Pensions to rise with inflation - but what about working people???

[doris9034]

BBC Website: "Liz Truss and Chancellor Jeremy Hunt jointly agreed to guarantee that the state pension rises with inflation next year - thereby maintaining the "triple lock" - ahead of PMQs this morning, Downing Street says.
In a huddle with reporters after PMQs, the prime minister's official spokesman said the decision reflected the "unique position" of pensioners who are "unable to increase their earnings through work"

But I - and millions of others - are also unable to "increase our earnings through work" because we are in the middle income bracket, our employers do not have the capacity to raise our earnings in line with inflation and we don't qualify for any state related benefits.

So, whilst I 100% don't begrudge the helping of pensioners (many of whom are probably among the better off anyway), I can't help but feeling a bit annoyed that it always seems to be the ordinary working person / family that never gets any respite from the ever increasing cost of living.

It's the same difference- you pay into the pension fund covering current costs knowing that your pension will in turn get paid

Good grief the jealousy here is horrid

Excellent idea. That gives me another six years. 75 is enough for anyone.

They worked many years and paid their NI contributions why shouldn’t they get a guaranteed pension that doesn’t lose value to inflation? It is still one of the lowest in Europe!

I think the general consensus is that those pensioners trying to survive on state pension alone absolutely should be helped, but those with considerable occupational pensions/assets shouldn’t. So how can that be achieved? I don’t know much about pension credits, I think it’s a ‘top up’? Could something be done through that?

I think we all realise we don’t have enough money as a country to subsidise ‘wealthy’ pensioners, especially not at the expense of current working families trying to make ends meet. But there must be a way to target help to those who just have state pension to rely on.

75 is ok, but I don't want to die in hideous pain, thanks.

@Kabalagala

Stagnant wages, sky high house prices, aging population, declining birth rates. What will be left to fund my retirement?

Oh I wouldn't worry about the last two of those. Blair and Cameron both figured out a simple wheeze based on well established economic principles, consisting of increasing immigration of working age people, in order to increase the ratio of net contributors to the public purse compared to net claimants. This was a godsend to pensioners, who could continue to have the deficit between their reliance on public services (notably the NHS as well as pensions) and their historical and current contributions effectively subsidised by tax-paying workers who had arrived without having had the benefit of a UK-paid childhood and education.

Of course there's the small problem that most of those pensioners then voted for Brexit to get rid of the immigrant workers subsidising them, because they didn't like the colour of their skin . . .

@midgetastic so do you think younger people should see their pension age increasing then?

Good grief the jealousy here is horrid

I think the lack of critical thinking is depressing.

It’s OK, they’ll give us a lethal dose of morphine when the pain gets too much.

YABU. Current state pension is £185 per week.

National minimum wage is £311 if working 35 hours per week.

Fair enough! hope the NHS can afford the vast amounts of morphine needed to kill all us boomers off.

The clue is in the name...it isn't a personal savings pot. It's 'insurance'. You pay in regularly, and when you need a doctor, or a hospital, when you are unable to work because you are too old or too I'll, you are pregnant or you can't find a job, you receive an income.

But in reality what that would mean is everyone over 75 paying for private healthcare to whatever level they can. So while it initially sounds like a draconian but objectively fair and equal solution, in practice it would just create a gigantic further increase in inequality.

Why don't we just put everyone over 67 in a gas chamber and save the younger ones the stress of paying for the pensions. Oh! but the gas would cost too much! so you still wouldn't be happy.
I'm 68 by the way, and not rich with only the state pension.

Of course there's the small problem that most of those pensioners then voted for Brexit to get rid of the immigrant workers subsidising them, because they didn't like the colour of their skin . . .

We actually need more immigrants, look at the labour shortage now but yep not so popular.

Honestly I imagine lots of us are jealous. Living standards are falling. Private pensions are abysmal. House prices are obscene. Social housing near none existent. Wages have been stagnant for decades. The working population is being increasingly squeezed and we're on our way to breaking point.
If pensions can be kept up with inflation, why the fuck can't everything else.

Pensioners also pay tax if total pension income is over £12,571. They paid tax when working and again when claiming pensions they worked for.

But in reality what that would mean is everyone over 75 paying for private healthcare to whatever level they can.

I think it's going this way for all already, I know loads of people who have gone private in the last 2 yrs.
I was told by a GP whilst awaiting test results that if I needed treatment, if possible I should go private. Luckily it was ok. A family friend (who is a boomer) & has been a consultant for decades in a big London hospital has said she has never known it so bad.

@Cuppasoupmonster yes there are a lot of today's pensioners who spent time being SAH mums. There was no paid for child care in those days. I stayed at home until my children went to school, because child care for both of them cost more per hour than I could earn, so working made no economic sense.

Exactly.

And furthermore: you pay tax every month that pays for (among other things) universal credit. You may one day have to make a claim on it, you may not. Just like pensions, depending on whether you live long enough.

It is interesting this question of which areas of public spending are perceived as "handouts" (there being a pejorative tinge to that with an underlying assumption that the recipient really should have worked harder to not need them) and which as natural entitlements. Most of it comes down to rhetoric and brainwashing, not logic.

Yes but most pensioners don't have young children to financially support/childcare costs, don't have work uniform/convenience foods/commuting costs to pay like workers do, aren't forced to live in expensive cities where a lot of jobs are, and aren't paying mortgage costs/rent. Working age population typically have more costs.

If pensions can be kept up with inflation, why the fuck can't everything else.

Nothing else really needs to be said.

It is interesting this question of which areas of public spending are perceived as "handouts" (there being a pejorative tinge to that with an underlying assumption that the recipient really should have worked harder to not need them) and which as natural entitlements. Most of it comes down to rhetoric and brainwashing, not logic.

Like I said lack of critical thinking

No, what broke the contract , and it applies to the NHS as well as to pensions, is the fact that we live longer because we are generally healthier and that there are more (expensive)ways to keep us alive when we do get old and sick than there were when the welfare state and NHS was dreamed up. Back then the average age of death for working men was barely 60, so fewer people made long term claims on the NHS and fewer people ever claimed their full pension. This was quite cynically built into the system, the early quick deaths of a great many people meant the balance sheet added up.

Now we have different working lives, many people start their working lives later, they may dip in and out of full time employment, demographically we have an older population who live and claim their pensions for longer. It is an ageing population and families are smaller, so the working population is shrinking in number, but in addition in many places traditional industries have disappeared so that in some areas well paid employment opportunities are greatly reduced. All in all it means the figures don’t balance.

I stayed at home until my children went to school, because child care for both of them cost more per hour than I could earn, so working made no economic sense.

You know this is still a thing?

@LibrariesGiveUsPower I’m not sure I understand your post? Do you think pensioners should be getting the same as someone working a full week on NMW? Even though pensioners (typically) don’t have young children to support, commuting costs, mortgages etc to pay? My occupational scheme won’t pay anywhere near my current salary, which is absolutely fine as my personal cost of living will be far reduced by then.