Do the aristocracy have staff?

[Mamarsupial]

Just been watching the original 70s series of Upstairs Downstairs.

Obviously the world has changed, but there are still a few old aristocratic families (and a lot of ultra-rich in new money as well). I imagine they have staff- but what sort of staff? I’m guessing not parlour and scullery maids - but then, surely somebody does their laundry? Who?
What about butlers? Do they live in? How do they address their employers?
So many questions! Does anyone know?

@Meadowbreeze it’s quite difficult to explain and varies massively! It involves writing all sort of legal agreements from tenancy agreements to wayleave agreements to Farm Business Tenancies. You have to manage the farms with a real understanding of agriculture, field sports and forestry to manage all of the land, manage all the staff, succession plan for tax, run all the budgets, you have to be a chartered surveyor generally so you know about buildings maintenance to manage all of the in house and let property, manage historic assets, buildings and antiques, planning, apply for subsidy schemes, run tourist attractions, diversify the assets with things like events, tea rooms or I’ve done things before like growing willow for cricket bats!

Its an incredibly interesting job, I’d recommend it to anybody!

@fyn wow! That sounds incredible but also quite full on. I hope you get paid a lot!

@fyn I also hope you are well paid! For that much responsibility in the City you’d be expected to be paid well over £130k!

That's amazing, Fyn.

My estate manager ancestors were often described as "grieve", "land grieve" or "estate overseer" but "forester" pops up fairly often too – one of the estates had its own timber mill. Hard to tell whether they've changed role between record dates, or it's just the way they happened to be described on the day.

Of course for one of them, c1820, his promotion from garden labourer to grieve may have been aided by his complicity in a dark family secret. Our hero's employer killed a neighbouring landower in a duel and was tried for murder. The employer got off – official story being that both parties honourably attempted to miss, and the fatal shot was an unfortunate accident. But an anonymous newspaper article decades later, citing as eyewitness an unnamed gamekeeper – by now elderly – told a rather less heroic tale.

From other evidence it looks a lot like the anonymous gamekeeper was... the son of the grieve.

I watched the programme on ITV and felt sorry for them, imagine living in a huge mansion but placing buckets to catch the leaks or not being able to afford to heat it. Poor Princess Olga has to maintain the whole castle thing by herself 😕

Was that the one where she was hiring a gardener and the lad who turned up was anti fox hunting?

@LeMoo no, I don't recall that. She did the garden all by herself as she couldn't afford anyone.

I just finished the ITV aristo show and one thing that struck me was that their (lovely big) kitchen worktops were all piled high with stuff, photos on all of the cupboard doors etc. A cleaner wouldn't be able to get near. Is there a correlation between old money and hoarding?

i would say there’s definitely a correlation between social class and the fetishisation of ‘clutter-free’, clear surfaces, and that it’s primarily a lower-middle-class thing.

The most wealthy titled friend we have lives in splendid isolation with a clutter free life apart from the paintings. People have odd ideas, not everyone wants to fill their homes with inherited furnishings and mismatched sofas. The zen of peaceful living reaches across all cultures and class in my experience.

I’d love to have my own driver.

This is a good podcast by the Dushess of Rutland, who was a farmers daughter who married a duke. In each episode she talks to a different Duchess about how they run their estates, how much it costs and loads if trivia and history. Good for deciding where to visit if you like thst sort of thing.

www.duchessthepodcast.com/

@Lincslady53 thank you for sharing, I started it and it's very interesting.

I know an aristocratic family but they do not have staff. They're very down to earth, and I would not have known that they were from one but dh found out that the father was a viscount.

We've been to their house a few times, but it's not exactly Downton Abbey.

Exactly - my grandparents did. Now replaced by labour saving appliances

We live in a midterrace standard Victorian house and there was a tiny tiny 'box room' that was originally (we assume and based on the census records) was the room for the housemaid. When DH bought the house it actually was a tiny room and had a single bed stuffed in it. He turned it into a loo and I often think how on EARTH did they fit anyone in it!

There was a time when even middle class people had servants, a cook/housekeeper, maid and gardener

It used to be very common to have 'servants', you didn't need to be wealthy, wages were incredibly cheap, if you could spare some space and some food and needed labour, that's all it took. You could also get rid of people on a wim, so it's not as if anyone had to put a lot of thought in it. For those who had no security in life it could be a way to find shelter and sustenance and even a way into a trade. If all went well as a house servant you could save money and survive modestly in your old age.