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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU not to go to work during the holiday (teacher)?

249 replies

Namechange7000 · 05/09/2022 22:27

I'm a teacher in a village primary school in England but I'm not originally from the UK. Since arriving in England I've only worked as a teacher and I can't tell if my work's expectations are normal for here or not.

We have today and tomorrow as inset days and the children come back to school on Wednesday. Before the summer break the head teacher told us that we couldn’t afford cleaners over the break and that there wouldn't be much time for classroom setup on the inset days and hinted that we should come to work during the break to do it. But by the time the email was sent (end of June) I had already booked my flights to spend the entire break in Australia. My parents live in Sydney and we haven't seen them since before covid so I really wanted my dc to spend some time with them and obviously I wanted to see them too. We had a lovely break and got back to England on Friday so I'd have time to recover from jetlag and be ready to start work today. We got the inset schedule emailed to us on Sunday and there is literally no time scheduled for classroom set up and no planning time. We have back-to-back meetings from 8.30 - 17.00 with an hour for lunch both days but actually today's lunch break was only 40 minutes because the meeting ran late. I had to leave by 17.30 to collect my dc but even if I didn't, the school building is only open until 18.00.

At 17.00 this evening I was in my classroom frantically trying to sort things out. I've moved year groups so I had to move classrooms and there was a summer camp using my new classroom for a month. The previous teacher had to shove all of the teaching materials, toys etc into the cupboards before the break to prevent the summer camp from using them. My manager came into the room this evening and commented on how messy and not ready it is (the furniture is all over the room wherever the summer camp left it, no displays backing paper up, no interactive learning wall displays, no materials out, no book corner set up, no role play area set up, I haven't put the children's names on their pegs, trays, exercise books etc). I explained that I haven't had time to do it but that I'd stay as late as I could and do as much as possible before leaving. She reminded me that we were warned that there wouldn't be time to do it during inset. I explained that I had already booked our flights to Australia before that email was sent and that we couldn't reschedule them that late even if we wanted to. She then said that I should keep in mind that it was paid holiday time and that it is my responsibility to ensure that the classroom is ready before the children arrive on Wednesday. There is no way I can possibly get the classroom ready to the expected standard in time because the building is not open long enough. I will go in at 7.30 to do an hour before inset tomorrow and Wednesday and dh has managed to rearrange his work hours for tomorrow so I can stay until 18:00 and I'll work through my lunch break but that’s still only 4 hours and it’s much, much too much work to do in that time. For context, the example classroom we were all taken to look at as part of the training today took the teacher 6 full days to clean and set up during the break and that wasn't finished. We also only have 1 printer and 1 laminator in the school so there are long waits to get access to them.

I am so stressed and I feel like I’m already failing my class and my own dc. I’m already behind and overwhelmed even though it’s the first day of term. I had a panic attack this evening. I feel like this is my fault for not knowing that I was supposed to work for a week during the holiday but no one told me until it was way too late. Is it common practice here to work during your holiday if it is a paid holiday? I have a salary which is paid in equal instalments throughout the year so I was fully paid for August even though I didn’t work a single day. We have similar arrangements in Australia but my schools there always gave us time to do the admin and class setup before the children arrived (and didn’t have such specific requirements regarding classroom setup). WIBU to go on holiday and not go to work to clean and set up my classroom during the break?

OP posts:
Kite22 · 06/09/2022 21:44

maddy68 · 06/09/2022 08:38

No. You are only contracted for directed time.

That is the law

You are not contracted for any non directed time.

PPA is part of directed time allocation

But that's simply not true.

Teachers can be directed for 1265 hours and then are expected to do the planning and preparation needed to carry out their duties.

I can't remember the exact wording from the Burgundy Book, but that is the gist of it. I realise the Government has done it's absolute best to break up LAs and break up National agreements and a single contract for teachers through academisation, but you can't state that the law says you aren't contracted for non-directed time, as most teachers are.

Newrumpus · 06/09/2022 22:13

Kite22 · 06/09/2022 21:44

But that's simply not true.

Teachers can be directed for 1265 hours and then are expected to do the planning and preparation needed to carry out their duties.

I can't remember the exact wording from the Burgundy Book, but that is the gist of it. I realise the Government has done it's absolute best to break up LAs and break up National agreements and a single contract for teachers through academisation, but you can't state that the law says you aren't contracted for non-directed time, as most teachers are.

Kite22 has this right. However you can not be directed to anything outside of directed time. This is why crazy time consuming policies should be rejected if time is not provided to comply with them. If OP can teach her lessons and assess her pupils progress without elaborate displays then she cannot be required to put up such displays unless she is given the time to do so. Even then, unless her contract states otherwise, she could argue that displays do not require her professional expertise.

Babyboomtastic · 06/09/2022 22:45

Riv · 06/09/2022 18:13

@georgarina when you do the overtime, do you get paid for it, or is it just something that you work on for free to make the job go more smoothly? And if it’s unpaid, how many hours of your own time are you willing to give up?
There’s no overtime for teachers, and even as the “part-time” job that @southlondonerhere suggests ( ie no pay for holidays, although it can be over a 60 hour week during term time), the pay doesn’t begin to match that of other professionals with similar level qualifications.

Professional here who gets paid less than a teacher and who works evenings and weekends and holidays to get the work done, with no extra pay. Or more, did, before a recent make lifestyle change.

In fact, most of the jobs I've had, unpaid overtime is just assumed, and you wouldn't be able to manage the job otherwise. I quit one job in a law firm, as a filing assistant (so low paid, not well regarded), because my boss complained on my second day that I should have been in from 7.30-10pm like her (but paid 9-5).

I'm not talking about people doing the occasional late finish, but regularly being 10-30 hours over contracted hours with no additional pay.

It's wrong, and shouldn't be a race the the button, but I find this concept that only teachers do additional work, work in holidays etc, and no one else does, baffling.

People complaining about needing to come in for a day or two seems a bit petty when you consider some people can't even find time to take all their (meagre) holiday allowance. And no, they aren't always on big bucks.

Brigante9 · 06/09/2022 22:54

Pleasecouldihavesomeadvice · 05/09/2022 22:34

Oh no this sounds incredibly stressful.

It is generally accepted here in the uk that teachers will work a handful of days throughout the summer holidays to get classrooms ready.

It’s a shame that wasn’t mentioned to you before.

i would think the best thing to do it to do some grovelling (it sounds like you already have explained), but tell your head that you just genuinely didn’t realise this was expected. Had you known, you would have had everything sorted.

I’d say that’s untrue in most schools. We had most of Friday free and had to swap rooms. I’ll be adding to my displays when I’m given posters/notices. I’m more focused on ensuring my lessons are ready and I have books to hand out.

IamMummyhearmeROAR · 07/09/2022 20:44

Goawayangryman · 05/09/2022 23:01

@IamMummyhearmeROAR see, your school is one I would want to send my kids to. Kudos to you, your colleagues, and the head.

I've had a tough day today and I read your comment at lunchtime. It really lifted me, so thank you.

luckylavender · 07/09/2022 20:56

countdowntonap · 05/09/2022 22:42

@NoSquirrels I don’t know a single teacher who does! 3-5 days 😳 Is this primary school?

Yes. That's my experience too & I'm not a teacher.

luckylavender · 07/09/2022 21:00

mnahmnah · 05/09/2022 22:40

She’s wrong - it’s not paid holidays! We are paid for term time only. You are not paid to work in the holidays.

Don’t worry about the mess and chaos. Do a little here and there as you go.

if it’s any consolation, I went back to work on Wednesday. I haven’t had any time at all since then to plan lessons or get things copied etc as the time has all been directed. We can only do what we have the time to do!

I am a big supporter of teachers, always. But I hate this 'we don't get paid for holidays' rhetoric. You get paid every month. Stop splitting hairs.

gogohmm · 07/09/2022 21:06

My friends school provides childcare for the final week of the holiday so teachers with children can come in and set up for the new term plus for the two inset days. Providing 4 days of childcare;basically paying one of the TA's I think is a great balance ( my friend gets a chance to go out for lunch with colleagues while their kids are being watched!

Zonder · 07/09/2022 21:15

luckylavender · 07/09/2022 21:00

I am a big supporter of teachers, always. But I hate this 'we don't get paid for holidays' rhetoric. You get paid every month. Stop splitting hairs.

It's just a fact that teachers don't get paid for all the holidays. They get paid for 5 or 6 weeks of holidays and not the other 7 or 8 weeks. But the annual salary is divided by 12 so they get an equal amount per month. That's just the way it is.

Newrumpus · 07/09/2022 21:57

luckylavender · 07/09/2022 21:00

I am a big supporter of teachers, always. But I hate this 'we don't get paid for holidays' rhetoric. You get paid every month. Stop splitting hairs.

It’s not rhetoric. It’s fact.

EntertainingandFactual · 08/09/2022 05:02

luckylavender · 07/09/2022 21:00

I am a big supporter of teachers, always. But I hate this 'we don't get paid for holidays' rhetoric. You get paid every month. Stop splitting hairs.

@luckylavender
I’m not sure what you are saying there…

Teachers have contracted hours, get statutory paid holidays in line with other public sector workers and all other weeks, weekends, evenings are unpaid.

Term time contracted hours are paid over 12 months so that we get the same wage every month. It’s easier to budget that way.

Iamnotthe1 · 08/09/2022 07:16

Providing 4 days of childcare;basically paying one of the TA's I think is a great balance ( my friend gets a chance to go out for lunch with colleagues while their kids are being watched!

I wouldn't say this is balance. This is basically saying: "We'll have someone watch your kids so you can come in and do a load of unpaid work for us, during your holiday, on things that we really should give you time to do during your paid hours."

If your friend thinks this is a great balance too then I'm afraid there is some gaslighting going on in this school.

LowDownn · 08/09/2022 07:23

AdriannaP · 05/09/2022 22:45

After 6 weeks paid holidays you have to work overtime for 2 days and you can’t cope? No wonder people think teachers are lazy.

Teachers aren’t paid for the holidays. Teachers are paid for the statutory minimum holidays and the rest are unpaid. OP was being expected to go into work during her unpaid holiday.

Namechange7000 · 08/09/2022 19:38

Thanks everyone for all of the messages. I haven't read them all yet but I'm here with an update.
I have spoken to my union and it is definitely not ok that they were expecting us to work in the holidays. The union rep has spoken to the head teacher and also one of the governors. My head teacher has apologised to me / us which was nice. We will be having a bit more of a union presence in the school going forwards which I think would be helpful. We also do not get PPA in the last week of term or the first week of term so I'm hoping that will get fixed too. When the staff are doing so much more than they are contracted to (the teachers are doing 60-70 hours in an average week), it is very disheartening that the school was not even follow the bare minimum set out in the contracts. It was also nice to find out that I am not the only member of staff at the school who is struggling.

OP posts:
Zonder · 08/09/2022 19:48

Wow what union is that? Weird.

When do they suggest you set things up? Given that we have 195 directed days, children get 190 teaching days and we have 5 inset days. Are they suggesting that inset days are used to do work? That's not what inset days are for.__

Revolvingwhore · 08/09/2022 19:49

user1474315215 · 05/09/2022 22:38

I'm sorry, but it's perfectly normal to set up your classroom during the holidays. INSET days are for training, not set up.

The fuck are you talking about? Any school that doesn't at least part of inset for teachers to get ready is a shit hole.

Namechange7000 · 08/09/2022 20:32

@Zonder The union is called NEU. There is a rep based in one of our partner schools so they were able to act really quickly and without much fuss. I don't think they advise the school about when work should be assigned, just reminded them of when it cannot be assigned (i.e. reminded them that my employment contract does not allow for them to assign tasks to be done during the holidays).

OP posts:
Valeriekat · 09/09/2022 01:58

NoSquirrels · 05/09/2022 22:41

Oh dear.

Sorry OP, but I don’t know a single teacher (primary or secondary) who doesn’t spend 3-5 days in school over the holidays to set up classrooms.

Inset days are training days - professional development - not admin days.

Is this your first full year as a U.K. teacher?

Well you shouldn't do it.
You are NOT being paid for the summer holiday
You are NOT a cleaner.
I cant believe how many of you think that this is acceptable.

Valeriekat · 09/09/2022 02:11

balabears · 06/09/2022 08:25

Except for the fact that they really do do that!

DH is a teacher, we have a laminator, a back up laminator and a printer with a print plan. He is not the only one, of course he isn’t.

Most working people have a printer at home and a A4 laminator is cheap.

Shush ya self!

Ink and laminating pouches are expensive. Teachers should not be paying for all these things themselves.

Mum233 · 09/09/2022 03:40

Teacher here. Yes it’s the norm here (we’ll certainly every school I have worked in) to prepare classroom over the holiday. Sorry OP.

MistressIggi · 09/09/2022 08:05

Teachers in my song's primary prepared rooms in the last week of term, including swapping the class to a new room if they had to be somewhere else after the holidays. I think that was very sensible

ThrallsWife · 09/09/2022 08:13

Please, for the love of all that matters, start pushing back more.

The question I always ask is, how does it benefit the children? Displays that are not either crucial information (like safeguarding information or emergency procedures) or done to celebrate students' achievement (which would not be done before day 1 of actual teaching) are a pointless exercise.

So on a list of priorities, they'd drop right down.
I had no time to do my classroom last year. In the end, they magically found non-teaching people to do the backing for me in the first week of teaching and they put the few bits and pieces I've been given on there. Was I popular with SLT? Nope. Did I use my time more productively, like actual lesson planning which directly benefitted my kids? You bet.

Start saying no. No one has ever got sacked because they didn't do their displays.

Newrumpus · 09/09/2022 20:02

ThrallsWife · Today 08:13
Please, for the love of all that matters, start pushing back more.

The question I always ask is, how does it benefit the children?

Exactly. Is there any evidence that these policy-compliant displays result in greater outcomes for children. Do they enhance well-being or earning potential?

Porcupineintherough · 09/09/2022 20:30

Being taught by teachers who are not burnt out enhances the children's learning experience.

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