To take children on term time holiday?

MiniBeesMum · 2022-11-03T21:35:35+00:00

We're a military family and got some news that DH would have to be away for 6 months including Christmas. We've been lucky as it's the first time for us to lose Christmas. The last couple of years have been rough as DD12 had been unwell (she could have died) and DS10 has unrelated health issues. When we got the news we booked a long weekend away just before he leaves to have a "Christmas" treat. Then DS broke his ankle in an accident at school and was off for a couple of days. Then he caught Covid and missed 4 more days... for the first time ever his attendance is in the toilet and we got a threatening letter from school about it. Academically he's OK, has SEND so struggles a little at times in 1 area but is otherwise quite sharp. The issue is that we're going to take him out for 2 days from the monitoring period. Has anyone experienced this? I don't care about the fine. The reason it's a term time trip is because we're losing Christmas so while I don't want a fine, I also don't care about it. My kids need this before DH leaves. Should I cancel? I don't know if I'm going to end up in court.

Butteredtoast55 · 03/11/2022 21:43

The best thing you could do is request it as leave of absence with a covering letter to explain why this is an exceptional circumstance. It might even be worth speaking to the school directly. Heads may authorise leave in exceptional circumstances and it sounds like this is a suitable reason to do so.
If it's declined, you could go anyway and take the fine that may be incurred.

DamnUserName21 · 03/11/2022 21:49

Do not cancel.
Your son is 10! He has loads of time to make up the two days of work that he'll miss. Spending time with his father is more important, IMO.
Your school sounds OTT, to be frank. Your son has had hardly any time off and what time he's had has been very justifiable. I also didn't think they could count having covid in the absence numbers.
Submit a request. If vetoed, go anyway!

Mummbles · 03/11/2022 21:52

Request it, find out what he's supposed to be doing on those days and ask for resources to cover it, in the rare event the school give resources make DS do them one weekend, in the likely event the school don't give resources then spend five minutes online finding some and getting him to do them. Expect you may be fined but it's less likely with this strategy and your DS won't be behind and you'll look like an engaged parent who cares about education (which is what the monitoring wants to check far more than actual absence).

balalake · 03/11/2022 21:55

Request it, this seems to be one of the few grounds to ask for exceptional circumstances.

CSR721 · 03/11/2022 21:57

You are absolutely not being unreasonable at all and I really feel for you. However because of his attendance so far I would be wary. It won't be in the control of the school anymore, and there's a risk you could end up in meetings with the council attendance officer or being asked to go to court. I'm not 100% sure of the process as I'm only a class teacher and not overly involved in attendance processes but I know from being a safeguarding lead that at a certain point it becomes not up to the school. I'd look into it x x

CSR721 · 03/11/2022 21:59

Although saying that from what you've said, it doesn't sound to me like his absence is low enough to warrant attendance intervention, he's only been off for essentially a week! It would normally be after prolonged or regular absence that this would happen.

Iwritethissittinginthekitchensink · 03/11/2022 22:01

Why have school sent a threatening letter when he’s been off sick for 6 days for a broken ankle and covid?

how come he was only off for a couple of days with a broken ankle?

Why are you not livid at school for sending you a threatening letter regarding 6 days off for genuine sick reasons, one of which happened on their watch? That’s crazy. I’d be complaining.

cestlavielife · 03/11/2022 22:03

Talk to the school.explain
Be hinest
The letters maybe be automatic

iamaswashbuckler · 03/11/2022 22:04

As your spouse/children's father is in the military you should absolutely request this. I have just taken my 9 year old out of school for 4 days so we could fly out and see his dad who is serving away. I'm really glad I did as we found out when we were there that his trip is likely to be extended so he will miss Christmas at home again this year. Out of his 9 years since he was born his dad will have been away for 4 of them if he is not hime this year - it's shitty for kids, we had lots of tears at the airport as we came home :-(

Original poster

MiniBeesMum · 04/11/2022 05:25

Iwritethissittinginthekitchensink · 03/11/2022 22:01

Why have school sent a threatening letter when he’s been off sick for 6 days for a broken ankle and covid?

how come he was only off for a couple of days with a broken ankle?

Why are you not livid at school for sending you a threatening letter regarding 6 days off for genuine sick reasons, one of which happened on their watch? That’s crazy. I’d be complaining.

I am livid I promise. The fracture was also down what may be questionable practices in the school which caused the accident but I may be wrong. He was only off for a few days as he could get around OK and pain was manageable.

I just lack the energy to get into another argument with school. I'm genuinely worried as I've never taken them out of school before.

OP posts:

Original poster

MiniBeesMum · 04/11/2022 05:34

Sorry to drip feed but all holiday requests are declined as a matter of policy.

I read the criteria for causing a fine under the 1996 Education act and its basically, 10 days off out of 12 weeks if you've also had a formal response from the local authority but if its a holiday it's 5 days out of 12 weeks and no formal response in advance required.

I guess I've gotten myself into such a flap as I'm worried I'll be taken to court which frankly I won't cope with. I'm a bundle of anxiety since DD's illness which has left me traumatised.

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Mumofsend · 04/11/2022 05:37

I would go. The letter will be automatic, this early in the year absences always look worse on their percentage but I absolutely would go ahead with the trip.

Mumofsend · 04/11/2022 05:38

MiniBeesMum · 04/11/2022 05:34

Sorry to drip feed but all holiday requests are declined as a matter of policy.

I read the criteria for causing a fine under the 1996 Education act and its basically, 10 days off out of 12 weeks if you've also had a formal response from the local authority but if its a holiday it's 5 days out of 12 weeks and no formal response in advance required.

I guess I've gotten myself into such a flap as I'm worried I'll be taken to court which frankly I won't cope with. I'm a bundle of anxiety since DD's illness which has left me traumatised.

It is 10 unauthorised absences, not 10 in general. Covid and ankle should both be authorised

Original poster

MiniBeesMum · 04/11/2022 05:39

iamaswashbuckler · 03/11/2022 22:04

As your spouse/children's father is in the military you should absolutely request this. I have just taken my 9 year old out of school for 4 days so we could fly out and see his dad who is serving away. I'm really glad I did as we found out when we were there that his trip is likely to be extended so he will miss Christmas at home again this year. Out of his 9 years since he was born his dad will have been away for 4 of them if he is not hime this year - it's shitty for kids, we had lots of tears at the airport as we came home :-(

That is so rough. That's a lot of Christmas' away 😔 we've been extremely lucky as DH has never missed a Christmas. I know that we will make it special for the kids but this has left such a sour taste.

Did the school grant permission? Ours declines all requests to remove them for a holiday.

OP posts:

Original poster

MiniBeesMum · 04/11/2022 05:46

Oh my goodness! You are right! I missed that detail. All his previous absence was authorised. And the fine for holidays is triggered at 5 days. I honestly feel so much better.

Thank you so much for pointing this out.

OP posts:

Tamuchly · 04/11/2022 05:50

Request it as a special one-off circumstance, even if they decline you can still be off but they know where he is! Regarding the absences, they should be noted as medical particularly as one of the incidences happened during school time and, as such, should be authorised. If you are worried please contact your local authorities Children Missing Education department who will explain how and when they get involved - I feel sure it’s not for situations like yours!
Enjoy your holiday.

KitchenSupper · 04/11/2022 05:55

Do you have to mention the holiday? What if you request time off to spend with father before his long absence. Where that time is spent is less relevant.

SpookySally · 04/11/2022 06:06

It’s only 2 days, just phone him in sick. If you say he’s had diarrhoea and vomiting he can’t go in for 48 hours anyway.

unicornsinspace · 04/11/2022 06:15

We are a military family and having a weeks holiday in term time. We just emailed the head saying it's the only time my husband can get off work and it actually states on the gov website military children can be taken out of school due to deployment.

AllThatFancyPaintsAsFair · 04/11/2022 06:19

KitchenSupper · 04/11/2022 05:55

Do you have to mention the holiday? What if you request time off to spend with father before his long absence. Where that time is spent is less relevant.

You don't request time off, they can't stop anyone going on holiday, you aren't asking for permission

You tell the school why you the children won't be there and go on the holiday. They will fine or they won't depending on the specific circumstances

In this case it seems unlikely but no one is going to end up in court over it.

Christmaslover2022 · 04/11/2022 06:21

I think this is an exceptional circumstance, I'd write to the school to ask them to authorise it. But do go anyway!

I'm with you though, it's all getting a bit ridiculous. We sat down to parents evening last month and the teacher said oh the absence rate is not good enough, its only 95% since September. My daughter had 1 day off! Which was actually caused by the school! I was very annoyed they felt the need to bring this up tbh...

AlbaDT · 04/11/2022 06:21

It’s 5 unauthorised days in a term. Sickness isn’t unauthorised. There’s no way you should be on a monitoring period for a broken ankle and Covid - these would both be authorised absences. We would authorise your holiday in these circumstances too, with being a military family and it only being a couple of days. This is my job.

spanieleyes · 04/11/2022 06:22

Schools now have to fine for what is classed as " persistent absence" ie for attendance below 90%- whether authorised or not! I've got a local authority meeting this morning supporting schools in writing their new absence policies because of all the changes we now have to incorporate!

Read through the new "Working together to improve attendance" document, it's a nightmare!

Strictly1 · 04/11/2022 06:24

Mummbles · 03/11/2022 21:52

Request it, find out what he's supposed to be doing on those days and ask for resources to cover it, in the rare event the school give resources make DS do them one weekend, in the likely event the school don't give resources then spend five minutes online finding some and getting him to do them. Expect you may be fined but it's less likely with this strategy and your DS won't be behind and you'll look like an engaged parent who cares about education (which is what the monitoring wants to check far more than actual absence).

We do not give resources when parents take their children out of school for a holiday. It takes time to prepare and they are rarely completed. You choose to take your children out - your choice - so your child will miss out on schooling. It is not fair on teachers to ask them to then create a pack.

Strictly1 · 04/11/2022 06:33

The pressure on schools for attendance now are silly. We have to prove that we have written to all parents whose child’s attendance is low. I agree, they’ve only been back a short while so it may feel a waste of time but I also think we have a duty to keep parents informed. I have lots who will keep them home as they’re feeling a bit off. We usually know who are genuine and who is fussing. It is hard for both sides - school and parents.
I’d be honest with the school. I would push the military element as there is some discretion but I also know some HT who have been in trouble for authorising so it may still be a no. I tend to push it a bit if I know it’s due to SEN or military.