Page 15 | To be struggling to survive on 65k household income

Soddinghell · 2022-09-05T19:38:50+00:00

By the time we have paid mortgage, phone bills, bills car insurance, kids activities etc we barely have anything left. I don’t know what’s going on. DH earns 50k and I earn 15k part time. Please somebody help me I am thinking of going full time to stay afloat, I don’t know where we are going wrong, we are not in London or an expensive area, just outside manchester and people keep telling us we should be fine. We are not though!

CherryGenoa · 06/09/2022 09:33

Haven’t read the whole thread but some of us are happy to offer constructive advice if you are willing to post your outgoings. A big mortgage and nursery fees / student loan payments would soon use up that salary.

PerfectlyPreservedQuagaarWarrior · 06/09/2022 09:34

ScarlettOHaraHamiltonKennedyButler · 06/09/2022 09:32

I love how everyone is quick to critiscise anything that they see as frivoulous spending without thinking of the knock on effect of when this is stopped.

To some people getting your nails done may be a waste of money, or getting a takeaway, or a coffee and cake but that spending creates jobs. So yes now that we are in this cost crisis people who could previously afford to get their nails done now can't, so the salon loses customers and cuts jobs or closes. The takeaway loses customers so cuts staff and closes, so does the coffee shop.

People get rid of their cleaners, stop using their dog walkers, stop going to restaurants, stop getting their hair done etc. etc. this all has a knock on effect. So yes people will just have to cut down but everyone needs to wake up to the serious consequences of this instead of acting like people were silly to be spending this money in the first place, back when they could comfortably afford it.

Exactly. I don't think this puritanism is helpful. People don't have to sympathise with the 65k household who feel they can't afford these things any more, but it would be a nice touch if they could locate a few fucks for the beauticians, chefs, kids entertainers etc who are mostly not very well paid even now and are going to be really screwed over.

carefullycourageous · 06/09/2022 09:36

The problem we have in the UK is that the 'average' wage no longer buys enough to be considered by most people as an acceptable level. So either the average needs to rise, so it buys the same amount of stuff it used to, or we have to just accept people will be poorer in real terms.

£65k is an above average household income, by a decent percentage. That does NOT mean it is a 'high' income in terms of what you can buy with it. The 'average' in a country can be too low - and that is the situation we have in the UK, really. Wages from low to middle are too low, obviously at the bottom end they are far too low. Living on 2 x minimum wage is not enough to give a decent standard of living.

Wages have been flat since 2010, but costs are rising all the time and rapidly now.

Plexie · 06/09/2022 09:40

I doubt the OP is coming back...

But £600 a month on nursery fees is like a second mortgage. Of course that's going to be a big chunk of your income.

carefullycourageous · 06/09/2022 09:44

ScarlettOHaraHamiltonKennedyButler · 06/09/2022 09:32

I love how everyone is quick to critiscise anything that they see as frivoulous spending without thinking of the knock on effect of when this is stopped.

To some people getting your nails done may be a waste of money, or getting a takeaway, or a coffee and cake but that spending creates jobs. So yes now that we are in this cost crisis people who could previously afford to get their nails done now can't, so the salon loses customers and cuts jobs or closes. The takeaway loses customers so cuts staff and closes, so does the coffee shop.

People get rid of their cleaners, stop using their dog walkers, stop going to restaurants, stop getting their hair done etc. etc. this all has a knock on effect. So yes people will just have to cut down but everyone needs to wake up to the serious consequences of this instead of acting like people were silly to be spending this money in the first place, back when they could comfortably afford it.

Oh totally agree.

Why has the UK become a race to the bottom? We used to be an aspirational country where you could earn a decent wage and build some security - which also meant paying others for services which helped build jobs across the economy. It is just getting tougher all round now.

Weirdlynormal · 06/09/2022 09:45

ScarlettOHaraHamiltonKennedyButler · 06/09/2022 09:32

I love how everyone is quick to critiscise anything that they see as frivoulous spending without thinking of the knock on effect of when this is stopped.

To some people getting your nails done may be a waste of money, or getting a takeaway, or a coffee and cake but that spending creates jobs. So yes now that we are in this cost crisis people who could previously afford to get their nails done now can't, so the salon loses customers and cuts jobs or closes. The takeaway loses customers so cuts staff and closes, so does the coffee shop.

People get rid of their cleaners, stop using their dog walkers, stop going to restaurants, stop getting their hair done etc. etc. this all has a knock on effect. So yes people will just have to cut down but everyone needs to wake up to the serious consequences of this instead of acting like people were silly to be spending this money in the first place, back when they could comfortably afford it.

The point is that the economy has grown on the back of excess spending, but when we go into a recession - which we always do, then you going into debt quickly because you have no savings, isn't helping anyone, least of all yourself.

The not spending on the 'frivolous' doesn't mean I don't spend, but it does mean I save for a rainy day. Right now it's fucking pissing it down.

notalwaysalondoner · 06/09/2022 09:46

I know what you mean, we’re about to start paying for dc to go to nursery four days a week and it’s £1200, that’s a lot to find on top of tripled energy bills which in our freezing ancient cottage will likely be near £1000 per month too by January thanks to an electric boiler. We’re not low earners at all but I’m very aware if we earnt what you do or less we’d really struggle. I do think there is a lot of lifestyle creep, in our mid twenties DH and I only earnt about a quarter of what we do now but it doesn’t feel like we have a crazy different lifestyle, but then when I think about it, I always buy lunch when we go out for the day, I always buy coffee and cake when I’m meeting friends, I don’t really carefully check prices any more… it’s not like I go nuts and have loads of designer labels but I’ve got lazy about spending, and I think that’s where a lot of the money winds up going. It’s going to have to change.

HeyBlaby · 06/09/2022 09:48

Unfortunately unless you have an income of less than the square root of absolutely nothing and claim every benefit known to man kind, you're classed as 'well off' on Mumsnet.

EarlofShrewsbury · 06/09/2022 09:51

Metabigot · 05/09/2022 22:20

I'm the same OP and the simple but boring answer is learning to say no.

No to the coffee at the coffee shop
No to the expensive haircut
No to non essential new clothes
No to impulse supermarket buys
No to a drink out with friends even occasionally

Etc

I only earn 17k a year and I am just about getting by OK as I have family helping with childcare and I live in a house with fairly cheap rent (council house). I would be saying no to most of those things and that's fine, I don't earn much.

However, if I had an income of 65k I would feel very hard done by if I still had to say no to those things.

Times are shit right now and its OK to be disheartened by it, whatever you earn.

Tanith · 06/09/2022 09:51

ScarlettOHaraHamiltonKennedyButler · 06/09/2022 09:32

I love how everyone is quick to critiscise anything that they see as frivoulous spending without thinking of the knock on effect of when this is stopped.

To some people getting your nails done may be a waste of money, or getting a takeaway, or a coffee and cake but that spending creates jobs. So yes now that we are in this cost crisis people who could previously afford to get their nails done now can't, so the salon loses customers and cuts jobs or closes. The takeaway loses customers so cuts staff and closes, so does the coffee shop.

People get rid of their cleaners, stop using their dog walkers, stop going to restaurants, stop getting their hair done etc. etc. this all has a knock on effect. So yes people will just have to cut down but everyone needs to wake up to the serious consequences of this instead of acting like people were silly to be spending this money in the first place, back when they could comfortably afford it.

Exactly! And why shouldn't people spend money doing these things instead of invoking the miserly spirit of Edwina Currie as we rush to knit our wooly scarves and pad our radiators with tin foil?

Klippetyklip · 06/09/2022 09:54

Middleagedandcreaking · 05/09/2022 22:26

@ImAvingOops those on much lower incomes can often be better off since their housing costs/council tax are supplemented with benefits, free prescriptions, winter fuel allowances (if pensioners), bus passes (again if retired) and many on lower income will be getting extra cash going towards the heating bills. I honestly don't think the help is as much as you think. If you get all you have listed you will be on a very low income and even with help it will still be relatively low to average earnings. I think entitlement to prescriptions, winter fuel allowance etc goes I've you earn £9k a year.

Very true. At the beginning of this year our income dropped to 12k gross for a few months. We weren’t entitled to any financial help at all except contribution based USA for 6 months and after that nothing.

andymary · 06/09/2022 09:54

£65k doesn't get you nearly as far as it did 10 years ago. Every household is different, and no family should be compared to the next. No-one should be comparing themselves to your situation to try and put you down OP.

Monthly Incoming After Tax, NI & 3% Pension
£4150

Monthly Outgoings
Mortgage £1000
Electric/Gas £250
Food Shopping £500
Nursery £600
Gymnastics/Swimming £100
Mobile Phones £40 (2x £20 Sim Cards)
Internet £40
Sky/Virgin TV £60
TV License £12
Council Tax £150
Car Insurance £80 (Two Cars at £40 each)
Petrol £100 (Two Cars at £50 each)
Subscriptions (Netflix/Prime/Disney/Spotify) £40
Home Insurance £35
Life Insurance £20
Pets £100
Debt Repayment (Loan/Credit Card based on the UK debt average) £200
Family Activities £200
Holiday Savings £200
Christmas Savings £100
Clothes £100
Eating Out £100
Total Out: £4027

So taking this into consideration, it's very tight - one extra bill could easily take you over your budget.
Could you cut down on a lot of stuff? Sure. Should you have to? No. It's not you and your families fault that the world is falling apart and the price of everything is dramatically rocketing up.

Zeus44 · 06/09/2022 09:58

The last post is utter rubbish, you choose to pay for subscriptions, you choose to do activities and to have 2 cars and have pets and all the upkeep that goes with both.

You can’t blame everyone else for problems with things becoming more expensive. You have to cut your cloth accordingly and know when and where to cut back.

Zeus44 · 06/09/2022 09:59

Personally, I would step down the mortgage, switch off pension contributions and look for a pay rise or better job.

JaneBrowning · 06/09/2022 10:02

Not all boomers had it easy. There was a lot of social and economic upheaval in their lives too. Opportunity for things like Uni just weren’t there. Todays cost of living crisis also happened in the 70s. You can’t directly compare where a boomer is today after sixty years hard graft to where a younger person is today with decades fewer of hard graft

@Discovereads You're talking about me. (YES some of us are on MN)

I think you have got your figures worng. No one works for 60 years (unless they carry on till they are 80.)

I graduated in the mid 1970s. We had the winter of discontent, fuel rationing, blackouts (homework by candlelight) , water from standpipes in 1976, high inflation and a few years later when buying my first home, interest rates of 15%.

The big difference is housing costs. We managed to buy on 1 salary and I was a SAHM for 4 years, followed by working p/t when DCs were at school. Never paid for child care - there was very little around then, other than a few very pricy nurseries or childminders - and didn't have any family nearby to help.

We didn't over stretch ourselves with a super- high mortgage, but when the DCs were at uni we had the equlivalent of 2nd mortgage as we were paying a lot of their living costs.

We never had expensive holidays, were good at saving and were pretty frugal a lot of the time. Now, our savings are going towards the DCs own house purchases to help them out.

Shineshinecoast10 · 06/09/2022 10:04

Day20 · 05/09/2022 20:42

Poor money management and I think people will be offended by your post who are less fortunate.

So many variants how much is your weekly food shop? How expensive are your phone contracts? You could use sim only once they have ended. Gymnastics could be dropped. Do you have sky? Takeaways?

Yes I agree. I wish I could send my DS to more kids clubs but unfortunately it's not an esstential cost.

I'm sure there is stuff you could cut down on if you really needed to

BarbaraofSeville · 06/09/2022 10:04

andymary · 06/09/2022 09:54

£65k doesn't get you nearly as far as it did 10 years ago. Every household is different, and no family should be compared to the next. No-one should be comparing themselves to your situation to try and put you down OP.

Monthly Incoming After Tax, NI & 3% Pension
£4150

Monthly Outgoings
Mortgage £1000
Electric/Gas £250
Food Shopping £500
Nursery £600
Gymnastics/Swimming £100
Mobile Phones £40 (2x £20 Sim Cards)
Internet £40
Sky/Virgin TV £60
TV License £12
Council Tax £150
Car Insurance £80 (Two Cars at £40 each)
Petrol £100 (Two Cars at £50 each)
Subscriptions (Netflix/Prime/Disney/Spotify) £40
Home Insurance £35
Life Insurance £20
Pets £100
Debt Repayment (Loan/Credit Card based on the UK debt average) £200
Family Activities £200
Holiday Savings £200
Christmas Savings £100
Clothes £100
Eating Out £100
Total Out: £4027

So taking this into consideration, it's very tight - one extra bill could easily take you over your budget.
Could you cut down on a lot of stuff? Sure. Should you have to? No. It's not you and your families fault that the world is falling apart and the price of everything is dramatically rocketing up.

That's not 'very tight' there's quite a lot of slack in that budget.

Mobile Phones £40 (2x £20 Sim Cards) You can get near unlimited everything for £10 a month

Sky/Virgin TV £60
TV License £12
Subscriptions (Netflix/Prime/Disney/Spotify) £40

You've got £100 on pay TV here - either get Sky or a couple of the subscriptions and swap and change, you don't need all that

Home Insurance £35 quite a lot, we pay just over half that and that includes extra for expensive bikes

Quite a lot of lifestyle spending here
Gymnastics/Swimming £100
Family Activities £200
Eating Out £100

Plus you've accounted for just about all annual/irregular expenses like clothes, Christmas, holidays so there shouldn't really be 'unexpected bills', only thing you seem to have missed is car repairs and white goods replacement, but the cost of that could be found by reducing the cost of some of the things mentioned above that you're overpaying for plus you've got over £100 'spare' in that list.

AnImmenseDislikeOfPeople · 06/09/2022 10:09

DH and I are on combined of £45,000 before tax. Two children and a dog. A mortgage, bills, car. We are managing fine. Yes, we don't just go on holiday or buy extravagant things. But I cannot understand why people are struggling on combined salaries more than ours. We still get takeaways or go our for dinner. It blows my mind that people think £65,000 is a struggle. I'm sure someone on here the other day was saying they couldn't survive off of £75,000.

ScarlettOHaraHamiltonKennedyButler · 06/09/2022 10:09

Weirdlynormal · 06/09/2022 09:45

The point is that the economy has grown on the back of excess spending, but when we go into a recession - which we always do, then you going into debt quickly because you have no savings, isn't helping anyone, least of all yourself.

The not spending on the 'frivolous' doesn't mean I don't spend, but it does mean I save for a rainy day. Right now it's fucking pissing it down.

Show quote history

but I could afford frivilous spending and savings. Now I can't but I won't be stopping saving, my savings don't help the poor people who will be out if jobs when more and more people cut their spending will they?

Hurrrrrah · 06/09/2022 10:09

andymary · 06/09/2022 09:54

£65k doesn't get you nearly as far as it did 10 years ago. Every household is different, and no family should be compared to the next. No-one should be comparing themselves to your situation to try and put you down OP.

Monthly Incoming After Tax, NI & 3% Pension
£4150

Monthly Outgoings
Mortgage £1000
Electric/Gas £250
Food Shopping £500
Nursery £600
Gymnastics/Swimming £100
Mobile Phones £40 (2x £20 Sim Cards)
Internet £40
Sky/Virgin TV £60
TV License £12
Council Tax £150
Car Insurance £80 (Two Cars at £40 each)
Petrol £100 (Two Cars at £50 each)
Subscriptions (Netflix/Prime/Disney/Spotify) £40
Home Insurance £35
Life Insurance £20
Pets £100
Debt Repayment (Loan/Credit Card based on the UK debt average) £200
Family Activities £200
Holiday Savings £200
Christmas Savings £100
Clothes £100
Eating Out £100
Total Out: £4027

So taking this into consideration, it's very tight - one extra bill could easily take you over your budget.
Could you cut down on a lot of stuff? Sure. Should you have to? No. It's not you and your families fault that the world is falling apart and the price of everything is dramatically rocketing up.

You've missed off student loans and pensions, that's a considerable chunk for 2 people it's around £600 combined for my husband and I, we don't earn loans more compared to op.

JaneBrowning · 06/09/2022 10:10

@andymary WOW! I could get rid of 70% of what is on your list!

Mortgage £1000
Electric/Gas £250
Food Shopping £500
Nursery £600
Gymnastics/Swimming £100 NOT ESSENTIAL
Mobile Phones £40 (2x £20 Sim Cards) VERY HIGH
Internet £40 VERY HIGH
Sky/Virgin TV £60 NOT ESSENTIAL
TV License £12
Council Tax £150
Car Insurance £80 (Two Cars at £40 each) SEEMS HIGH (MINE IS £150 pa)
Petrol £100 (Two Cars at £50 each)
Subscriptions (Netflix/Prime/Disney/Spotify) £40 NOT ESSENTIAL
Home Insurance £35
Life Insurance £20
Pets £100 A LIFETYLE CHOICE
Debt Repayment (Loan/Credit Card based on the UK debt average) £200 POOR FINACIAL PLANNING
Family Activities £200 AS WELL AS ALL THE ABOVE?
Holiday Savings £200 SAVING FOR HOLS YET PAYING OFF DEBTS?
Christmas Savings £100 £1200 ON XMAS PRESENTS?
Clothes £100 EVERY MONTH? NOT ESSENTIAL
Eating Out £100 NOT ESSENTIAL

gamerchick · 06/09/2022 10:11

ScarlettOHaraHamiltonKennedyButler · 06/09/2022 09:32

I love how everyone is quick to critiscise anything that they see as frivoulous spending without thinking of the knock on effect of when this is stopped.

To some people getting your nails done may be a waste of money, or getting a takeaway, or a coffee and cake but that spending creates jobs. So yes now that we are in this cost crisis people who could previously afford to get their nails done now can't, so the salon loses customers and cuts jobs or closes. The takeaway loses customers so cuts staff and closes, so does the coffee shop.

People get rid of their cleaners, stop using their dog walkers, stop going to restaurants, stop getting their hair done etc. etc. this all has a knock on effect. So yes people will just have to cut down but everyone needs to wake up to the serious consequences of this instead of acting like people were silly to be spending this money in the first place, back when they could comfortably afford it.

Absolutely agree. Frankly I'm alarmed at the more frequent these posts are happening. Middle to high income earners who are feeling the pinch. Yes they could tighten their belts but at what cost?

Hurrrrrah · 06/09/2022 10:11

Just noticed 3% pension? That's not very much to be paying in, the minimum for our schemes is way more than that.

Crocwok · 06/09/2022 10:12

JaneBrowning · 06/09/2022 10:10

@andymary WOW! I could get rid of 70% of what is on your list!

Mortgage £1000
Electric/Gas £250
Food Shopping £500
Nursery £600
Gymnastics/Swimming £100 NOT ESSENTIAL
Mobile Phones £40 (2x £20 Sim Cards) VERY HIGH
Internet £40 VERY HIGH
Sky/Virgin TV £60 NOT ESSENTIAL
TV License £12
Council Tax £150
Car Insurance £80 (Two Cars at £40 each) SEEMS HIGH (MINE IS £150 pa)
Petrol £100 (Two Cars at £50 each)
Subscriptions (Netflix/Prime/Disney/Spotify) £40 NOT ESSENTIAL
Home Insurance £35
Life Insurance £20
Pets £100 A LIFETYLE CHOICE
Debt Repayment (Loan/Credit Card based on the UK debt average) £200 POOR FINACIAL PLANNING
Family Activities £200 AS WELL AS ALL THE ABOVE?
Holiday Savings £200 SAVING FOR HOLS YET PAYING OFF DEBTS?
Christmas Savings £100 £1200 ON XMAS PRESENTS?
Clothes £100 EVERY MONTH? NOT ESSENTIAL
Eating Out £100 NOT ESSENTIAL

Well of course, but what a miserable existence when but a few months ago even it was affordable.

CoastalWave · 06/09/2022 10:12

Ignore the idiots commenting.

DH brings home £2k a month, I bring in £1.2.

We are massively struggling. Mortgage is £1000. Still trying to pay back credit cards after DH losing his job during Covid - so paying back £500 a month on those. That's half our income gone just like that. Adding in normal bills, food and fuel, literally bugger all left.