The state pension is HOW MUCH???

[BeatieBourke]

Call me stupid (fair) but I've just realised how much the state pension is. £800 odd a month (£185.15pw).

As a non-means tested benefit. For EVERYONE.

I'm generally of the opinion that benefits are too low and too punitive. I usually advocate for universalism. I understand that people have worked their whole lives and paid in, and deserve a retirement. And that having pensioners in poverty does no favours to the economy or other welfare services.

But £800 a month / £9k a year for EVERYONE?? So a widower in rented accommodation with no other income or savings, £800pm. A wealthy 68 year old who's earned a 6 figure salary, has a huge property portfolio and investments coming out of their ears that pay a fortune out in dividends, £800pm. Seriously?

I understand that no party, least of all the Tories (because tory voters as a population are older) will ever go after pensions because it would be unpopular (and older people vote more generally). But in a time when the country is supposedly facing a financial "black hole" and everything else has already been cut to the bone for the last 12 years, why the hell are we paying out state benefits to millionaires?

Maybe if pensions were means tested (with a fairly high and tapering threshold) there'd be enough to pay pensions for women at 65, and more for people who haven't built up huge assets, can't afford to live, heat their homes or eat a hot meal every day in their later years. I can see the (cynical) political sense in it, but no economic sense whatsoever.

AIBU?

it doesn’t work like that. If we give 10% of government expenditure in state pensions, it’s not available any more to pay for the nhs or give to working age people. « Just give everyone more » is a silly thing to say, especially when we have a huge hole in our public finances.

as I said, thé fairest thing to do is to cut pensions to those who don’t need them. But it’s politically difficult, especially for the tories.

Exactly - I am really sick of people using this "thing a is shit, so everything should be shit" race to the bottom "logic".

YABU. People get the state pension through their NI stamps or by claiming Child benefit. Why should someone work hard their whole life and not receive back anything that they’ve paid in? Even more of a slap in the face when you consider that there are some people who have literally never paid in a penny and are still getting it. These people on ‘6 figure salaries’ have worked bloody hard to get to where they are. They deserve the extra top up of the state pension to reflect their hard work and previous contribution towards earlier pensioners who were old when they were young.

Doh! Sorry, yes - per week!!

I'm in the same boat - and not a millionaire either 😕

Don't worry, after the much smaller Gen X and Y spent all our lives paying to support boomers they'll bin it just before we get to receive it. Or we'll die first.

See above. Where does all the money come from? If the money is going to rich pensioners it’s not going to somewhere else it’s desperately needed.

One third of younger people they think will live to a 100. You will all live much longer than us.

I think this is likely. It’s pretty rubbish for the younger generation - paid for boomers pension and debt then don’t get them themselves. But as I said, they are not affordable in the long term.

So you mean the people who have actually paid for it for all their lives shouldn't get it?

One third of younger people they think will live to a 100. You will all live much longer than us

I doubt it, not if the Tories continue to have their way. Life expectancy has started to go backwards.

Yeah we definitely need to prioritise those on six figure salaries for government handouts….

I think it should be means tested. No one is paying for their state pension in advance. It’s paid for by current taxpayers.

Mspincher - yes but i've paid a vast amount of NI over the last 40 years (as well as bring up 3 kids) with the expectation i will get a pension when i retire. Why should i lose out just cause i've saved and worked hard; whereas a sponger who has never saved gets the full pension?

These 'boomers' you have so much vitriol for have also paid NI etc in their working lives. Why so much hate for them and those who have achieved high paying jobs?

I am retired and I can assure you my state pension is NOT that much. This is due to the fact I am being paid under the OLD system, which actually worked out better for me, than the NEW system.
This is because I have a couple of small private pensions which had 'contracted out'. ie I don't get the SERPS bit of the state pension (under the old system). This is being phased out under the new system.
Also remember that even the state pension is TAXABLE. However, as the state pension is less than the personal allowance there is not the means to deduct tax at source. It means my other small pensions have the tax code adjusted to take the state pension into account.
To qualify fot the state pension, you have had to pay NI for a number of years, so remember that rich people will have paid a Higher NI rate, even though they are only get the standard state pension back. However, I would fully expect rich people to have additional income or pension elsewhere.

The answer to this is to campaign for better working age benefits and support (including affordable childcare provision to support people into work). Not to remove what pensioners have.

That’s why it seems like other countries have got more generous pensions to the U.K. It’s because the government and personal pension pots are mixed up together, making it seem bigger. I was reading about it just the other day.

You know you can influence government decisions by voting, yes? Don't vote for any government that wants to get rid of pensions.

I certainly don't intend to.

As I said, thé fairest thing to do is to cut pensions to those who don’t need them

First you are going to have to define 'need,' and that's one of those very tricky subjective judgements. Then, of course, you've opened the way to saying 'well, you can afford private healthcare, no NHS treatment for you.' Or 'you can afford private schooling, no state schools for you.' Effectively, you're on the way to ultimately dismantling the basis of the welfare state. And who gets to decide this 'need'?

It's not a benefit. We pay into the pension pot via National Insurance, so you absolutely should be entitled to a state pension if you've been doing that.

THIS!!
I am a floating voter, basically a centrist. I will campaign against any party that suggests doing this.

@TheNosehasit , that is not what @Ilovetocrochet meant.

Her 'full qualifying years' state pension (at least 35 years of NI) is reduced to £143.00 per week because the teachers' pension scheme was contracted out of SERPS.

People who were contracted out of SERPS (a large majority, often without fully understanding the implications) receive a reduced state pension because a portion of their NI contributions was diverted into their employer scheme. So any supposed 'shortfall' in their state pension is not in fact a shortfall as it was invested in their private pension.

Except it's not that simple either - using your logic, pensions or benefits exist in some kind of vacuum where they disappear from the world. That's obviously not true. Shifting priorities to give decent incomes to benefit and pension recipients can benefit everyone if it's spent locally - where it attracts VAT and other taxes and supports employment. Means testing isn't cost effective for pensions on the whole as a PP pointed out.

I lost out. The NI put into my private pension means I lose more state pension than any gain from it. I would have opted not to be contracted out if this had been an option. It wasnt.