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Income tax - top 45% rate scrapped! Bonkers!

1000 replies

HoppingKangaroo · 23/09/2022 12:29

The 45% top rate of tax (which currently applies on earnings above £150,000) will be scrapped entirely. How will this help the economy? It will just add to the government debt and it just helps out the very weathly.
Why not have more help for the poorest in the country and not have tax cuts for the very wealthy.

OP posts:
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6
Skyellaskerry · 23/09/2022 21:11

I am also waiting to hear how @Luckydip1 defines and measures success? And hard working. What do you mean by that? You are throwing out these soundbites and seem unable to define what you're saying.

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:11

@jgw1 do you think the Chinese arrive at work and have a 30 minute tea break, hour for lunch, a couple more tea breaks and then leave at 5:30pm on the dot like the few brits that have a job, of course they don't.

Sothis · 23/09/2022 21:12

Our household will be £20,000/year better off which means we won’t give notice to our part time nanny housekeeper which had been on the cards until today.

jgw1 · 23/09/2022 21:12

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:10

At the end of the day the brightest people generally earn the most because they want to provide the most they can for their families.

@Luckydip1 Thank you. So the way to measure how bright someone is, is how much they earn. That means for example that my gran was not very bright because she earnt very little in her lifetime.
Thank you for the clarification.

poetryandwine · 23/09/2022 21:12

@Luckydip1 It’s not me saying this won’t work, it is the resounding opinion of the international markets. You have singularly failed to address this point.

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:12

Let's not get personal.

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:13

The currency markets are the Wild West, they know nothing.

jgw1 · 23/09/2022 21:14

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:11

@jgw1 do you think the Chinese arrive at work and have a 30 minute tea break, hour for lunch, a couple more tea breaks and then leave at 5:30pm on the dot like the few brits that have a job, of course they don't.

@Luckydip1 So the measure of how hard someone works that you would like to use, is how long they spend working.
If I spent 14hours a day moving a pile of rocks from one side of the yard to the other, and then the next day spending 14hours moving them back again I would be exceedingly hard working.

Thank you for that clarification.

poetryandwine · 23/09/2022 21:15

@Luckydip1 who is getting personal? I posted too soon. I happen to believe that morals and fairness actually pay off in the medium term, but even if I did not, my key concern at this point would be the teaction of the markets - a point youvstill haven’t addressed

Lassie76 · 23/09/2022 21:15

"I suspect you protest so much as your contribution to society is so little for so much reward and it makes one a bit defensive"

Oh, well given that, there must be an AWFUL lot of people embarrassed by how little they contribute to society whilst taking so much from the public purse to foot the bill for their Sky TV, drugs, booze, fags and designer sportswear.
See? We can all do stereotypes. Funny how it's only OK when it's aimed at one side.

As for "falling out the right womb"?
Piss right off. A lot of high earners got there through sheer hard work, determination, sacrifice and drive. Despite their backgrounds.

MongoOnlyPawnInGameOfLife · 23/09/2022 21:15

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:08

@poetryandwine We are competing as a nation with other countries around the world. We have hardly any natural resources and our main export is services of various kinds. We cannot indulge in this endless talk about morals and fairness. Life is not fair and we will really be finished if we continue the way we have been. Look at the Chinese, they are incredibly competitive and hard working, we need to start behaving in a similar way.

Good idea. Let’s all work 6 day, 70 hour weeks so that we can do what? Buy more shit? Have a higher suicide rate?

Parker231 · 23/09/2022 21:15

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 20:56

We need to attract and retain the best talent to this country now that the muppets voted Brexit we have to make up for it. Taxing the hardest working and brightest people will stop people wanting to work here and they will go elsewhere.

DH and I left the UK earlier this year for Canada as a result of Brexit. DH a doctor and me, Corporate Finance Director. DT’s, both graduates with 1st class degrees - DS works for an engineering company in Amsterdam and DD for the EU in Brussels. None of us are planning on living in the Uk again.

jgw1 · 23/09/2022 21:16

MongoOnlyPawnInGameOfLife · 23/09/2022 21:15

Good idea. Let’s all work 6 day, 70 hour weeks so that we can do what? Buy more shit? Have a higher suicide rate?

No, no, so we can move rocks more effectively from one side of the yard to the other each day.

Nat6999 · 23/09/2022 21:16

When I started at HMRC there were 60 rate bands, basic rate was 30% & the 40% rate band started at £15,400 & 60% started at £38,100. My salary was £4,664 for a 37 hour week.

poetryandwine · 23/09/2022 21:16

Dismissing the currency markets absent analysis won’t cut it, I’m afraid. Here I will get personal and say I’m looking for something well reasoned.

Quincythequince · 23/09/2022 21:16

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 23/09/2022 20:19

I think it's a very good question as to why people's basic needs are not being met, and no, I don't believe that it's all the fault of the higher rate tax payers in the slightest.

The reasons are varied and complex, I think. In many cases, government policies over many years are to blame. Many of the poorest people have deficit budgets where they simply don't have enough money coming in to meet their basic needs. Many are unable to increase their income due to poor mental or physical health, disability, caring responsibilities, learning difficulties, poor skills, low literacy rates, poor digital skills, lack of confidence etc. Many may have grown up in chaotic families and they may live chaotic lives. Of course, in some cases, there may be a lack of personal responsibility, or self inflicted issues like substance abuse etc. Some may even be workshy, but I believe that they are a small minority. There will be many more contributing factors that I have of course failed to mention.

Our education system has failed them. Our welfare system has failed them. In many cases, their parents have failed them as well. We have not done enough to address the needs of children growing up in poverty and to promote social mobility. There are no easy answers, but dismissing them as "low life living off the state" as one poster did above is not helpful.

I don't think I have said anywhere that I want 100% redistribution. I am not a communist and I wouldn't want to live in that kind of society, but I do want to live in a society where people can feel confident that their basic needs will be met. A progressive tax system where the richest pay a higher proportion of their salaries makes perfect sense to me.

I'm sorry if you're frustrated by my failure to put an exact percentage on how much I think people should contribute. I just don't think it's that simple. I probably wouldn't ever go beyond 50% as a top rate, but equally, I would have no ideological objection much lower rates if the economy can bear it. The yardstick for me is based not on what people pay at the top, but how much they're suffering at the bottom. While we have people living in real poverty, depending on foodbanks for their daily needs, I think it is very hard to argue that rich people should contribute less.

As it is, I'm not even arguing that I want the highest earners to be paying more than what they have been paying. I'm merely saying that I see no reason why they should pay less.

That’s fair enough Mrs you didn’t have to provide me with an explanation and I was more just curious as to your views because you have said repeatedly that people with more should pay more.

You certainly came across as balanced with your overall views on here, and I agree with a lot of what you say. I was just interested in your Stance, which now when you explain it, isn’t as you say communist.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 23/09/2022 21:18

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:10

At the end of the day the brightest people generally earn the most because they want to provide the most they can for their families.

That's a very interesting statement.

It presumes that the "brightest" people will all pursue lucrative careers simply because they can. It fails to take account of the fact that money/wealth isn't necessarily something that everyone values particularly highly.

In fact, you could argue that the very "brightest" people are far more likely to take heed of the extensive research that shows that, beyond a certain point, wealth doesn't actually make you happier. So they prioritise other things.

UsernameHistories · 23/09/2022 21:18

Sothis · 23/09/2022 21:12

Our household will be £20,000/year better off which means we won’t give notice to our part time nanny housekeeper which had been on the cards until today.

I struggle with the concept that £20,000 makes a difference to someone on £450,000 to begin with.

spiffin · 23/09/2022 21:20

My dh will earn in that bracket soon. But Even though we will be better if I don't really get it at all.
Doesn't make any sense other than maybe to line a few pockets. Dh wonders if it's to help higher paid government employees get a pay rise without openly admitting to a pay rise.

poetryandwine · 23/09/2022 21:20

My comment of 21.16 was for @Luckydip1

poetryandwine · 23/09/2022 21:21

Bravo, @MrsBennetsPoorNerves !

MongoOnlyPawnInGameOfLife · 23/09/2022 21:21

Sothis · 23/09/2022 21:12

Our household will be £20,000/year better off which means we won’t give notice to our part time nanny housekeeper which had been on the cards until today.

We can now afford to maintain our quota of serfs.

(please be a pisstake)

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:22

It is interesting that people don't seem to be concerned with the success of our nation and they are more interested in fairness and equality even if we are collectively poorer as a result. It helps me understand why there was so much support for Brexit.

Motheroffourdragons · 23/09/2022 21:22

This reply has been deleted

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

WagathaChristieMystery · 23/09/2022 21:23

Luckydip1 · 23/09/2022 21:10

At the end of the day the brightest people generally earn the most because they want to provide the most they can for their families.

Looool this is gold!! Slow clap for you @Luckydip1

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