To think that fairly soon it will be impossible to retire unless you're a homeowner?

[Echobelly]

... at least in some parts of the country.

I'm sort of amazed this isn't being talked about - we have more and more people who can never afford to buy, whose rent payments take a significant chunk of their salary, and that chunk only goes up and up. How are they supposed to save for a pension when all their money goes on rent? And there's very little social housing to go round.

Homeowners at least will mostly be able to pay off mortgages, that are likely to be less than rent and allow them to pay into pensions, and have the option of downsizing to help manage retirement.

In the next few decades it seems likely we will see increasing numbers of people who reach retirement age, or may simply no longer be well enough to work, yet their pensions will not cover rent, let alone anything else. But no one's thinking about how society is supposed to cope with this and won't until it's too late it appears.

It's partly why I was so keen to buy - though early years of mortgage and first house repair wise was very hard and we had to very careful with location and many areas we couldn't afford to buy in.

I do agree with PP - people in social housing may be better of than owners- but people in private rentals will be worst off.

When we were ftb many houses we saw needed a lot of work because previous owners hadn't money for upkeep - so that's a concern that may well keep us working past current retrenchment ages.

Housing Benefit is more generous for retirees than working people. The bedroom tax doesn’t apply, and it’s still a stand alone payment rather than wrapped up in universal credit.

A working person who is renting and relying on UC to top up wages will be better off in retirement than they are now. State pension, plus pension credit, housing benefit, bus pass, winter fuel payment.

I always wanted to own my own property as some money towards my retirement. I am fully expecting my son to live with me and save up however I have had his own little house deposit fund going since he was born and will continue to do so.

there will be lots of people who say they will work till the day they die. But the employers probably won’t want them because they will be a lot slower than the younger employees. And I fear they will be pushed out by the employers who resent paying them high salaries for less productivity.

@Echobelly

I disagree ... I know many couples - and single people - who will be paying their mortgage til they are 70-72.

I also know many couples - and single people - who rent (social housing) who retired fairly recently at 65-66 years old, and they get their rent paid by housing benefit.

Someone being a homeowner is no more likely to retire at 66-67, than someone who rents (because, as I said, they will get their rent paid in most cases.) I am puzzled that so many people think people who are homeowners will be more likely to retire earlier/on time etc.

It’s always better to buy than rent over a lifetime as the property is an appreciating asset over the long term. The amount you spent to do it up is probably reflected in the new higher value.

over a lifetime, owning is more cushty than renting. Btw I own so I am aware of the difficulties of owning too.

I feel like nobody is talking about this - that our current system is based on the theory that someone will get to retirement age having paid off a mortgage outright - and it's going to be a disaster when 40% of an age group are still renting or paying off a mortgage they could only take out later in life and need to have enough to cover it. Where is the money going to come from for all this housing benefit? (When I was last on HB in the late 00s, the figure I was given was based on 'average area rent', which turned out to be 3/4 of the cost of the room I was renting as a lodger - I had to make up the rest out of my unemployment benefit which left me with about £20 a week to live off. With private rents going up all the time, to the point that there are bidding wars for rentals in some places, who's to say it will even cover it?)

They won't in many cases have homes that can be sold for carehome fees, or used to help their children purchase homes of their own...and people are either trying to have children later in life or choosing not to because they can't afford their own homes, or can't afford to rent anywhere big enough.

The alternative would have been paying tens to hundreds of thousands of pounds on a home that doesn't belong to you, may well be poorly maintained, and that cannot be sold later if you wanted to downsize. You've put money into an asset.

I have a mortgage free home but cashed in my two private pensions during the pandemic. I anticipate getting a lodger in as and when ds moves out. Pension credit plus a lodger I can get by. I will be getting rid of my car too.

Why did you cash in your pensions, out of interest? I have a private one I can't access yet - I keep looking at it and thinking it would be more valuable if I could use that money as a deposit and not have to wait a couple more years - but it seems to have gone up a lot since the pandemic recovery?

Sad to admit this, but in some cases, it's true. I know a few people right now (aged late 50s) who have managers who are desperate to get rid of them as they are slower than the younger ones, and do seem a bit lazier too, and have a very entitled attitude. They have a real 'I've been here 20/30 years I'll do what I want' attitude.

And some of the over 55s seem to be off a lot with ill health.

One man at my SIL's place has had approximately a third of this year (so far) off sick. I shit you not. He is 58, and has put sick notes in for a bad back, depression, an intense migraine, and a 'frozen shoulder,' and he has also been off several times with tummy bugs. He also demands Christmas off every year because his mum died on Christmas Eve... 23 years ago!!! Yeah, it's understandable to want it off for 2 or 3 years afterwards, but almost a quarter century later! LOL fuck off! The manager seems a bit afraid of him and always makes sure he gets it off.

Everyone is sick of him, but the manager is seemingly powerless to do anything about him as he always has sick notes off the doctor. He is paid more than most of the employees too, because he has been there so long. He keeps bragging that they 'couldn't afford' to get rid of him!

Disclaimer: Not ALL people over 55 are a bit lazy and entitled btw, just a few people I know/know of.

No it hasn't
I sound a similar age to you and have ridden the same wave.
I'm not so blind I can't see its harder for young people now though. You sound very much like the 'just stop having takeaway coffee' lot.

I have to admit, I have limited sympathy elderly people living in family size homes they can't afford to heat or maintain. Just sell and more to a smaller place.

Dsis privately rents a tiny one bed, the living space is miniscule. With the rent and work costs (travel etc). She's left with approx £100 per week to pay all her bills, buy food etc. She's in her late 40's and realistically, unless she partners up, that will be her life until retirement. However, her area has a decent amount of "over 55's" housing, which she is going to apply for as soon as she can. Lower rent, bigger space. And once she does retire she'll have approx £200 a week to live on, so double what she has now. Her rent will be covered by HB (this older peoples housing falls within the limits) and she likely won't pay council tax either. She can't wait!

I'm in SH and there's no bedroom tax currently. If they reverse that I could just get a lodger when the time comes. I'll have no maintenance/repair costs. I was a single mum of 2 on benefits for a spell, and that is less than one single pensioner gets, and I managed then so I don't forsee a problem. I have simple tastes, live centrally, everything I need is here. I've been doing all my "big" travel in my working years, so happy enough to slow down when I retire.

In my experience, most pensioners don't want to downsize. They're happy in their home and don't want the hassle. That's the situation my mum is in. She inherited a fair bit later in life and bought a small home outright. It's not huge so I don't think she'd make much from downsizing and she really wouldn't want to. She used the last of her savings for a new boiler that was desperately needed. Now she lives in fear of something else needing repairing which she won't be able to afford. She hasn't decorated in years. She says herself the whole place will need gutting when she's gone.

So basically it's not that simple. If you have a good pension, it matters less whether you own or rent. Though obviously home owners will be in the best position. If you're going to be reliant on state pension, renting can be better in some ways.

I think at least some people will have learned a lesson from their own parents who stayed in unsuitable housing they couldn't cope with when elderly. I know loads of people talking about having to move somewhere more suitable and not leaving it too late.

Indeed.
Since the Tories came to power life expectance in the UK has actually fallen (pre covid) amongst some groups, not the rich though, obviously.

Where I live there are lots of retirement flats for sale, some have been on the market for a couple of years and don't sell because of the management/service fees. I wonder in years to come would it be sensible for the council to buy these flats to house OAPs who need small low maintenance rentals?

I agree Op this is a ticking financial time bomb.
In the past those who could buy, bought and those who couldn't got a council house. Either way, they had a secure place to live and raise a family. When they retired, homeowners mortgage was paid off so minimal ongoing costs, council tenants, got HB which was basically a money-go-round from one council dept to another. Either way, minimal costs to the resident or tax payer.

Margret Thatcher sold off vast numbers of council houses (along with public utilities (how's that working out for us?)) didn't replace housing. So now, people rent from private LL , pay the rent themselves when working, then they retire, what then? The public pick up a massive housing benefit bill for them that's paid to private landlords.

Maybe Thatcher did plan it all and that's why the Tories are so relaxed about it. What better way to funnel public money, and money from ordinary people, into the hands of the wealthy.

And we're still not there yet. Who'd have thought it would take so long ?

However, we're still on course, so will get there eventually.

There is also a lack of suitable housing for homeowners to downsize to that is in the right places, which doesn't help. Many older people would like to downsize, but if the only alternatives are boxy flats by A roads that require a car and aren't walkable to amenities, it's no good.

Yes this will be me. Renting with zero chance of home ownership and zero chance of retiring.

I’m very lucky in that I have a reasonable teacher’s pension (not enough to live on solely), i work part time and my DH works full time on just above minimum wage. We were able to pay off our mortgage and downsize when I retired which allowed me to go part time as we no longer have a £700 a month mortgage to pay. My house would cost me around £1500 a month to rent. If at some point in the future when both of us are fully retired and have less income (DH doesn’t have a private pension) we should still be OK financially and if the worst comes to the worst we could organise equity release to help fund out retirement. As I said through, I’m very lucky.

My MIL's ex didn't work for many years and when they divorced, my MIL paid him 100k for his share of the house. He moved to Thailand and still seems to be solvent; he is even supporting a Thai wife! He hasn't worked for 30 years so had no pension.

I suspect that more people would retire to Asia for this reason.

I’m very lucky in that I have

Probably not a great idea to publicise how you are evading the dragnet. It just becomes a shopping list for the next chancellor.

If you can afford to retire, and aren't part of the elite, then it's a mistake that needs to be rectified.

I know of single professional who have bought a property with another similar person.
Others have bought a property and then rented a room a a student at the local college.