I don't want to be 'reigned over' anymore

[Yubgftr]

While I totally respect the Queen and how she served the country, I think it's now a good time to end the monarchy as I think modern society has outgrown it.

Just the idea that someone inherits the job of head of state through birthright and reigns over us peasants is crazy in this modern age. Then all the ceremonies, titles, line of succession are remnants of a completely different era and tbh remind me of episodes of The Tudors or Game of Thrones, it's just so archaic and out of place.

I think having to bow and curtsey to people just because they were born or married into a special family also seems ridiculous. Why should I have to curtsey to any of them? Not saying I'd be rude or disrespectful but having to bend my knee to a set of people as if they were deities, it's just insane! I think I'd actually feel humiliated.

I also don't get the fawning and crying outside the palace - by all means be respectful and recognise her contribution but crying about someone you've never met? To me it's OTT

Back in medieval times when there was little education and religion was used to manipulate the masses, I can understand why all the peasants went mad for their sovereign and saw them as annointed by God etc etc but we're much more enlightened now (most of us!) so we need to make way for a new way of doing things.

Even a new national anthem - why is it all about the king or queen and god saving them? Why not about the people, the nation as a whole?

That said, I also hate the idea of someone like Boris Johnson being head of state and I bet that's a role he'd go for if we were a Republic. Swings and Roundabouts!

YABU - God save the king, monarchy forever
YANBU - time to end the monarchy

Totally agree. Leave and enjoy Trump or Putin.

I do find it funny/sad to see how many posters just can't cope with the idea of sharing this little 3-country island with people whose views differ from their own.

Do all you "off you pop then and don't let the door close on your arse" people feel the same way about people whose religion - or lack of one - doesn't coincide with yours? Or maybe those who want to rejoin the EU? Should the latter "pop off" to an EU country rather than remain in their own where they have every bit as much right to be as you?

@Yubgftr if I was you I'd be 1/2 incandescent with rage at some of the viciously intolerant replies, and 1/2 helpless with laughter at the entitled sods who can't cope with "Royalty" - gasp, shock, curtsey quick, tug your forelock - not being worshipped by people who recognise the absurdity of the institution in which people are revered just because of a particular sperm meeting a particular egg!

(I'm not actively anti-royalist, because they do (a) bring in a sizeable enough chunk of tourist dollars to more or less pay for themselves & (b) prevent such horrendous specimens as Johnson or Truss being Head of State.)

Fun thread if you can cope with all the nastiness.

Only because two people shagged and happened to be born out of a royal...

With respect there aren't many practical opportunities or means whereby we can "hold a national conversation" . And I profoundly disagree with your assumption that "the fact we still have a monarchy means most people are content with it or don't feel strongly enough to protest". People do not have an easily accessible means of protesting and their views on the subject are never sought.

And as for the numbers present at Buckingham Palace, yes I am sure that a fair few were there to pay their respects to the Queen and her dedicated service. But quite a few of them when interviewed confessed to not being "particularly royalist" or not knowing precisely why they were there. Or they were having selfies taken in front of the flowers! The fact that they respected the late Queen does not necessarily equate with supporting the institution of the monarchy.

Let's face it, a lot of us are just bumbling along confronting the demands of daily life, and don't give a lot of thought to this important issue and I personally think that should change. Blind acquiescence does not necessarily mean positive approval!

Agree.
It’s just so infantile.
I’m quite ambivalent about the monarchy, but I don’t see why a republican should have to emigrate for holding such views. That seems rather dictatorial. It’s a little like silencing remainers by telling them to leave the country.

They need to go now. I liked and respected the queen but the UK needs to modernise.

Great post! ^^ Totally agree with every word of this!

That seems rather dictatorial. It’s a little like silencing remainers by telling them to leave the country

I'd wager that if one had the data to prepare a venn diagram, the two circles would largely cover each other.

We are a constitutional monarchy and most of the freedoms we have today have been hard won from kings and queens - Magna Carta, the Civil War, the Glorious Revolution were key turning points in British history.

In the 20th Century the Windsors were well aware that they needed to keep public support and devised the idea of “service” - their cousins in Europe were swept away and they needed to adapt and listen to the people. Elizabeth II knew this and was a modest person herself while holding such a grand role.

Charles III will need to tread very carefully. It’s only been a few days but I already think the endless proclamations and gun salutes are excessive - especially in a time of economic crisis. The Queen was well-loved and nobody begrudges her a good send-off. But after that Charles should push ahead with his idea of a smaller monarchy. To a lot of people the vast wealth and huge number of residences are too much and they don’t pay a penny of inheritance tax! We think we are in a democracy but this is a reminder there is huge layer of the establishment which is against true meritocracy.

@Newdawnnewdog88 You say "there aren't many practical opportunities or means whereby we can "hold a national conversation" and.... People do not have an easily accessible means of protesting and their views on the subject are never sought."

What can people do to indicate that they'd like to abolish the constitutional monarchy then?

I think Charles has already shown he has opinions and I hope he carries these forward and offers opinions on things eg climate change. It was a very different world when The Queen came to the throne and I hope Charles has a different reigning style that gives us what we need- a stable, sane head of state who doesn’t shy away from telling the politicians when they are being purposely obstinate to our detriment. But thats probably wishful thinking because I don’t think he’ll have much power.

If you don’t like it you can start a petition, lobby your MP, launch a campaign etc. I’d favour something like the Irish Presidency - a non-political elder statesperson in the role. It’s usually good to mix things up a bit and have a change of office from time to time.

I also really dislike the system of primogeniture. No wonder the Royal family is dysfunctional.

His "opinions" mean nothing if he - for example - would not stop an illegal disbanding of Parliament. Or dismiss a Prime Minister who lied to him to do so.

That is in his power now. That was previously in his mother's power. After 70 years on the throne of being moderate and diplomatic, when she saw democracy in her country abused and dismissed illegally before her eyes she... did nothing.

She didn't feel she could without jeopardising her family's position. And that came first, over the fate of her "subjects". Over the law of "her land". Such devotion, we are told.

If they must always be neutral and not ever exercise their powers even to stop the suspension of democracy then they can't be the Head of State. If she couldn't do it after 70 years or service, do you think Charles would, if democracy is illegally suspended again? Not a chance.

So either we tell them very clearly "yes - these are your powers and we absolutely expect you to exercise them in situations like this and prevent politicians overriding Parliament"; or, we make the monarchy purely ceremonial and invest these powers to oversee Parliament in some other body who will actually be prepared to do it (my personal preference); or we disband the monarchy entirely and have an elected head of state invested in these powers.

Or, we wait until someone does something even worse, emboldened by Johnson having got away with that, and suffer the consequences of letting it all slip away.

I bet the ultra royalists are also Brexiteers. Judging by the comments about leaving the country

Wow, you have outed yourself as a massive narrow minded bigot on the first page. PMSL!!!!!! 😂I am actually embarrassed for you. Oh dear! 😆

I'd say those who're telling OP to leave the country because she has a different opinion to them are the narrow minded bigots, actually.

OP I have been gradually coming round to the idea of abolishing the monarchy and the fact that the PM could illegally prologue Parliament and the Head of State was not in a position to stop him has finally convinced me.

An elected Head of State in the European style would have acted as a check on such a thing. We do not need to follow the American model.

I agree OP.

I'm not anyones 'loyal subject'.

I totally agree with the above post and as an aside would like to ask another question about the "defender of faith(s)" role, does anyone else not see a contradiction in being the Head of the Church of England and also being as rich as Croesus? It's kind of the elephant in the room isn't it? If you are doing your best to set an example and follow Jesus's message then surely you make efforts to shed wealth, not retain and accrue it?

How pathetic to say "off you pop" to people who have had enough of pandering to an over privileged family of work shy scroungers.

People have to work long hours and need two incomes just to get by. People will freeze this winter and go hungry, but still have to work hard....

Yet we're expected to support a family who....fly all over the place by private jet or helicopter, have the best education, health care, extravagant holidays...we pay for the upkeep of 100 royal homes, pay for hundreds of servants, footmen, chauffeurs, cooks, valets, butlers......all to pander to their every whim, (whilst their wages are froze to nat min).....

and just why do they need so many homes? It's ludicrous, how anyone can think it's ok is beyond me.....and no I won't "pop off" thank you

Majority vote now supporting the OP. The reactions of some posters, telling the OP to leave the country because they find the OP’a entirely mainstream views upsetting, are absolutely hilarious! 😆

I am by no means a royalist, and once would have probably agreed with you.

However, my mind has since changed, witnessing general politics in the UK, and other countries which are republic and have their heads of state elected in.

With people being elected, and the human species being naturally competitive, if we were to elect a head of state you can guarantee it won’t be their intelligence or love of the country that makes them want to do the job, it’ll be because they are greedy and crave power.

So OP I think YABU, it’s alright saying it’s time to do away with the monarchy, but realistically, worst case scenario without them is not one I wish to witness.

A non-political head of state is worth its weight in gold.

Even more so now, as we can see that democracy is under real threat the world over.

Quite honestly, the monarchy is one of the most interesting things about Britain. Remove it, and you’re just same old, same old as everyone else.

And whether commonwealth counties decide to retain the Crown as head of state, is up to them.

I do wonder what the implications would be for NZ being founding on a treaty between tangata whenua and the Crown.

If one half of the partnership no longer exists, how would we honour Te Tiriti? And if we don’t honour Te Tiriti - if there is a serious get-out clause to that - is this in the best interests of Māori?

@Yubgftr

I bet the ultra royalists are also Brexiteers. Judging by the comments about leaving the country

Not a brexiteer... but absolutely concur with previous posters. You don't HAVE to live here. If you don't like it you have the choice to live elsewhere.

The new king became the king immediately after the queen died. It's automatic The proclamation was just a confirmation of the fact.

would like to ask another question about the "defender of faith(s)" role, does anyone else not see a contradiction in being the Head of the Church of England and also being as rich as Croesus? It's kind of the elephant in the room isn't it? If you are doing your best to set an example and follow Jesus's message then surely you make efforts to shed wealth, not retain and accrue it?

Are you suggesting King Charles sells up and moves into a council flat, then?

Totally agree OP. Elizabeth did her duty very well . May she rest in peace . Now would be a good time to stop this charade after her funeral. I'm not up for the Russian or French option necessarily ; peaceful means please. They all are loaded from centuries of endless pilvering ,so they aren't going to end up in any great hardship . But it's time for cutting the monarchy off and consigning it to a rather antiquated, regressive part of British history.

You don't HAVE to live here. If you don't like it you have the choice to live elsewhere.

It's not that simple for a lot of people, but that's beside the point.

This thread is like if twenty years ago, someone posted on a forum about whether the UK should leave the EU, and the first page or two was full of posters saying "If you don't like being in an EU member country, go live somewhere else, I'm sure you'd like North Korea better. The British people love being in the EU so ha ha, don't let the door hit your arse on the way out. Off you pop. Otherwise suck it up buttercup."

It just sounds silly, like people can't cope with a discussion about anything big and important possibly ever changing. But Brexit proves big things can change. There are lots of posts here which make good and/or interesting arguments for keeping the monarchy, but childish gloating, and unwillingness to accept the legitimacy of choosing to live somewhere and yet wanting to change something about it, does nobody any favours.