WWYD about swimming lessons, 8yo seemingly making no progress

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

DC is 8. School do swimming lessons in summer term of year 2 so DC and their classmates have missed out as they’re no Year 4 (3 form entry school, with several other 2-3 form entry schools around the leisure centre theres absolutely no way they can fit an extra 120-200 childrens lessons in I knew before school even said that DC would miss out).

They where in Stage 1 for almost 2 years but I thought that was due to covid. They moved to Stage 2 in November 2021 so coming up to a year now.
According to the online progress thing (each child has an online account where progress can be checked ready for the next Stage) they’re 51% of the way through stage 2 and that only went up after 2 months stuck on 48%, so given that I reckon it’ll be another 12-18 months in Stage 2.

DC is losing heart with it, keeps going because they want the Learn to Swim Badge for their Camp Blanket (they’re also a Scout), but is finding it very frustrating. They’re now the oldest in their group by almost a year. Their friends at school are Stage 4 and above so they’re finding it even more frustrating.

I’ve changed classes as we were at a very awkward time before but it’s made little to no difference in terms of progress.

It’s costing me £30 a month for a 45 minute lesson once a week and access to the pool at two other times a week which we do use so they are practising. Which I can afford but would be good to have the extra money.

The only reason I haven’t given up with it yet is because they have a muscle condition that is really helped by swimming. But they keep trying to get out of going by saying their ill or their muscles hurt (we’re supposed to push through depending on the pain level and whether it’s managed with calpol or not – DC is under orthopedics and physio for their condition) and it's horrible to have to force them. They do enjoy the actual lessons though, they're just finding it hard to keep at it.

There are no other options for pools locally so it’s give it up or not.

So WWYD? Stick at it or give it up knowing they’ll get no other chances with school?

[underneaththeash]

one of mine got no where with group lessons and we did some private ones instead and learned to swim well in a couple of months!

One other thing you could do is to take him swimming inbetween lessons so he has a bit more time to practice

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

@underneaththeash

one of mine got no where with group lessons and we did some private ones instead and learned to swim well in a couple of months!

One other thing you could do is to take him swimming inbetween lessons so he has a bit more time to practice

@underneaththeash we have access to 2 sessions a week in the pool on the membership and we go most weeks to at least one so they are practising.

[Appleandoranges]

Have you talked to their swimming teacher? They may not be updating the online progress score appropriately. The other children may be doing more swimming in their spare time.

[FatAgainItsLettuceTime]

What's left in the stage for him to tick off? Are those things being done in the lessons?

We had a weird bit where DD got stuck not progressing and it was because there was a steady stream of new kids moving up into the stage so every week they were hitting the same things that she had already ticked off. I had a chat with the teacher and asked when they'd be doing those things, and within a couple of weeks she'd moved up.

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

@Appleandoranges

Have you talked to their swimming teacher? They may not be updating the online progress score appropriately. The other children may be doing more swimming in their spare time.

@Appleandoranges We can see when it's updated as it gives a date it was last updated and it's updated most weeks by the teacher. We changed classes and therefore teacher to a better time for us and it's made no difference so I don't think it's a problem with the teacher at all.

We go once a week to practice as we have access on the card for lessons to two free hours a week during public swims and we do go at least once.

[Appleandoranges]

If they enjoy the actual lessons, that’s positive. They may not want to go because of the hassle of getting changed and the cold.

[ClocksGoingBackwards]

I’d spend that £30 on 1-1 lessons, even if it means only one lesson a month. With targeted help he could progress really quickly especially if you practice in between, and maybe pick up group lessons again at a later stage.

[Bananarama21]

Hi op I'm a swimming teacher, can you explain what progress your child is currently? Can they swim frontcrawl 5 metres and go on their back for 5 metres? Do you take them swimming inbetween lessons. I find parents who do this, children progress faster as they are practising the skills learnt in the lesson. 30 pounds for 45 minutes is very good but I'd wonder if they are losing focus after a while especially if their muscles hurt. We do half an hour sessions 54 pounds a month. How many are in the class? It sounds like they could benefit from. 1 to 1.

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

@FatAgainItsLettuceTime

What's left in the stage for him to tick off? Are those things being done in the lessons?

We had a weird bit where DD got stuck not progressing and it was because there was a steady stream of new kids moving up into the stage so every week they were hitting the same things that she had already ticked off. I had a chat with the teacher and asked when they'd be doing those things, and within a couple of weeks she'd moved up.

@FatAgainItsLettuceTime Theres a date on the online thing of when it was last updated and it seems that they're being updated weekly and trying all the criteria regularly.

It was the same with Stage 1 they were in Stage 1 for nearly 2 years, I thought it was due to covid but it might just be my DC.

[Hankunamatata]

My eldest child successfully became competent in swim class lessons. Child 2 didn't, made no progress so we kept him in the class lessons and did 1:1 lessons once a week too - he quickly improved. Child 3 was abysmal in lessons but shone with 1:1 swimming. Even his 1:1 swim teacher was shocked when she watched him in a lesson. He just isnt great in a group and.forgets everything so we chnaged to just having 1:1 lessons.
What I'm saying is every child is different. Also not all swim classes are good. We tried 3/4 before found one that were suitable. Actually biggest issue is mine dont do well in pool where their feet touch the floor, they do much better in deeper pools

[jetadore]

Leisure centre classes were useless for us, 30min sessions with 15+ kids, so dd would swim a few lengths and spent most of the time waiting for others. This was pre-covid so no over subscription. Shelled out for private lessons, groups of 8, and she was swimming in no time.

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

@Bananarama21

Hi op I'm a swimming teacher, can you explain what progress your child is currently? Can they swim frontcrawl 5 metres and go on their back for 5 metres? Do you take them swimming inbetween lessons. I find parents who do this, children progress faster as they are practising the skills learnt in the lesson. 30 pounds for 45 minutes is very good but I'd wonder if they are losing focus after a while especially if their muscles hurt. We do half an hour sessions 54 pounds a month. How many are in the class? It sounds like they could benefit from. 1 to 1.

@Bananarama21 So the online thing is a table with the criteria one side and then across the top it says "Not Assessed" "Keep Practising" "Almost There" and "Achieved"

Everything apart from exiting is in the Keep Practising category.

We go most weeks to swim together during the public swim sessions as this is covered for free with the lessons so they are practising.

[FatAgainItsLettuceTime]

Don't know if you're using the same stages but is it possible that his muscle condition is preventing him making some of the movements in 9-12 below?

1 Jump in from poolside safely.
2 Blow bubbles a minimum of three times rhythmically, with nose and mouth submerged.
3 Move from a flat floating position on the back and return to standing without support.
4 Move from a flat floating position on the front and return to standing without support.
5 Push from a wall and glide on the back – arms can be by the side or above the head.
6 Push from a wall and glide on the front with arms extended.
7 Travel using a recognised leg action with feet off the pool floor on the back for 5 metres, without the use of floatation equipment.
8 Travel using a recognised leg action with feet off the pool floor on the front for 5 metres, without the use of floatation equipment.
9 Perform a tuck to rotate from a flat floating position on the front, to a back floating position, then return to standing.
10 Perform a tuck to rotate from a flat floating position on the back, to a front floating position, then return to standing.
11 Perform a log roll from the back to the front.
12 Perform a log roll from the front to the back.
13 Exit the water without support.

[Appleandoranges]

Also your child is still really young at 8. They often get stuck at one level for quite a bit and then suddenly progress a lot. I would probably stick at it until they are good swimmers. As a parent you can encourage them into the water now and take them for lessons but not when they are teenagers. Appreciate it’s tricky though. Especially with costs.

[Appleandoranges]

Also yes their muscle condition would mean that they make slower progress surely.

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

@Appleandoranges

Also your child is still really young at 8. They often get stuck at one level for quite a bit and then suddenly progress a lot. I would probably stick at it until they are good swimmers. As a parent you can encourage them into the water now and take them for lessons but not when they are teenagers. Appreciate it’s tricky though. Especially with costs.

@Appleandoranges They were in Stage 1 for nearly 2 years so it just feels like I'm wasting my money.

[Bananarama21]

During your time in the pool with your son can he make 5 metres across the pool on his front and back?

[BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz]

Our local council estimates that the kids should expect to be in each stage for 10-12 weeks. Obviously there are exceptions to this (some sail through, some need more time), but I'd suggest your pool is doing this to keep the money coming in.

2 years at stage one!? That's completely unacceptable. They are not doing a good job.

[Bananarama21]

It's likely his muscle condition is affecting his swimming, can I ask what the condition is? I have a child with a muscle condition in my stage 5, she's working towards 50 metres but doesn't have a powerful leg kick. Is the teacher aware of the condition. If I had a child in a beginner stage wanting to advance on frontcrawl I'd work on strengthening arms. So supporting them with a woggle under the arms to their chest and get them to swim with their arms. If they have reduce movement in their legs for example using floats and doing an arm pull will be harder. Same as going on back, I get the child to incorporate a sculling action to aid them on their back. A decent teacher can recognise limitations and adapt to meet the pupils needs. I hope that helps.

[Robostripes]

I have no idea what stage my DS is doing, his swim school while supposedly following Swim England learn to swim don’t seem to actually assess very often at all. He got a stage 1 certificate about a year ago but looking at the list of what’s in stage 2 that someone posted above he’s well beyond that - every lesson they swim multiple half lengths of the pool (so 12.5m) front crawl and back stroke, they’ve been learning breast stroke and dolphin kick recently. What stage does that sound like?

[Janek]

@BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz

Our local council estimates that the kids should expect to be in each stage for 10-12 weeks. Obviously there are exceptions to this (some sail through, some need more time), but I'd suggest your pool is doing this to keep the money coming in.

2 years at stage one!? That's completely unacceptable. They are not doing a good job.

IME 10-12 weeks is very optimistic. My sporty child spent six months (so twice that) at each stage and that seemed about right for her (although she did manage bronze, silver and gold in 12 weeks each). My less sporty dd spent 15 months (!) at stage 1, and then a year at each subsequent stage. Obviously this felt slow, but she was very obviously in the right level.

[SwimmingGoingBadly]

@Bananarama21

It's likely his muscle condition is affecting his swimming, can I ask what the condition is? I have a child with a muscle condition in my stage 5, she's working towards 50 metres but doesn't have a powerful leg kick. Is the teacher aware of the condition. If I had a child in a beginner stage wanting to advance on frontcrawl I'd work on strengthening arms. So supporting them with a woggle under the arms to their chest and get them to swim with their arms. If they have reduce movement in their legs for example using floats and doing an arm pull will be harder. Same as going on back, I get the child to incorporate a sculling action to aid them on their back. A decent teacher can recognise limitations and adapt to meet the pupils needs. I hope that helps.

@Bananarama21 Joint Hypermobility Syndrome alongside shallow sockets which can cause dislocation. They have the JHS severely in their Knees and Feet.

Teacher is aware as far as I know as it's on their online thing. But there's 12 in the class and then there's classes immediately before and after our time slot so I'm not 100% convinced the teacher would know who my DC is.

[itsgettingweird]

Hi OP.

Hopefully I can help.

My ds also has a muscular condition. He has hereditary spastic paraplegia - is your ds similar?

This also means he has Co ordination difficulties as well as muscle weakness and decreased range of movement. So he cannot do certain requirements and won't be able to ever do them.

Have you looked at the swim England (or swim Scotland/wales dependent on your location) website? They have about para swimming. You can get access at local para swimming hubs who support the swim schools to teach your child with their differing movements. You can also look into para swimming as a whole.

Swimming also helps my ds condition. It's no surprise he came up through the ranks slower than his peers but he is now in the national squad (and still can't do some things!) and also won a gold medal at British para champs this summer!

I really cannot recommend enough perhaps looking elsewhere dependent on what type of lessons you have. For example a small private pool teacher is unlikely to have the same experience as a teacher in a large council pool or even a teacher teaching learn to swim with a local swimming club with swimmers who have disabilities.

Your region will also have para swimming intro days that you'll find on your swim England (or wherever) regional website. The south east has one coming up soon but I think the minimum age might be 9?

Please ask anything. I've been that parent!

[itsgettingweird]

Ah X posts.

I'm not sure JHS comes under para swimming although specific impairments such as joints not being formed may do?

[itsgettingweird]

@Bananarama21

It's likely his muscle condition is affecting his swimming, can I ask what the condition is? I have a child with a muscle condition in my stage 5, she's working towards 50 metres but doesn't have a powerful leg kick. Is the teacher aware of the condition. If I had a child in a beginner stage wanting to advance on frontcrawl I'd work on strengthening arms. So supporting them with a woggle under the arms to their chest and get them to swim with their arms. If they have reduce movement in their legs for example using floats and doing an arm pull will be harder. Same as going on back, I get the child to incorporate a sculling action to aid them on their back. A decent teacher can recognise limitations and adapt to meet the pupils needs. I hope that helps.

You'd have a right laugh at my ds!!! He uses fins and still barely moves 🫣 🤣🤣🤣

Leaves the squad for dust in a pull set though