Did you eat ‘forbidden foods’ in pregnancy?

[Wouldloveanother]

After 2 weeks of horrendous morning (all day) sickness and accompanying gastro problems, I NEEDED a smoked salmon and cream cheese sandwich. Bought one from Tesco, it went down a treat, currently smacking my lips and feeling better than I have for a day or two.

But… the NHS website says to be ‘careful’ with smoked salmon. Surely Tesco sandwiches are pretty safe? Have I committed a pregnancy crime?

Get yourself a copy of Expecting Better by Emily Oster @Wouldloveanother. She’s an economics professor who got frustrated by how vague pregnancy advice is (e.g. when you’re told there is some risk from eating xx foods - and midwives can’t explain how high that risk is, what the percentage of bad outcomes is, whether the risk comes from eating in moderation or eating huge amounts etc. and just say it’s best to avoid it.)

She reviewed of the high quality studies that had been done into the risks of various foods / drinks / behaviours and explains exactly what the risks are in her book, so you can make your own evidenced based decisions.

One memorable example is the advice not to eat liver, which is based on the idea that liver contains vitamin a which can be very dangerous for foetuses. But she then looks at the amount of vitamin a in various kinds of liver and works out that you’d need to eat something like three servings of beef liver a day to get close to a risky amount of vitamin a, and that eating a small amount of say chicken liver is actually really beneficial because it’s so nutrient rich. Don’t quote me on this as I’m paraphrasing from memory.

Anyway, well worth a read if you’d like to understand the actual science behind the guidance

@Comtesse I think part of the reason different countries have different rules are because of the different food standards countries have. Runny eggs (for example) are fine in the UK if they're lion stamped but they'd recommend against elsewhere.

I just continued to eat and drink as normal. There were no adverse effects.

Hell yeah. With my crappy iron levels I always crave steak, and I won't eat it above medium rare which isn't reccomended for pregnant women. Don't think I'm meant to eat certain cheeses either but I love some camembert and brie 🤭

Apologies if already covered, but cured meats such as prosciutto are fine if they have been frozen for a few days and then defrosted. Same goes for raw fish, which is why make sushi is actually fine.

There's an element of truth in this but some of the different recommendations are because of different food standards, which mean that some things really are more hazardous in some countries than others (e.g. whether to avoid raw eggs depends on whether salmonella is frequently found in eggs in that country) or different produce consumed (eg whether or not you need to worry about whether the cheese you're eating is pasteurized depends on where you are). It's not all just inexplicable inconsistencies and it doesn't mean that it's all nonsense.

Yes I ate forbidden foods (and drank forbidden drinks too). The book expecting better is excellent for properly explaining the risks of different things so you then have the information available to make your own informed decision.

I'm not a fan of the "I did it and it was fine" argument. It's a foolhardy way to treat pregnancy. For me it's no different than saying "I once crossed a busy road without looking and I didn't get hit by a car so therefore it's safe to cross roads without looking". There's a statistical risk and it's just not worth it.

It's because food safety standards are different in each country

Ffs

Nope

It's not worth the risk imo

My view was when faced with any of the banned foods was 'do I fancy it enough to risk my child's life for' and the answer would always be a no

As that's the decision you're making when putting those foods in your mouth, that in that moment your sandwich, pate, cured meat - is worth more than your child's life

As someone who had her babies in the '80s, the level of guilt that mothers now have to feel of anything goes wrong, really troubles me. Nature does its worst sometimes, and it's highly unlikely to be due to 'that one time I ate smoked salmon/drank three cups of ground coffee/had half a glass of wine with some brie on a cracker.

I'm not sure what the difference in rates of miscarriage/stillbirth or disability is since pregnant mums didn't make any alterations to their diets or alcohol consumption (and many smoked all the way through, too) and of course I wouldn't recommend returning to those days for a second. But these 'guidances' mess with people's heads and induce paranoia and guilt.

It's no wonder we become more anxious with every generation.

Dramatic much?

@Wouldloveanother

Hardly dramatic, take a look at the women on this very thread with experience of the worst case scenario on eating these foods

I know what you mean. I’ve given up drinking, given up my regular exercise, been trying to eat reasonably healthily through horrific sickness/nausea for the past 2 weeks. I’ve given up soft cheese, given up liver/steak, given up pate (ironically the reason I had the sandwich today is because I wanted a crab pate one but thought the salmon would be safer!). I’ve given up proper coffee, proper Coca Cola, been avoiding pooper scooping the garden, avoiding using too many cleaning chemicals…

and I get this bloody listeria warning about a smoked salmon sandwich 😂

No, the risk is just not worth it

Nope peanuts are perfectly ok. The reasoning behind it in the past was a US study in 2000 that suggested mothers with allergies could pass on nut allergies to their baby. However thats not the guidelines now.

www.nhs.uk/pregnancy/keeping-well/foods-to-avoid/

Here is the current NHS guidelines. It says Sushi is fine to eat. It also actually says many things including the "forbidden" cheeses are fine if you cook them first.

Yeah I ate most of it with my second. Was a bit more cautious with my first.

Wasn't aware salmon or cream cheese was advised against tho!

None of the current banned foods were on any list when my DCs were babies in the 90s. Blue cheeses, salami, deli meats, smoked fish - I ate them all.

I didn't because of the listeria risk. I was 10 days overdue and finally gave into a garlic and cheese chips from the chippy.

Perfectly fine to dye your hair

Ate loads of smoked salmon when pregnant shared a room at work with a Japanese friend who thought the no sushi when pregnant rule was insane!

@Gr33ngr33ngr4ss

40 weeks is a bloody long time!

@Wouldloveanother

why have you given up your regular exercise OP?

When I was expecting my second a friend in the US was pregnant at the same time. She asked online about good ideas for lunch and I shared some suggestions I had from a little booklet the NHS gave out at the time. One of the suggestions was a ham sandwich and everyone piled on me saying how irresponsible I was to just eat ham as over there they were told they had to microwave it first instead of eating it cold, they didn't believe me that it was in an "official" booklet.

I also had runny eggs all the time, the lion mark had come in but it wasn't actually until a few years later they actually changed the recommendation to say they were fine in pregnancy as long as they had the the lion mark.

I craved steak during my second pregnancy so I tended to stick to minute steak as that being cooked through didn't feel as bad to me as having to overcook a nice thick steak. I was out for a work meal around Christmas during that pregnancy and I ordered the venison without thinking (it was preordered so I couldn't even say anything on the day). Thankfully they gave me two massive steaks as they were so rare I could only nibble the edges of each.