Dog - had anyone 'cured' with a behaviourist territorial barking?

[Plant2628]

Barking when at the park, kids activities etc if stood still and if another dog approaches
With some dogs when walking on a lead only generally can become reactive
We wanted a family dog we could take anyway
Maybe unreasonable expectations
Interested if a behaviourist is really going to work

Sorry 'Has anyone 'cured'...'

What breed do you have?

Yorkie mix

Terrier mix basically

I think he has small dog syndrome! 😁

Seriously the best way to stop him barking is to distract him.

You can watch any online training to help with this.

I would say distract from what they bark at. Pull up the lead to distract, treat when they stop. By no means a professional but there are plenty out there with easily available advice.

Yes. I have cured many many dogs of this and so should any trainer/behaviour consultant worth their salt.

Your dog is trapped when on a lead, they can't exhibit normal body language and behaviours to meet, greet, interact or ask for space... all they have left is bark and bluff or genuinely be aggressive, or in some cases freeze or fiddle about which usually goes unnoticed by the owner and then they'll move to the more obvious bark/growl/lunge etc.

So..

Management - stop putting your dog in situations they cannot handle. That means altering where they go, where you walk, what distance you are from other dogs (or whatever other trigger) before you take action and move away, what times you take the dog out etc.

Once that is in place, you need to counter condition - pair exposure, below threshold (barking, being unable to listen or take a treat, sniffing the ground intently but not able to listen or take a treat, all signs your dog is over threshold), with high value treats (whatever your dog likes best, cheese, tug toys, they choose what this is, your job is to find out!).

Initially you'll need to work hard to keep sufficient distance so you can do the counter conditioning - remember this is 'see the thing = get a treat'. You are not asking for compliance with a cue, or 'good' behaviour or anything like that.

Later on as your dog becomes more interested in what you have and more relaxed and able to listen you can decrease distance - I like to do this by finding (or setting up) a dog who is walking away, at distance... because your dog can then pick up scent without getting close, and a dog walking away is far less of a threat than one walking towards.

Gradually you decrease distance, keep up the counter conditioning and you can start to ask for simple behaviours your dog knows so that you can talk to other owners and make choices as to whether they meet or you move on.

There's a dog trainer that pops up on my FB videos a lot, southern dog training. He's got loads of good tips for reactive dog training.

No don't follow anything from Southend Dog Training. Everyone who who actually is a decent trainer or behaviourist posts regularly about how terrible his advice his and how obvious it is he doesn't know what he's doing, but he blocks all the comments so it looks like everyone thinks he's amazing.

Really?!? I thought it looked similar to a lot of other training techniques I'd seen. What is so terrible if you don't mind me asking?

Look up Leslie McDevitt's "Look at That" game.

Look up "Settle training". Kikopup probably has a good one. Dog might just need to learn to chill out and do nothing at activities etc as you say that's what you wanted.

Firm lead and walk away from the distraction. Just has to be enough break his gaze... Worked very well with our older dpuppy..

He posts some odd good bits but I steer clear because she doesn't know the basics that he really should if he's marketing himself as a trainer. On one video he tried to explain operant conditioning and got it wrong - absolutely fine if you're "just" an owner but he's pretending he knows what he's doing!

He does lots of "corrections" for reactivity and he's not alone in this. And if that's how an owner wants to manage it - fine I suppose. But he doesn't address the root cause and it's such a shame.

My bitch is reactive. I could have "corrected" her on her neck every time she lunged and barked and it would have suppressed it but it wouldn't have addressed the frustration she feels. Instead, she now sees other dogs as an environmental cue to look at me and get a biscuit as we walk past. Is it slower? Yes! But she fully understands she doesn't meet them now; she doesn't get frustrated and I don't have to punish her so it's a win for me.

I find Southend despicable because they have a huge following of desperate owners commenting about how "IT WORKS! THANK YOU!" And meanwhile everyone who IS good at this is commenting and posting about why it's no good and it's all blocked. It's honestly quite scary. He suppresses behaviour, sure. But it is evident he isn't interested in science or modern methods and would last about 5 seconds in any dog sport where all that actually matters. 😂

Southend is vile, he uses shock collars and prong collars, harsh corrections and when he fucks up someones dog, washes his hands of it entirely - my colleagues in his area have had to clean up SO many of his messes. He's also a spectacularly unpleasant person!

Oh right! All the videos I've watched have been about distraction and rewarding but good to know there's more to them than what I've seen.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

WiddlinDiddlin - he's a young adult dog. I've a young family. We adore him but he makes family activities like the park, camping stressful. Grieving what could have been. Wracked with guilt about whether he is right for us / us for him. We will see the behaviourist and take from there. Just concerned it is engrained in his DNA.

Most of all - thanks for the replies

He doesn't use shock collars. He activately talks about how they are cruel. He uses ecollars which vibrate. Very different. Anyone who thinks he does use them obviously hasn't watched him enough to be saying he isn't a good trainer.

Sometimes, aversive methods are required. Sometimes a dogs feelings take a back seat to what will save it's life.

Balanced training is best.

I have a yorkie mix who barks in the garden at cats or birds if they dare go on our fence but is otherwise quiet when out and about. So I'm not sure it is a breed trait.

I think you can train 'quiet' but will need lots of high value treats and patience as you will have to reinforce him every time he is being good and quiet!

Ahahahaha omg you have bought, drank and are still swimming in the Kool Aid aren't you?

He does use shock collars, he defends shock collars, he was part of a stupid online challenge to let a dog with livestock chasing history loose in a field of sheep wearing a shock collar (didn't happen of course)...

There are shock collars with a vibrate function, yes, and there are vibrate only collars marketed at deaf dogs but anyone well versed in training deaf dogs will tell you they are a poor idea in reality.

Southend uses shock collars and he uses them to deliver electric shocks to dogs. I don't care how you train tbh, you do you - but I do care when people chat absolute bullshit, to either mislead others or because they don't understand what they're doing.

'Balanced' training btw.. doesn't balance. Positive punishment does not balance positive reinforcement. If you understood the quadrants of learning theory, you'd know that.

I'll believe him saying he thinks they are cruel and wouldn't use them over some random on the internet.

Here you go, his own words, shock collars are more effective than vibrate collars and he prefers them.

www.facebook.com/southenddogtrainingandwalking/posts/pfbid02jtV4KRffodyUQ1hVNeCvZrfJC2RNtcrEfpETKbzKJEn8A9Jbrknrcjho74dvcXmBl

abtc.org.uk/practitioners/ Have a look here for a trainer/behaviourist in your area :D

That was three years ago. Perhaps he changed his mind. To be fair, he said similar that most people buy cheap ones are awful and cruel.

I don't think aversives are bad, either way. I use a prong.

Ah right. And yet leaves up posts and videos promoting their use. Of course.

You don't surprise me that you use a prong collar, they're very rewarding to use for owners, and negate the need for proper management, allowing you to start in the middle of training and skip the boring foundation work. A short-cut, with hidden risks.