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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask about unvaxxed niece and nephew visiting newborn?

51 replies

Palmface · 27/10/2022 23:42

I'm due to have a baby in the next week or so, and it's just occurred to me that my niece and nephew (15 and 13yo) are not vaccinated for most things. They didn't have any of the routine schedule as their mum is strongly antivax, but now that my db and her are divorced and db has sole custody, he is slowly looking into them catching up. They have had their covid jabs but that's it, nothing else yet. So there really isn't time to get them vaccinated before baby comes.

Is it risky to have them come and cuddle the baby etc when they haven't been vaccinated? I'm thinking of the ones like measles mumps and rubella where we rely on herd immunity for the early stages of baby's life.

Yabu - let them come
Yanbu - it's too risky

OP posts:
angelikacpickles · 27/10/2022 23:45

Have they had measles, mumps or rubella, given that they haven't been vaccinated for them? They may have natural immunity.

The chances of them having one of these illnesses when they come to see you is very small (unless there is a known outbreak in the area).

SpookyMcGhoul · 27/10/2022 23:47

Unless there's a current outbreak they're unlikely to bring MM or R around with them, they might have natural immunity? It'll take ages for them to get all caught up if your DB is doing that, how long would you want to keep them away for?

Honestly I think if you take sensible precautions, wash hands, don't come around if sick, don't kiss the baby etc it should be fine 😊

Spicypumpkins · 27/10/2022 23:49

Yanbu to be concerned. Maybe chat to your health visitor about it?

id probably wait until baby was a bit older and had first set of injections just to make myself feel better even if the risk was low. I’d also make sure they do lateral flow tests before coming to make sure they haven’t got covid. There are quite a few nasty bugs and viruses around right now, not just covid but it is out there.

if the mum has a problem then tough….just because she’s happy to risk her children doesn’t mean you should be too and babies are so vulnerable.

Tigofigo · 27/10/2022 23:49

You'll still be relying on herd immunity, as most people have had their vaccines.

I'd only be concerned if there was a measles outbreak in their area tbh.

Also newborns I'm sure have some inherited immunity from their mum for a period of time?

I imagine you'd be more at risk with a vaccinated 3yo giving them a horrible cold or chicken pox.

RainbowSlide · 27/10/2022 23:49

angelikacpickles · 27/10/2022 23:45

Have they had measles, mumps or rubella, given that they haven't been vaccinated for them? They may have natural immunity.

The chances of them having one of these illnesses when they come to see you is very small (unless there is a known outbreak in the area).

Good question, sorry I didn't think to mention.

No, they haven't had any of the things they'd normally have been vaccinated for. They'd have to stay home from school if one of the students had come down with anything nasty like whooping cough or measles, so not sure if that's helped them to avoid it.

Dotcheck · 27/10/2022 23:49

I’m sure it will be fine. You won’t know the vaccination status of everyone your baby will come in contact with

RainbowSlide · 27/10/2022 23:52

Ok so the question to ask is whether there are any local outbreaks where they are (an hour away in a city), which is likely to be no, and then take normal precautions like hand washing.

Their dm isn't in the picture and I'm pretty sure she doesn't care a jot about our baby so she can do one!

Also where i am chicken pox is on the vaccination schedule too.

Cw112 · 27/10/2022 23:56

I'd ask your health visitor or midwife or even gp so you have clear info before baby comes. Yanbu and it's a really good question especially when your baby will be so so little when they potentially meet.

RainbowSlide · 27/10/2022 23:59

Cw112 · 27/10/2022 23:56

I'd ask your health visitor or midwife or even gp so you have clear info before baby comes. Yanbu and it's a really good question especially when your baby will be so so little when they potentially meet.

Thanks for this. I'll get some more info.

Also, I know they'll want to get really close to the baby, cuddles etc, so it's a bit different to not knowing the vax status of everyone the baby encounters in daily life.

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 27/10/2022 23:59

I’m confused now - is @Palmface the OP or is it @RainbowSlide ?!

Quveas · 28/10/2022 00:00

Assuming that you are breast feeding, there are huge protections gained on an ongoing basis from the mother, on top of immunities that are present from genetics. Unless there is a clear and presnt risk at this time, your baby will encounter all these conditions and more the minute it "steps" into the world. It will build strength from encountering them.

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/10/2022 00:02

Your niece and nephew could still get covid/transfer covid even if they are vaccinated.

Them being unvaccinated is not going to increase any covid risks for your baby.

Not advocating being unvaccinated by the way!

Flittingaboutagain · 28/10/2022 00:17

I'd let them come but keep the room ventilated, not hold baby or get too close and explain newborns have no immunity until min 8 week jabs.

Lovemylittlebear · 28/10/2022 00:23

I would only be concerned if mumps, measles or whooping cough outbreak in area.

personally I would be more worried about chest infections, RSV and colds etc. I would just make it clear that I wouldn’t want anyone to visit who wasn’t ‘well’ or had signs of a cold whilst baby so tiny. Those that hold the baby wash their hands first and don’t kiss babies face. X

Quveas · 28/10/2022 00:26

Flittingaboutagain · 28/10/2022 00:17

I'd let them come but keep the room ventilated, not hold baby or get too close and explain newborns have no immunity until min 8 week jabs.

This is simply not true - www.nhs.uk/common-health-questions/childrens-health/how-long-do-babies-carry-their-mothers-immunity/

Babies have passive immunity from their mother. That lasts for a minimum of several weeks even if not breastfed. Newborns with no immunity would be very sick babies from the get-go.

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 28/10/2022 00:35

Flittingaboutagain · 28/10/2022 00:17

I'd let them come but keep the room ventilated, not hold baby or get too close and explain newborns have no immunity until min 8 week jabs.

What tosh. Do you think that nobody ever got any immunity pre-vaccines

SD1978 · 28/10/2022 00:50

If they haven't had the whooping cough vaccine I would not be allowing them to come round. At the absolute minimum. Would also prefer the MMR to at least have been started.

Quveas · 28/10/2022 00:54

SD1978 · 28/10/2022 00:50

If they haven't had the whooping cough vaccine I would not be allowing them to come round. At the absolute minimum. Would also prefer the MMR to at least have been started.

MMR isn't given until the first birthday. Are you genuinely suggesting babies see nobody until they are more than a year old? Whooping cough is two months - you expect nobody to want to meet the baby for two months?

If babies were as fragile as you are suggesting then we'd have died out thousands of years ago.

Grapewrath · 28/10/2022 01:37

The baby will have some passive immunity. In terms of M Mir R I’d not be overly concerned unless there was a local outbreak. Tbh kids carry all sorts if illnesss we don’t vaccinate against such as chicken pox, hand foot and mouth etc etc and we don’t keep them away from newborns. I personally wouldn’t worry.

deeperthanallroses · 28/10/2022 01:56

Quveas · 28/10/2022 00:00

Assuming that you are breast feeding, there are huge protections gained on an ongoing basis from the mother, on top of immunities that are present from genetics. Unless there is a clear and presnt risk at this time, your baby will encounter all these conditions and more the minute it "steps" into the world. It will build strength from encountering them.

Huh? Newborns do not gain strength from encountering measles. Most parents carefully protect them as much as they can until they are a little older and much more resilient. It takes time to build an immune system and the very reason we vaccinate is because these diseases are dangerous.

London frequently has measles outbreaks, I’d be very cautious until the first round of baby vaccinations at least. You don’t have to apologise for wanting to protect your newborn baby. We were the same around covid.

Quveas · 28/10/2022 07:25

deeperthanallroses · 28/10/2022 01:56

Huh? Newborns do not gain strength from encountering measles. Most parents carefully protect them as much as they can until they are a little older and much more resilient. It takes time to build an immune system and the very reason we vaccinate is because these diseases are dangerous.

London frequently has measles outbreaks, I’d be very cautious until the first round of baby vaccinations at least. You don’t have to apologise for wanting to protect your newborn baby. We were the same around covid.

Show quote history

Nobody has suggested that anyone with measles (or anything else) comes around visiting. We are discussing not allowing healthy people to visit. Unless there is a specific risk, which has not been demonstrated, then babies have been meeting relatives for eons and are not as fragile as you suggest. One of the biggest risks posed to children in recent years were the lockdowns, and the evidence is that children (and actually adults as well) not encountering the wider world led to increased (minor) sickness rates because immune systems were not as robust as one would normally expect. And as I have already demonstrated, babies have passive immunity which has begun their journey to robust immune systems. Vaccinations are simply a more efficient way of teaching the immune system - they do not provide immunity from any disease but rather teach the immune system what to do if they encounter something. Even without vaccination the immune system is constantly building on its knowledge of what it needs to fight against and does the job very well generally because of contact with the world, not in spite of it. And I am pro vaccination so that isn't anti-vaxx rhetoric but scientific fact.

deeperthanallroses · 28/10/2022 11:30

I think you are quibbling about the definition of immunity.

Ihaveamagicwand · 28/10/2022 11:39

Sounds like a good reason to choose to breastfeed OP.

SydneySage · 28/10/2022 12:03

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 27/10/2022 23:59

I’m confused now - is @Palmface the OP or is it @RainbowSlide ?!

its a namechange fail?

CassandraBarrett · 28/10/2022 12:08

Re whooping cough.
I thought the whooping cough vaccine only lasted a year or two anyway? As when I was pregnant with my second child it was on the list to be given again? So anybody over the age of say 2 years past their last whooping cough vaccine no longer counts as immunized (so probably 4 years and up)? Have I totally misunderstood that?

Anyway OP , the fact that they are not vaccinated does not mean that they are carrying any illness. So assuming they're in good health a wash of the hands first should be enough