This may be unpopular - but what about the squeezed middle?

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They are talking about raising taxes on the average person now. Which will really effect lower middle class families who are already feeling the pinch due to increases in cost of food, gas and electic, increasing childcare costs and rent or morgage increases. They are going to increase pensions and benefits with inflation but lots of middle class earners are not having their wages increased with inflation but will now have their taxes increased. What about help for the middle class, especially lower middle class and working class who earn slightly to much to qualify for any help but will now stuggle with all these increases.

Yes I do

But I think lots of people here don't

Hence weird suggestions of raising taxes / cutting pensions from people based on the value of their home rather than waiting and raising inheritance tax

But you see there I managed to extract income from a physical asset ?

We just need to ensure we extract the value form those with the most

So if lots of retired people are not paying income tax it's because they have an income less than the personal allowance

Hardly rich then!

But they could still be asset rich, that's the point.

No, they are going to have to look at automation and technology. This pyramid scheme isn't sustainable there's 7 billion humans on this planet and we are destroying it. Pushing out more humans doesn't solve the problem. Just further kicking the can down the road.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow how much extra tax are you prepared to pay?

Again. Means-tested.
I will add that many people can afford the fees but they expect/prefer cheaper or free NHS dentistry because they don't want to pay for it.

No because you are just creating a pyramid scheme. Everyone gets old including unskilled migrants they will also need health, social care and pensions.

The idea with such immigration isn't to perpetuate the pyramid but to get a softer landing with the decrease in working population happen over a longer time period so tax increases being spread over more people.

So yes the immigrant population will eventually add to their cohort retirements numbers but after decades of paying working people's taxes - making the bump to smaller population less of a huge jump.

However politically it's difficult - different cultures and then as resources for working population a decline schrodinger's immigrants stuff surfaces - immigrates taking all the jobs but same time doing nothing and getting all the benefits - and fact there're needed and mean more workers to pay the tax burden gets ignored.

There is no health advice that will permanently halt ageing. Lifestyle changes can make some difference but ultimately we have an ageing population living to ages that the body simply can’t function at.

@WahineToa £40000 is not that huge a wage nowadays when you have to pay childcare , run a car etc to work
You can be on less and have a more disposable income

bluetongue · Today 08:35
I know this is a parenting site but single, childless people are always left behind. We also were among the worst impacted by lockdown.

totally agree with you. My sister is in her own, I think she gets 12 ish pounds per hour. Not entitled to any help whatsoever? Has to pay a small mortgage, I think 350 pm. Gas/electric, council tax, plus petrol. She travels roughly 30 miles per day. She cries because how skint she is. My dad had to buy her her car, to help her out. An old runaround. It’s a disgrace. The family next door, don’t work, no disabilities. Have 4 kids and live very comfortable. They have way more disposable income than her. This is what the government need to focus on too. The bloody bone idle.

@Worriedddd you do know that global population in most of the west have started to decline. There really aren't loads of countries having loads of dc.

We are all going to be fighting for immigrants!

Because in most cases those at the very top got that through theft , war, generally not being good people

Most of the very rich are direct descendant of William the conqueror cronies

And they tend to be the ones who have wielded significant political powers - so got us in the mess

Why should those with less be expected to pick up the tab for the upper classes greed and mismanagement?

Rather simplifying I know

And in practise I wouldn't bring them down to average - I was just trying to illustrate how many people could have their lives substantially improved if those people were not so outrageously wealthy

But instead the 90% are squabbling amongst themselves

Just as the rich like it

How is automation and technology going to pay taxes to fund 25% of the populations pensions, social care, health care (2043 prediction)?

How will automation and technology look after the elderly and infirm in homes and hospitals?

We still need young people.

We still need young people.

Also how does a society grow & progress without youth?

And will the means testing allow for current inflation, power bills etc? And for the payment of medical fees?

Because the means testing bar is set very low in the country, and the people who are just above it won’t be able to afford it. Or even those who are quite high above it.

so that will mean a significant amount of the population not being able to afford it. And what about those with chronic conditions who need to see go often?

This seems a very vague "explanation" of how it's not a ponzi scheme - and it's a legitimate question about things like housing provision, too - that's Schrodinger's in the sense of them apparently not needing any extra housing, transport etc provision.

@bercan asset rich is just because they live in a house they bought at a sensible price
Most of the issues we have are due to housing costs
Mortgages high and rents high
If we had never allowed the average house to go over 3/4x the average wage we wouldn't have half the issues we do
If peoples rents /mortgages were £300/400 less life would be easier
We allowed house prices to sky rocket , and bTL mortgages

Oh good stuff - you’ve gone one better than my tongue in cheek suggestion.

Let’s tax anyone over a BMI of 25 an extra 20%. And if they can’t work, let’s reduce their benefits proportionately to their weight or alcohol intake

Target, as in with policy education and incentive. Not tax or any other nonsense idea.

@midgetastic you have no idea what your ancestors did or didn't do and its years ago you can't hold a grudge for that long surely
You can't be responsible for what your ancestors done thats just ludicrous

The elderly with their pricy asset (their house) are more helpful to the state when they get too immobile to live independently. Their house pays for their care. If boomers weren’t sitting on so much cash (that they can’t spend on restaurants) they would really break the social care system. and it is broken despite them paying into it by means of income tax and NI their whole lives.

@healthadvice123 I'm not disagreeing, housing inflation has fucked the economy but yet people cheer when their home goes up in value not realising it benefits very few.

Automation could do turns , get people dressed , do feeds and toileting. There's already discussions about this. Yes we might need some young people but we cannot keep just importing people to prop it up, It's not sustainable , migrants also need pensions and healthcare.

The bar needs changing, obviously.
Do you not think they have folks with chronic conditions and low incomes in other countries? Again, we need a social insurance scheme such as Germany and France. The NHS is not fit for purpose.

Wrong. Brexit will cost the country £100 billion a year. It’s the biggest act of economic self harm in the developed world.

www.fourfifty.co.uk/news/business-news/archive/article/2018/November/brexit-deal-will-cost-uk-100-billion-per-year-by-2030-study-suggests

There is no health advice that will permanently halt ageing. Lifestyle changes can make some difference but ultimately we have an ageing population living to ages that the body simply can’t function at.

Aging no, but there is no rule that you have to be really ill and in need of lots of healthcare the moment you turn 60. The body can function well at 82, I’ve seen it plenty of times. My parents are 77 and both still work full time and my mum goes to gym classes. It can’t if you’ve trashed your body though.

Two thirds of our population are overweight or obese. That is not sustainable. You can’t stop people growing old but you can work to help people become more responsible for their own health when they’re young. This includes better menopause care to limit osteoporosis.

Because in most cases those at the very top got that through theft , war, generally not being good people

Most of the very rich are direct descendant of William the conqueror cronies

This is true but you can't target that without IHT changes. People won't vote for it because they think they will loose out when it actually makes it harder for them.