To think that school budgets are going to fail our children

[BakeOffDisasters]

I'm coming from this as a teacher and parent and I'm so worried about how things are going in some schools due to tightening budgets.

I'm facing a day without an LSA in a year 1 class of 30 today with a lot of challenging needs. Across our ks1, three support staff have now been signed off and there aren't enough LSAs in the school to cover. So that will be one LSA for four classes today. This will mean that children with the highest needs will miss out on the support they so desperately need for behaviour, emotional issues and academic needs. Supply agencies are too expensive for some schools so it turns into a skeleton staff.

My son has SEN and I'm currently in the process of looking for a school for him. From questioning management across schools, the message seems uniform that with the cost of living, budgets are tightening and this has a knock on effect to staffing, specifically support staff. All teaching and support staff are the most valuable resource to children in schools, without them, children will suffer.

I feel so disillusioned with it all right now.

Another question, why are the government cutting education budgets?

@toulet
From what I know of state (public?) schools in the US, parents often make a contribution.
What happens there, is schools in an affluent area will ask for a few hundred dollars, if not more, so those schools end up better resourced. Those in a less affluent areas will ask for less, so end up less well resourced. Huge differences.
I've wondered recently if that's what will happen here.

I suspect this will become normal in the next 5 - 10 years.

Just like it's normal for teachers in America to request items / resources for the classroom, I think we'll see the same in the UK. Which means we might actually have glue sticks, but it doesn't actually solve the problem

Wow you're being harsh! It's not her child's fault that they need more help in school or life. Have some compassion

Even if there were sufficient special school places, you can't place a child in one unless the parents agree. Many parents of children with SEND want their children in mainstream schools, for a wide variety of reasons.

It's certainly worth looking into but I do struggle with that as I have other dc who didn't get the same opportunities but are doing well in a good state school.

I know about 5 parents who have gone private recently...nearly all of them have slightly 'quirky' kids. Not quite diagnosed but very sensory and often struggle with friendships a little. Left in a class of 30+ they could well end up struggling. I suspect private has a high number of neurodivergent pupils.

The problem is straightforward lack of funding.

Also it is so ridiculous to think SEN means lacking intelligence. Dyslexic people are often very intelligent. Some of the greatest mathematicians/scientists/entrepreneurs etc are autistic or have ADHD.
Elon Musk seems to do alright 🤷‍♀️

I’m sorry @mgmnt but you clearly have absolutely no knowledge of anything of which you speak.

@mgmnt shall we just drown them like an inconvenient litter of puppies instead? Or perhaps we should bring back institutions and hide them away so society isn't offended by their differences. I have one dc who is the smartest in her year, and one with sen. They are both absolutely equal in their worth to me, themselves and society.

I've never told anyone to fuck off on here before but you really need to off this thread.

@OnBoardTheHeartOfGold yes I understand that.

As a parent I accept that part of my job is to educate my own children through activities like days out and scouts. I accept that my children may be less challenged at school because it's mixed ability. It is right that sen and disadvantaged children get the extra funding, time and resources.

For what it's worth, I have spent a few years teaching an almost blind student. Highly intelligent, top set for almost everything. Has gone on to do Science A-levels and will likely go into scientific research.

And fucking well done them! Did they have a 1:1 TA? Absolutely. Without that support, normal teaching would not have been possible - they were able to access work on the board because they had a TA verbally and with very large writing "translating" that work into almost-blind-friendly. They also had braille lessons paid for as they will likely go completely blind in a few years.

And yet they are exactly the kind of student you are talking about: intelligent, self-motivated, highly resilient. They just needed a little extra help to achieve the same at their potential as everyone else.

He is, by test scores. By his reading. By what all of his teachers have said.

Kids like mine are the ones who go on to invent brilliant things. Make amazing contributions to the world.

Sorry that it's inconveniencing you though. And your perfect children. I wish he didn't need the support but for now he does. In an ideal world, there would be funding for the smaller classes and extra support for all.

And he doesn't have 1:1 support. We aren't asking for that. There aren't even TAs in his classes at the moment. They all left over the summer. So he's struggling. And being bullied. It's good fun. Even basic support would help, because IT'S NOT FAIR ON THE TEACHER OR THE OTHER KIDS, let alone my DS.

@mgmnt I have SEN. I had some intervention at school. I also have 10 GCSEs at grade C or above, 3 A levels at AAB and a 2:1 from a Russell Group uni.

My son has similar needs.. he is not "dumb" as you put it..In fact his test scores put him third in his year for maths.. in a school where loads of children are tutored for 11+. He is not tutored. Neither before you ask does he have any extra support in maths, only English. He's dyspraxic with mild dyslexia but he's not "dumb".

It's very easy to sit in your ivory tower when your children are not "dumb" I just hope they learn to have more empathy and a less blinkered view than you.

It's messages like this that I really wish Mumsnet would add a thumbs up or heart for. Well done to your son. I'm sure you know this already, but thankfully most people do not think like that other poster!

I’ve reported mgmnt for hate speech. Calling SEN children dumb window lickers is without doubt the vilest thing I’ve ever read on MN and that’s saying something. I hope they are banned from the site.

I must admit I sometimes question if it’s the right thing for some SEN kids to be in mainstream school. My nephew has just started primary recently. He has being diagnosed as Autistic and has most of the markers but hasn’t had a full assessment and it’s unclear how much it will impact him as he gets older and how much support he will need longer term. Currently he needs a lot of 1:1 support because he has only very recently begun to talk and struggles to communicate needs with new people. He can get very distressed about things not working in the way he expects them to and at times can be violent (biting, hitting & head butting). He is definitely far from stupid as he understands and follows complex instructions, builds Lego for adults and can manage maths at/above level of many kids his age.

Honestly he might be better off in a specialist school at the moment that was set up to manage needs of pupils with ASD, ADHD and similar. I suspect such a school would actually be more expensive than having TA support in mainstream but it would mean the set up could be geared entirely around the students with complex needs and wouldn’t have to balance that with a large class. It would also reduce the chances of another child being hurt at some point if he were in an environment with a small class size, genuine 1:1 or 2:1 etc. I want him to get access to tools to help him succeed in life. I’m very hopeful that since getting glue ear fixed that went undiagnosed in the pandemic his language will improve and that will help a lot in his ability to communicate his needs and at that point with a bit of extra support he can thrive in a mainstream setting. In the meantime though it’s hard as it’s stressful for him managing in mainstream. It’s stressful for his parents who worry about him coping and also that if he bites/hits at school he could end up labelled as a “bad” child for the whole time he’s in that cohort of children even if he manages to get better at communicating and at regulating his behaviour over time. It’s doubtless stressful for the overstretched staff who may well be blamed if he does hurt another child because his 1:1 person was doing something else at the time.

Unless you are suggesting just not bothering to educate anyone who has complex needs I’m not sure what you think the answer is. Is that what you are suggesting @mgmnt? To just leave them out of school entirely since it’s too expensive? If so what is your plan when they are adults?

Ok @mgmnt I’ve seen your update. So in your world what happens to the abandoned and ignored children with SEN when they become adults? With good support as kids many of them will be more than able to live independently and contribute to society like everyone else. What do you think is likely to be the higher cost over their life (since that’s clearly all you care about at all)

PS DS is in a private school.... there's no escape for your precious little ones.. unless you get them a governess of course!

Even the most selective private school in our area ( 700 applicants to 80 places) has children with SEN because they select on ability and potential. They even offer adjustments in their entrance exam. They certainly wouldn't kowtow to the hideous view of parents like you.

It’s really scary. I have additional adults in my class who are spread so thinly amongst many many needy children. My TA is unable to do much bar watch children with behavioural issues like a hawk. I have to do everything and I can see it clear as day that barely any of them get the right amount of attention. I don’t know what will happen next.

Am school Governor and a parent of a SEND child and it terrifies me. I think school will middle through for a year or so and the worst impact will be felt in about 12 months time. I'm praying for a general election soon. Much as I hate Labour's TWAW stance, I desperately want someone in charge who will take sorting out schools and the NH seriously....

@Forestfever It's messages like this that I really wish Mumsnet would add a thumbs up or heart for. Well done to your son. I'm sure you know this already, but thankfully most people do not think like that other poster!

Thanks, I do know! Usually I can ignore it when people are nasty, but it was epic today!

The funding situation is dire, and it's failing everyone. Blaming it on the SEN kids getting some extra support doesn't help!

Yes there are poor and great parents in all areas, deprived and wealthy. However, my personal experience of working in a school in a poorer catchment is that many of the parents push for diagnosis of ASD/ADHD when it's is simply bad, lazy parenting. I see it every day and it frustrates the hell out of me. Parents standing at the door in the morning complaining their child has not had a good start to the day usually because they can't say no or put boundaries in place not because they have a child with SEND