a third degree tear with my first and no tear with me second. I literally didn't feel any difference between both. I had no idea I'd torn with number one because I was expecting it to really hurt and it didn't.

I know people say 'i didn't feel the tear ' in a reassuring way, but the other way of reading it, is, 'the rest of my body hurt so much that that pain overwhelmed the pain of my vulva tearing ' and that's not a reassuring assessment of the level of pain women are expected to endure.

superplumb · 16/11/2022 18:00

I was induced and had my waters broken. This still didn't work so then I had the drip. The pain after waters went from a 3 to a 10 in a second. I asked for pain relief and my awful midwife said you don't need one, I managed on gas and air. I had to wait for hours until i got one. Not all midwives are nice, like any other profession.

MrsOgmorePritchard · 16/11/2022 18:00

Targets.

BreatheAndFocus · 16/11/2022 18:02

The rude comment was wrong, but it’s right to try to dissuade women from having an epidural - as long as it’s in an educational, caring way not a bossy way.

Epidurals increase the risk of interventions; they stop you feeling what your body wants to do; they mean you push wrongly when your body is trying to guide you in what to do, and you get a massive great tear; you increase your risk of forceps and an episiotomy

**Not being able to feel the forceps/episiotomy at the time is not that relevant. It’s afterwards that’s the issue!

You concentrated on your friend’s story but I’ve heard far more against epidural than against non-epidural birth. My cousin had a leak from the epidural, and had to lie flat on her back for days with a most awful headache. It was not only extremely painful, it was very upsetting for her when she should have been enjoying her new baby.

BreatheAndFocus · 16/11/2022 18:02

Ignore the bold there - they were asterisks for my comment below not holding marks.

Magssss · 16/11/2022 18:04

I don’t think midwives should try to dissuade or persuade you, they should simply give you the facts and let you choose

Underanothersky · 16/11/2022 18:06

BreatheAndFocus · 16/11/2022 18:02

The rude comment was wrong, but it’s right to try to dissuade women from having an epidural - as long as it’s in an educational, caring way not a bossy way.

Epidurals increase the risk of interventions; they stop you feeling what your body wants to do; they mean you push wrongly when your body is trying to guide you in what to do, and you get a massive great tear; you increase your risk of forceps and an episiotomy

**Not being able to feel the forceps/episiotomy at the time is not that relevant. It’s afterwards that’s the issue!

You concentrated on your friend’s story but I’ve heard far more against epidural than against non-epidural birth. My cousin had a leak from the epidural, and had to lie flat on her back for days with a most awful headache. It was not only extremely painful, it was very upsetting for her when she should have been enjoying her new baby.

My body didn't want to do anything, my contractions stopped, thats why they put me on the drip.