Can anyone explain child centiles to me?

[olivewreath13]

AIBU for thinking it's really confusing, or am I being thick?

I've been diagnosed pre diabetic this week and trying to overhaul my diet and tackle my weight as it's got out of control.

Youngest DC is also looking quite chubby. I'm trying to work out their BMI but everything gives me a weight centile, which don't seem to take into account their height? But their height must be a factor?

If she's obese then more than half of kids her age must be too
^
You're right about this OP.

Well yes, about 40 per cent of 10 year olds are overweight or obese. So yes, she would likely look similar to almost half of children. And in some communities and areas these figures for being overweight/obese will be higher.

as others have said, because being overweight or obese is so common in young children, it can be hard to recognise it. Healthy weight children are often considered skinny, when they aren’t really.

I hope you can find a way to help her, without damaging her confidence

Similar sort of thing but a bit different, but I did some training at work recently which suggested the reason for girls starting puberty earlier is due to us having heavier children. They also mentioned what you said about higher calorie intake = growth spurts.

It makes total sense really.

They were talking about 9 year olds starting their period. It's really so sad. Can't imagine how distressing that would be for a 9 year old. Never mind her having to deal with the practicalities at school etc.

I will be taking her to the GP, hopefully to confirm she's not as overweight as those calculators suggest.

My only worry before I worked out her centiles was her waist seems to have expanded quite a lot recently. But I thought it was healthy for kids her age to have some belly.

Healthy to have some belly? It’s not healthy at any age to have some belly. For reference my 8 year old weighs 25kg, just under 4 stone and does not look skinny at all!

I really don't want to post photos of her.

She has quite a prominent belly outline through her tops that she didn't have a few months ago, and I've noticed she either puts the waistband of leggings etc under her belly or she has a mark around it by the end of the day. She otherwise looks healthy.

@ElspethTascioni how tall is your 8 year old though?

You don't need to go to the GP to confirm your daughter is overweight, at 7st and 8 years old she most definitely is, regardless of her height. The PP that mentioned overweight children starting puberty earlier is not wrong, I've read that too.

For context my 13 year old son, who is over 20cm taller than her is the same weight, 44kg, weighed last month at the hospital for a prescription. He's as tall but looks leaner than most of his peers but not super skinny.

I've done the nhs charts ds too and they used to worry me as it said he was over 98%, but he is very tall for his age like your dd. Ds is almost 10, is 5'3" and weights 7st 12lbs. I put this along with his dob on the bmi checker and it said he was very overweight. When I changed his age to 11 just out of curiosity but kept the other measurements the same it said he was a healthy weight!

here's your answer - muscle mass is much denser than fat. So two children of the same height and weight the one with the high proportion of muscle mass will look very different than the one with the high proportion of body fat.

Averaging a couple of hours of exercise a day is way way more than the average kid.

I've just watched some of the videos her dance school post to their fb group and I was quite shocked actually. She has some noticeable belly wobble going on compared to the other girls and she looks much more puffed out 😳

OP you need to see a health professional her than listen to people on MN. She does sound heavy but the GP will be used to comparing children and will be able to get a better overall picture of her build etc. You can discuss her activity levels and diet and they can (hopefully) make suggestions for you.

It can be very difficult with children of this age. My own DD became slightly overweight at a little older and it's a fine line to tread as they start to become more conscious of their bodies. I suffered from anorexia as a teen so the last thing I wanted was to make a big issue about weight. I would recommend professional advice.

I agree to see a GP for a well check.
If her weight is raised as an issue ask for a body composition test.
There is such a thing as muscle mass throwing off BMI calculations even in child/teen athletes. Body composition measurements (body fat and lean muscle mass) in addition to height-for-weight for age measurements can be much more useful in determining whether a child/teen is overweight or not.
Your child sounds quite active tbh, and so the BMI tool will not be as accurate.
Children also tend to grow out before they grow up and 8 is often the start of the puberty growth spurt in girls.

My daughter is 9 and 140cm. In age 9-10 clothes and was 4st 5lb last time she was weighed which was a couple of months ago so she could be more now as has gotten a bit taller.

She dances a lot too. Has the figure of a dancer, long arms and legs. But in no way skinny or bony looking.

So I definitely think a GP visit wouldn't be a bad idea.

It is not a good idea to post a picture. Firstly because this is an 8yo, and secondly because the last thing OP needs is people fluffing her that her DD "looks fine" and "it's probably muscle". An 8yo is not carrying 3 stone of extra muscle from routine extracurriculars.

OP, see a GP.

This is not necessarily the answer muscle mass does not fit right with a bit if a belly. My DS is 12 swims competitively and trains over 13 hours a week despite having big shoulders and the start of some impressive pecs and abs he is skin and bone. If an 8 year olds BMI was down to muscle mass rather than fat you would be able to tell by looking at them and that doesn't seem to fit with OPs description.

A bit of belly and high muscle mass does fit for girls.
Females naturally have around 50% more body fat than males without being overweight, even from age 3, so long before puberty.
No you cannot tell by looking.

3 Stone? I think that’s a typo. The DD is only 1.5 stone above an ideal weight for her height by the BMI chart. It’s quite possible she has good muscle mass contributing to that as she is physically active 6x a week. I agree with & have said best to see a GP to discuss and a body composition test is usually more accurate to determine if overweight or obese.

Fair enough I don't know as much about girls as boys despite being one. However I still think this comment from OP in particular points at maybe the problem not being totally solved by ascribing it to muscle mass.

I've just watched some of the videos her dance school post to their fb group and I was quite shocked actually. She has some noticeable belly wobble going on compared to the other girls and she looks much more puffed out 😳

Anyway a load of strangers on the Internet are not going to be able to accurately determine anything so a health professionals opinion is probably worth seeking.

This simply cannot be true for DCs. That amount of bulking out of muscle that puts the super-fit/muscle-y into the 'overweight' category doesn't happen until much later (as witnessed in the youngest apprentices at work who lived at the gym and would try anything to add that level of muscle mass). My 8yo is solid muscle - you can see definition in her arms and legs, she has a six pack (visible until she's had breakfast at least!), and she can do chin ups and 10 or so vertical sit ups without rest. When she was weighed at the doctors a couple of months ago she was 25.5kg. By your logic she should weigh much more than than. She is shorter than OP's DC, but not 45% smaller, and nor would adding a very small layer of 'insulation' make up that difference.

OP my friend's DD is 8yo and a similar height to your DD. My friend recently expressed her concern to me that her DD was overweight and told me she is currently 5 1/2 stone. She is definitely overweight, you can see it to look at her. Your DC is considerably heavier.
I agree with a PP that although she does many hours of exercise, it may not all be that vigorous (certainly if the swimming lesson is a standard AquaEd one rather than a swim club's training session, there will be an awful lot of waiting around for your turn). Equally you can be fit but still very overweight.

I agree it cannot all be ascribed to muscle mass, but some of it likely is.
Body composition test at a GPs will better inform how much excess weight she is actually carrying.
Generally with children, they don’t do weight loss but adjust diet so their BMI drops as they grow. If the diet ends up being too low calorie & nutrient wise, it can be harmful to an athletic child- ie risk low bone density & then osteoporosis in older age.

So, yes need a medical professional to do an individual assessment.

This is true though.
I've been teaching years and I can see that children are just getting bigger and bigger and the parents just don't see it.

I've currently two children in my class significantly overweight, the mum thinks it's just a bit of puppy fat and hormones. Bollocks is it.

For context my youngest is 5ft4 and weighs under 7 stone. She does not look underweight, your daughter is significantly shorter and weighs more.

I think many are now not sure what a good weight should look like.

The centile doesn't fully match BMI, because there may be a higher percentage who are very overweight than who are tall. If you look at charts for her height and how that matches average age, you can see what a standard weight would be at that height. It doesn't work for under 5s, nor once puberty hits, but at your DD's age it might help you to visualise better. So a 50% 10yo is 141cm and 31kg, which is 4 stone 12. Your DD is more than 2 stone over this weight, 40% over it. Although the centiles match, because that's very high it means she's very overweight.

So basically you can't use the centile charts if their height is into the top centiles? Or you can, but their weight needs to be a lower centile?

I am going to get her a GP appointment. I've realised this morning she can't zip her winter coat up over her belly which was a bit 😳

What size clothes is she in?

As many other previous posters have said, she is very overweight and there should be no belly or rolls of fat on a healthy weight 8 year old.

As others have also said, our perception is skewed due to so many children being overweight, and also if parents themselves are overweight, this skews perception even more.

Anything above 91st centile will be overweight. You can't refine to "how overweight" without switching to a BMI measurement. GP input might help; the main thing will be stopping her weight from going up any more for a few years.