To think paying new staff more than long serving staff is just ridiculous

[Celebrityskint]

When I joined the company I work for 7 years ago, I asked for a particular salary. Turns out it was more than my peers already in the company who had more knowledge etc. My counterpart complained and got her salary matched to mine. I was oblivious to this at the time and it was clear I was resented by some of the team (those who had been there longer). Once colleague who had worked up from the lowest paid role in the company was horribly underpaid compared to the rest of us (and probably still is)

in the last 7 years my salary has barely risen. (Probably around 4.5% in total).

The company has taken on new staff: at a salary of almost twice what some of the rest of the team are on. The new staff aren’t any better at their jobs than the longer serving staff: it’s just market rates.

so, I applied for another job outwith the company and lo and behold was offered a significant amount more than my current salary. my existing employer has offered to match this to keep me. Clearly they would need to pay market rates to replace me, and they are losing a lot of experience and expertise

aibu in thinking “no, you underpaid me for years, and are underpaying many of my colleagues”

Too often employers conflate the entry level job description with the fully trained and experienced person who leaves.

Many times I have seen people stuck with the label of apprentice long after their apprenticeship has finished. The employer fails to recognise how valuable the employee is until they have to go to market to replace them.

We had this very recently. The company couldn't recruit anyone on current pay levels so they offered higher salaries.

The result was that a brand new employee was earning more than the person with 10 years experience who was training them. There was uproar and many highly experienced people left. We lost half of my team, all of them with 10 - 20 years experience.

To be fair to the company then did a pay review mid year and a lot of us had raises. But we've still lost so much experience.

Sounds like you just don’t know how to negotiate your own salary increases and are blaming them.

Leave. And then in your exit interview calmly explain benchmarking salaries to them.

I know there’s going to be some small differences between what my colleagues and I are paid, but our company benchmarks every year so we are consistently paid around the market rate.

In 12 years my salary has been increased by 3x so now i earn 3 times what i earnt 12 years ago. Has your salary increased as much or dont you know how to negotiate your own salary?

PS. I have only managed to do this by leaving the companies. In my previous company there were rounds of redundancies going on because of lack of cash, do you think if i had gone and ask for 10k they'd have given it to me?

Especially in IT it doesn't pay to work anywhere for more than a few years.
You have enough experience where you can ask for very high wage and likely get it.

I left a place once who kept dinking me around about not being able to afford raises. I started interviewing and received a couple of offers pay 50% more.

He had the cheek to be offended when I gave him my notice.

Too often companies only benchmark within their own industry. My former employer did this and were repeatedly surprised when people in support departments such as finance and IT would leave to go to other much better paying industries. There was a constant brain drain.

You must ask for regular pay rises. I've been interviewing new staff. Some of these new recruits were offered more than my senior position was paying. So I renegotiated.

Its a vital market indicator - when we bring in people on the higher salaries they can command - it then helps to set market rate for the annual pay review. It evens out and everyone benefits.

If you have an open role and want top talent you have to pay market rate. The problem only comes when your employer doesn’t do appropriate pay reviews in order to retain top talent too. And that’s bad business.

There are times it makes sense to offer a higher salary to someone joining than already there if they have the skills the business needs. There’s a risk to moving jobs, losing employment protection for two years, uncertainty whether the role will work out and potentially lost bonus /LTIP/ accrued long service entitlement for things like redundancy. So its not surprising people offered new roles ask for higher than market rate to compensate for that. None / few of those things impact existing employees, so they don’t necessarily need compensation by way of a higher salary.

Find a new job. Tell them to make you an offer you can't refuse.
Frankly a lot of firms rely on employee inertia so they don't have to offer more money.

Is it too late to take the other job?

If I understand correctly you have a new job offer with a higher salary and your employer wants you to stay and will match the other salary?
If you don't feel valued, I'd take the other job. Fresh start. Could be time after 7 years. Employers pigeon hole you.

Decades ago, I was badly underpaid, so found another job more money and resigned, my employers matched the salary so I'd stay and then made me redundant as a punishment about 7 months later. Arseholes. I could have taken the other job.

In 5 years my salary has gone from 23 to 31. I know it started off very low.

Happens everywhere. It's the reason I joined the public sector, was sick of finding out colleagues with less experience than me were being paid more.

In my last role we were all paid a pittance but I was regularly told I was a fantastic member of staff, quick worker, hit the ground running as soon as I walked through the door etc etc but they refused to pay me more. That was until I handed my notice in and they told me they would match it. I told them to get fucked (in the nicest possible way).

That is so typical. In my last place we used to say ''you're only valued when you leave''.

@Tanfastic you definitely did the right thing leaving after they matched the offer. I did the wrong thing staying. They basically resented having to pay me a decent wage.

I knew that if I'd stayed that would have been the last wage rise I'd ever see and I'm not wrong. I definitely made the right decision.

Sometimes, companies do have to pay a premium to get people from competitors with really valuable experience. Everyone can choose to pursue their career by moving jobs and re-negotiating their salary upward each time. I actually think if you stay at the same place too long you stop learning and get stuck in your ways to some extent. I have also been given rises by trying to leave before. It is just how things work.

YANBU to be annoyed by it, but YANBU to be offended or upset or to take it personally.

There is no "deserve", there is no "fair", there is no "loyal". You're selling a commodity (your labour) to a buyer. Both parties will try to get the best price. C'est la vie.

My advice would be firstly: separate in your mind the corporate entity (which is soulless and has a profit motive) from the people and managers within it (whom you might feel you have a personal relationship with and should expect loyalty from). And accept that your financial dealings are with the former not the latter.

And secondly: leave. Or at least get an offer and threaten to. Don't have any reservations about selfishly doing what's best for you, and don't expect them to do anything other than what they think they can get away with.

My company pays new starters more money & more holiday than existing people

The company wonders why so many people are leaving

My company - meaning the company that we are employed by

I don't own the company !

Not mentioned here but which limits whether employees can just go and ask for a pay rise is whether there are pay bands and where an employee is already at the top.

you have the scenario where the employer can’t recruit experienced staff because no one will join on the existing top of the band salary.

anyone else experiencing that?

In an ideal world yes, but how many companies do you actually know that suddenly give you a 20% payrise because the market rate for your role has increased? And are you then prepared to take a pay cut if the market is suddenly flooded by people like you? It works both ways. I agree that it's rubbish but is just how it seems to be and you vote with your feet. But sadly, how many people have we known that never ask for pay rises and are happy with the bare minimum?

I run my own business nowadays so don't have to worry about that stuff anymore but prior to that I went contracting. That's the only time I've known where your rates actually reflect the market. In many ways, contracting is the ideal working relationship. You get paid for the hours you put in, at the market rate and you're retained or let go, based on your performance.

This.

I find people are loyal to companies and (wrongly) expect it in return. Some managers may be great but ultimately a company will drop you in a heartbeat when the going gets tough.

I've had friends that have put their life and soul into their work and were literally devastated and bitter when a downturn led the company to lay people off.

Do a good job and put in 100% but IMO, do it to benefit your career/income. Harass for payrises and promotions.

I’m probably going to accept the offer from the new company to be honest: it sounds like i will be valued more there.

I actually really like my line manager;
he’s a decent bloke and i imagine he’s impacted just as much as I am by the fact that existing members of staff are earning less than new staff.

The company culture is actually quite toxic: seeing lots of my colleagues leave (or they are bullied out)