To think the buyer’s risk in house prices is not my problem?

[Eeksteek]

I’m selling a buy to let house to an investor. They offered below the asking price back in August, and so far as I can see, no progress has been made on the sale (I thought we were waiting for a survey, but last week they moved to a cash offer and now they are deciding if they want a survey)

The buyer emailed me yesterday to ask for a ten percent reduction on their offer, citing a potential 10-20 percent decrease in property prices and asking me to view it as ‘splitting the risk evenly between buyer and seller’

Firstly, the risk is not my problem. As an investor, it’s hers to take, or not, as she feels comfortable. Why should I share it? If I wanted to take risks like that, I’d be keeping the house. Secondly a ten percent reduction on the asking price is not a ten percent reduction on the offer, lady. And thirdly, a ten percent reduction in agreed price is an ACTUAL HIT to me, not a potential one. It’s not a even comparison!

She has also said that if I accept she will instruct her solicitors to proceed ‘as expeditiously as possible’. Well, why hasn’t she done that already? I’ve instructed mine, and paid them, and completed all the paperwork. She also smugly reminded me that she is a cash buyer, and not affected by interest rates.

I feel like writing back and saying:

1. The risk is hers to take or not. It’s neither my business or my problem.

1. If she wants to reduce her offer by ten percent then say so. The asking price is neither her nor there, as she didn’t offer it.

1. Inflation is running at around ten percent and forecast to rise. Her cash is already losing 10%. She swapping an actual 10 percent depreciation rate which will always be a depreciation, for a potential one which will likely be a gain over time. I am doing the reverse. (Although I suppose she could counter that with interest rates)

1. She is also benefitting from a (I think) five percent reduction in stamp duty. Shouldn’t we be sharing that, as well?

Obviously, I can choose whether to accept or not, and ultimately is doesn’t really matter why she’s reducing her offer. I do have some bargaining power. I bloody hate this sort of game, but I really, REALLY need to sell this house. God knows if I’d get another offer. It’s making an ever increasing loss, and is on a variable rate (couldn’t fix, as selling). Should I just suck it up, negotiate, or continue being silently indignant (which is obviously not very productive!). I really do need this money. I’m widowed and this business supports me and my child. It’s not paper money. Or just not having a holiday or a new Range Rover!

You’ve given her an inch..,

sounds like they are trying it on for more money off, from experience last year mine was up for sale,85 people wanted to view,first person to look was well in with the estate agent,i now know.had few to view, all offered over price,picked a lady, she pulled out,went with person buy to let who knew estate agent, he was a bully dragged it out, demanded money off,was shocking experience,in the end we told him where to go, back on market sold fast for 20 grand more,,dont be fooled ,

I’m such a wordy person. I can’t seem to help it, however hard I try to condense things, they just get longer!

I suck at negotiating, too. I just don’t DO this. I decide what I want, and if I can pay the price on the label, and then I buy it, or not. I don’t play games. She does though. I had a best and final offer three times.

I want it to bloody sell. Now! I decided to put it on the market in May! It was a tough decision (and I left it too long, I admit). I’m prepared to take 5k to get it moving, and not to have to mess about with clearing the property, vacant possession and another two months losses on it. She’s probably right that I wouldn’t the get the same offer now. It’s not a great property.

I’m trying to think of it as a golden bridge!

Put yourself in her shoes. You’ve just admitted you probably wouldn’t get the same offer now, and it’s not a great house.

She’s playing hardball, but she’s a cash buyer. We aren’t talking about chicken feed - this is a 250k house from what you said. Damn right she should be negotiating.

But so should you. Just keep it all business - cut the waffle. Work out your bottom price, and stick to it. She will either take it or leave it.

Yes, we do. It’s not zero, but it is less. You (used) to pay the normal residential rates, then an additional 3% if it’s not your main residence. Now you just pay the 3%. Her SDLT has gone from £12k to £3750. (I double checked on the .gov calculator with dates pre and post ’fiscal event’ so I’m sure)

@Eeksteek why are you even entertaining this reduction with the big fall in SDLT? Just say No. You do not have to explain yourself.

Because I’m beyond broke. No way I’d be selling a tenanted property if I didn’t absolutely have to. This house is making a loss (for reasons largely outside of my control) and I really, really need to sell, stat.

Did you get any other interest/offers before you agreed the sale?

Do you think you will get a better offer if you return it to the market?

Someone cleverer than me would be able to work out how the rising inflation is hitting her cash. It was on another thread a week or so ago, something along the lines of 500k in cash is loosing 5k per week? (Example only for dramatic effect). She needs to get her cash into an assest pdq.

I'd not make anymore reductions on that basis. The current economic situation is hitting her hard too.

Find me an asset guaranteed to have a positive real return, right now.

cash might be trash, but it is at least going to retain its nominal value.

Basically almost all asset classes and sectors are juiced up from years of cheap credit. Thus there are absolutely no guarantees.

Don't be tempted to go to auction, I lost big bucks doing that and the commission was eye watering. I wish I'd continued with the EA, the cheeky robber really wanted it and in hindsight if I'd stood my ground, would have paid in the end.

This is a dip for housing, it will return and boom again. Like all investments, they fluctuate but over time, inflation always reduces cash.

In that case I'd go with this buyer even if she won't accept the 2.5k reduction.

@swanbuster

£10 will always be £10 but it is what you can buy with the £10 that is eaten away by inflation.

Sitting on £250k for the next 10 years will yield far less than buying a property and keeping it for 10 years.

It's exactly why property is such a good inveterate. It's an appreciating assest.

Cash is a deprecating asset due to inflation, which is going to be quite high for a while.

• investment not inveterate!

I would keep marketing the property. If she's dragging her feet so much already, it sounds like she'll look for something in the survey to ask for a further reduction. Being a cash buyer if you're unmotivated and dithering isn't really a selling point is it?! Of course property is going to always be a good long term investment (unless there's some serious structural issues with the house or similar). She's talking rubbish.

Good luck.
The return on her investment won’t be great if the only way she can make this profitable is because she doesn’t have a mortgage. Otherwise you wouldn’t need to be selling. Perhaps she’s being prudent asking for a further reduction. Sorry, I know that’s not what you want to hear.

Put it back on the market but just be aware you might not get your August price and will need to renegotiate with your ongoing purchase.

I don’t know if you have taken your house off the market? If you have, get the advert back up.

Tell her that your agreement to her offer is unchanged. She may withdraw that offer if she wishes, but until she has confirmed her position and set a date to exchange contracts you will continue to market your house to potential buyers.

You're overthinking. I'd think less about the rights and wrongs of it and more about brass tacks.

• Would you accept the revised offer if she made it today?
• Do you think she's a safe bet as a buyer or is she going to mess you around?

Engage less with her agenda. All this sharing risk stuff is bollocks and you know it. Don't get sucked into her narrative.

This is a big game of chicken. The less you say, the more convincing you will sound.

🙄

property prices is, as we are getting a demonstration of, highly dependent on credit conditions. Over the very long term, yes - it should hedge inflation. But we are currently in a very, very obvious asset bubble.

She's trying it on because she knows you need the money. She's rich and being stuck up about it too, bragging about how much she has then pretending it will be a loss to her, I've had similar from buyers for items. One woman told me all about all of the expensive things she has, and then despite me saying I'm only selling said item to pay a big unexpected bill, she tried to claim poverty for her own 'unexpected' bill and reduce the price. Dumbass woman, clearly her husband's money as she was too thick. I refused and said buy it or leave. She also tried to take it before buying it, which I also refused. Sneaky bitch wouldn't have paid at all.

Tell her to fuck off or pay up. She'll pay up.