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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

We are too used to Central heating..

392 replies

Dampclout · 26/08/2022 21:41

Until the 1980s very few houses had central heating. Most people heated one room, had hot water bottles at bedtime and wore warm clothes. I can recall quickly going out of the warm front room and shutting the door behind me, if I wasn't quick enough there would be be the shout of ‘shut that door’
Nowadays I wear a tee shirt in winter and keep my house at 20c… I think I will be going back to my childhood ways this winter..

OP posts:
hop321 · 27/08/2022 08:06

I am genuinely surprised whenever I read people wash their towels after one use. Not being goady but it amazes me. It doesn't feel particularly environmentally friendly either.

JimJamJollyWolly · 27/08/2022 08:14

hop321 · 27/08/2022 08:06

I am genuinely surprised whenever I read people wash their towels after one use. Not being goady but it amazes me. It doesn't feel particularly environmentally friendly either.

Well, this is only one example and doesn't cover everyone, but I have a DC with a skin condition that needed certain topical medications and the list of helpful things that would help (medical advice) included clean pillowcase/sheets and clean towel. My DC took years to get over the habit he got into because of this advice!

But I know people who do it without thinking! It was the norm in their household growing up.

Lockheart · 27/08/2022 08:40

People talk about "wanting to go backwards" but it's not a case of wanting, it's about the fact that our current lifestyle and consumption of resources (particularly hydrocarbons) is unsustainable. We can't even stay at the level we are now. We tipped into the unsustainable category some time ago. We passed peak oil production a few years ago. We don't have a choice. There is very little -soon to be nothing - left that is accessible or practical.

All the complaining about winding the clock back won't change the fact that the coal, gas, and oil fields are empty (or that they may as well be).

crimsonlake · 27/08/2022 08:57

Another one who grew up with ice on the bedroom windows and overcoats and a hot water bottle on the bed.
We had a real fire and no central heating in the early years, with eight of us crowding in to one room.
I now live alone mostly in a house which is difficult to heat so know about cold Winters. I only heat the room I am in, wear layers etc, it is miserable because even if you keep your body warm the air around you is cold.
I have an open fire, but since this is the most expensive form of heating unless you can get free logs it is only used for special occasions. A bag of coal and logs from Home Bargains used to be £3.99 each, no doubt that price will have gone up. If I made a fire around 5pm those would get me through the evening warming just one room. Imagine what the cost would be to do that all day? I do not understand how people are saying they will use their wood burning stoves more to save money on heating costs?

Alexandra2001 · 27/08/2022 09:04

Lockheart · 27/08/2022 08:40

People talk about "wanting to go backwards" but it's not a case of wanting, it's about the fact that our current lifestyle and consumption of resources (particularly hydrocarbons) is unsustainable. We can't even stay at the level we are now. We tipped into the unsustainable category some time ago. We passed peak oil production a few years ago. We don't have a choice. There is very little -soon to be nothing - left that is accessible or practical.

All the complaining about winding the clock back won't change the fact that the coal, gas, and oil fields are empty (or that they may as well be).

Sorry but thats completely wrong.

Without Putins invasion of Ukraine, they'd have been plenty of cheap gas to go around.

Now we can argue about whether thats a good thing or whether we should have done far more in reducing domestic reliance on gas heating but without this invasion, we wouldn't be where we are now.

As always, its about the rate of change, people will die needlessly this winter because they cannot pay to heat their houses.

Lockheart · 27/08/2022 09:13

Alexandra2001 · 27/08/2022 09:04

Sorry but thats completely wrong.

Without Putins invasion of Ukraine, they'd have been plenty of cheap gas to go around.

Now we can argue about whether thats a good thing or whether we should have done far more in reducing domestic reliance on gas heating but without this invasion, we wouldn't be where we are now.

As always, its about the rate of change, people will die needlessly this winter because they cannot pay to heat their houses.

Not forever, and no, it's not solely due to Putin. Demand for gas and oil went through the roof as we came out of the first years of the covid pandemic, long before the Ukraine crisis. There simply isn't enough to go around.

And it's not wrong, it's recognised by many companies, countries and international blocs that our hydrocarbon production from here on out will only decrease. The reserves left are increasingly small, hard to access, or of poor quality.

Hydrocarbon energy is a finite resource. We can't keep consuming it forever and expect to keep the same standard of living. At some point, it will be gone.

Now yes, successive governments have failed to plan for this by investing properly in renewable energy which we should have started the ball rolling on 20+ years ago. I hope this crisis will force more governments here and across the world to plan for the end of fossil fuel availability and to make themselves self-sustaining through renewable energy. But one of the problems is that we really do consume too much unecessarily. In order to get through the next few years until (hopefully) the renewable energy that the government will (hopefully) invest in comes online, we're going to have to drop our expectations as a society.

kc431 · 27/08/2022 09:16

TooMuchToDoTooLittleInclination · 27/08/2022 07:55

I'd rather wear another layer than smell.

youre deluded if you think you don't smell sleeping in bedding that's been on 6 weeks & washingyour body & clothes so infrequently.

I’d genuinely be happy to meet up with you to prove I don’t 😂 This is such a stock answer “you must stink”, but when you don’t really sweat or have BO, have dry hair/skin and have a desk job, there is no need to be showering constantly and washing things so often. It’s environmentally unfriendly and all that happens is you smell of washing powder. People can’t get around habits different from theirs.

If I put on any more layers in winter I’d be Michelin Man but with cold hands. The point of my post was to highlight there are MANY other wasteful behaviours we can cut down on rather than immediately turning off the heating.

Airlon · 27/08/2022 09:27

I think if I hadn’t experienced a central heating-less house quite recently I would probably agree.
YABU.
I used to be able to see my breathe in my bedroom and would fall asleep with my hair (the only thing sticking out of the layers of duvet and clothes) feeling damp.
I was young (20s) and healthy at the time and it was horrible. The elderly, very young or vulnerable would find it even harder, especially if it’s a cold winter.

Sunnyqueen · 27/08/2022 09:29

My god, imagine thinking a 1st world, civilised country going backwards in time by 40 years is a good thing 😂

RedToothBrush · 27/08/2022 09:36

Katypp · 27/08/2022 08:01

Why are posters completely disregarding with the OP said for the sake of drama and political point-scoring?
As far as I can see, no one is advocating a return to unheated houses, so why are pps posting as if this has been suggested?
We have been told for a few years now that thermostats should be turned down, jumpers should be worn etc to help combat climate change, and this, was generally thought to be a good thing. Why is the same advice met with such derision now?
As this thread has shown, we have got too used to overheated homes - not heated homes, note, overheated homes - and people are reacting to sensible advice and good practice as if it's unimaginable hardship. And before anyone jumps on me, I am talking about the 24/7 heated homes, not the homes where heating is on for a few hours.
For the padt six months there has been a steady stream of news stories about people with enormous energy bills worried they are going to get even bigger. Instead of universal sympathy it might be a good idea to ask how their bills are so high in the first place.

Pfft a sensible post. Go away and don't ruin my cynicism.

I have below average bills because we adjusted our behaviour a couple of years ago by choice not because we had to. We still can do a lot of things to reduce our consumption as a household. We are working slowly to improve what we do without being full on evangelical greenies.

I do read a lot of threads on mn where people say how much they use and wonder how the hell they are using so much.

Then I have family stay or visit friends and see habits which I take for granted.

And thats part of it. If everyone reduced their consumption then demand isn't as high. And if demand isn't as high then prices won't peak at even higher levels.

The person who insists on having their heating set to 23C all day and all night because they can and they have the means to afford and its no one else's business really doesn't get that it still impacts other people.

I had an argument on mn this week with people over weight and paying tax and how someone being overweight becomes everyone else's problem due to the taxation system and impact on hospitals.

Yet this is viewed as unacceptable and judgmental. And accused of not doing the same thought process for other issues which is rot.

The problem is, it doesn't stop our connectivity. Our lifestyle choices are not individual. They do not exist in a vacuum. They are not neutral in terms of how they affect others.

We do all need to reconsider aspects of our lives that we take for granted, and make small changes, regardless of cost and our ability to pay. We shouldn't be shouting to the rooftops about how wonderful we are for doing it. It should be a given as a mindset that everyone should realise.

I know penny dropping is happening in my closest circle of friends. We will afford the hikes. But it will affect us and we are all talking about how it will impact use directly and indirectly this year and in the longer term.

And then there is stuff we can do on a community level. I know it's going to catch out families in DS's class. Families you don't expect. People who have unwittingly over stretched.

The whole thing is awful.

And it does annoy me in terms of all the blame the Tory comments. This isn't an issue that's restricted to the last 12 years. It's about a period of short termist policy making chasing populism which has existed in this country for much longer than that. In cultural terms the concept of the yuppy was socially accepted and encouraged. And projections about global warming date back that far. As do projections about the reserves of fossil fuels. So even if you don't believe in the former you still should be concerned about the impact of the latter. All of this is without the Ukrainian situation which has merely brought forward issues by only a couple of years.

We need a real shift in mentality across the board in everything we do.

As others are pointing out, this isn't about wanting to return to decades ago or how we should have an expectation of progression. It's ultimately about the fact that society isn't grasping we have finite resources and our innovations to mitigate against that, isn't keeping pace with our excessive demands. We need to curb the excessive bit as a society.

We face massive challenges as a society which require planning over successive governments. And this is the bit we are really failing on because this is costly and there isn't an incentive for that kind of investment which won't see returns within the period of the current parliamentary cycle.

Instead the focus has got locked into a series of successive crisis which have been compounded by poor civil contingency planning. And the response is to further cut civil contingency planning.

As time passes I do wonder which crisis will be the one which is a step too far and civil order breaks down. And how as an individual, and a collective local group, can I plan for that? The fact that I'm even considering this as a pretty rational and level headed person is nuts.

Its not OK to just be going 'I'm alright jack' because that misses the point and the reality of how this winter might well play out.

Those left without power after storms last winter found out they were on their own for weeks. There wasn't a cavalry coming to help. That was the reality for all regardless of income. And thats the lesson we all need to consider going forward.

Life isn't going to get easier. It's not a given that living standards are going to continue to improve nor even be maintainable at their current levels. It's a massive fallacy everyone needs to get their heads around. If you look at data the converse is true. We are going to go into some sort of decline. We can slow the pace which will allow the innovation to reduce the impact if we are careful. If we don't we are liable to fall off a cliff and have massive social issues of which the coming winter is just one of the first.

bellac11 · 27/08/2022 10:05

GreeboIsMySpiritAnimal · 26/08/2022 22:59

No, sorry @bellac11 but children being cold in their own homes is fucking wrong. We need to be able to keep our kids warm. Yes, we absolutely should be looking for more sustainable fuels in order to do so, but in the meantime, let's keep them sodding well warm.

Goodness Im not talking about children being cold, why do people exaggerate so much

Im saying that the concept of being able to heat your house to a temperature that is high enough to wear summer clothing in winter is not progressive, its regressive when you look at the resources needed to do that.

Im saying that the best experts are saying that we are being regressive when we talk about 'progress'. Its not so cut and dried

bananaorange00 · 27/08/2022 10:14

'I can afford to keep my house at my chosen temperature, if you are happy at 18 degrees then well done you.'

Well then you are not going to understand the cost of living crisis if you're not experiencing it are you.

balalake · 27/08/2022 10:28

Those who have argued for cutting out other wasteful habits instead of no heating at all I agree with. Though that does not mean 23C.

It's not just domestic energy consumption that needs to be reduced, wasteful use of energy happens in some businesses and no doubtless government buildings too.

bellac11 · 27/08/2022 10:30

Katypp · 27/08/2022 08:01

Why are posters completely disregarding with the OP said for the sake of drama and political point-scoring?
As far as I can see, no one is advocating a return to unheated houses, so why are pps posting as if this has been suggested?
We have been told for a few years now that thermostats should be turned down, jumpers should be worn etc to help combat climate change, and this, was generally thought to be a good thing. Why is the same advice met with such derision now?
As this thread has shown, we have got too used to overheated homes - not heated homes, note, overheated homes - and people are reacting to sensible advice and good practice as if it's unimaginable hardship. And before anyone jumps on me, I am talking about the 24/7 heated homes, not the homes where heating is on for a few hours.
For the padt six months there has been a steady stream of news stories about people with enormous energy bills worried they are going to get even bigger. Instead of universal sympathy it might be a good idea to ask how their bills are so high in the first place.

Absolutely, people cant seem to have sensible conversation without exaggeration and outright lies about what others have said.

The reality is that people do need to use less resources and our heating is the major resource we use, all of us.

We tend to try to keep to 18-20 in the winter but are covered in blankets, hot water bottles and socks in order to make sure we dont need it higher. I wont stop doing that, and will try to edge it towards 18 rather than above to save a bit.

I dont know why people are talking about cold children, chilblains and condensation on windows, heating your home to around 18 is not going to result in that.

Katypp · 27/08/2022 10:40

@bellac11 I think they are just getting carried away with the drama of it, tbh.
I am not heartless - although I am often called that on MN - but come on, it's winter, it's cold and it is completely unnatural to wander around I T-shirts in winter.
Having to wear a jumper indoors is not headship, neither is sitting under a blanket (what do people think 'throws' are for - decoration?) and children will not suffer from chilblains, colds, coughs or hyperthermia at 18 degrees.
Energy costs have doubled since last winter, so people have to aim for using half the amount to stay the same. All this talk of freezing homes and people dying is hysterical hyperbole.

kc431 · 27/08/2022 10:41

balalake · 27/08/2022 10:28

Those who have argued for cutting out other wasteful habits instead of no heating at all I agree with. Though that does not mean 23C.

It's not just domestic energy consumption that needs to be reduced, wasteful use of energy happens in some businesses and no doubtless government buildings too.

This totally - the office building I work in is currently being so air-conned that I had to bring a jacket to work….in the heatwave 😂 Now that is ridiculous! Plus lights being left on all the time, taps/toilets leaking. I feel like anything I do is a drop in the ocean compared to the waste in any large commercial building.

MrsMontyD · 27/08/2022 10:42

My heating doesn't come on until everyone is wearing warm clothes and has something on their feet and they're still cold. It comes on for long enough to warm the house through. It never stays on all day and definitely not all night. DP who will be moving in before winter will have to acclimatises 😂.

I remember this house before central heating with ice on the inside of the windows. I wouldn't want to go back to that but we certainly don't waste heat.

Katypp · 27/08/2022 10:44

@MrsMontyD Sensible advice. But a step too far for some people, evidently

Alaimo · 27/08/2022 10:58

@RedToothBrush I largely agree with you, but I would add there are factors that matter in addition to individual choices.

A few years ago I managed to almost half my gas usage in winter. It had nothing to do with turning the thermostat down. Rather, it was the result of moving from an uninsulated, single-glazed flat to an insulated, double-glazed one.

Insulation rates have plummeted since 2012: twitter.com/LukeSMurphy/status/1563061713854799872?t=RDhEc9GE5W4SUaPSusNG4w&s=19

The Tories also reversed plans that stipulated all new builds should be highly energy efficient. These political choices matter. And I think it is absolutely fair to blame the Tories for exacerbating the crisis we are in now.

RedToothBrush · 27/08/2022 11:00

MrsMontyD · 27/08/2022 10:42

My heating doesn't come on until everyone is wearing warm clothes and has something on their feet and they're still cold. It comes on for long enough to warm the house through. It never stays on all day and definitely not all night. DP who will be moving in before winter will have to acclimatises 😂.

I remember this house before central heating with ice on the inside of the windows. I wouldn't want to go back to that but we certainly don't waste heat.

This should really be the norm.

Last year was unusually mild and I guess we should hope for that again.

We only had two frosts here (NW England) and we didn't have the heating on until mid November which is the latest we've ever had it on. We weren't freezing.

ILikeHotWaterBottles · 27/08/2022 11:02

chillipenguin · 26/08/2022 21:45

There's an in-between though. Not everyone is as wasteful as this:
Nowadays I wear a tee shirt in winter and keep my house at 20c…

Yes this is why many people are seeing their bills shoot up, but apparently that is needed. If it's that needed, pay your bill and shut up about it. Nothing you can do about it, complaining does nothing except annoy people.

Have it on twice a day if you really don't like paying the high bills, but honestly there's other people I feel more sorry for than those who are just thinking about reducing their usage a bit down from t shirt temperatures. You'll not struggle this winter really op, there's people who are struggling already and you're not one of them.

Wishyfishy · 27/08/2022 11:24

ILikeHotWaterBottles · 27/08/2022 11:02

Yes this is why many people are seeing their bills shoot up, but apparently that is needed. If it's that needed, pay your bill and shut up about it. Nothing you can do about it, complaining does nothing except annoy people.

Have it on twice a day if you really don't like paying the high bills, but honestly there's other people I feel more sorry for than those who are just thinking about reducing their usage a bit down from t shirt temperatures. You'll not struggle this winter really op, there's people who are struggling already and you're not one of them.

I’ve seen posts on social media by saying that they will be having the heating on all winter “as much as they want” (T shirts all winter I guess?!) as they work hard / deserve it / the kids deserve it but will be cancelling their direct debits and won’t pay a penny.

Now I have a lot of sympathy for being who use a bare minimum and won’t be able to pay the new prices - and maybe they should go into debt to the energy suppliers for it - but for people to decide the answer to the increased prices is to carry on heating the house at 21oC 24/7 and just STEAL it blows my mind. Wouldn’t you at least pay what you deem a fair price? How is not paying ANYTHING seen as fair?

We can afford a bit of an increase. Not as much as is coming so I’ll split it between paying more and using less - that’s the logical option for us. I wish prices would come down again but I would never, ever expect to receive my electricity and gas for free.

ReneBumsWombats · 27/08/2022 11:34

I’ve seen posts on social media by saying that they will be having the heating on all winter “as much as they want” (T shirts all winter I guess?!) as they work hard / deserve it / the kids deserve it but will be cancelling their direct debits and won’t pay a penny.

Well...they'll get cut off. They might also get sued and I can't imagine they've got deeper pockets than the energy suppliers.

Crikeyalmighty · 27/08/2022 11:35

@ReneBumsWombats correct

ILikeHotWaterBottles · 27/08/2022 11:38

Wishyfishy · 27/08/2022 11:24

I’ve seen posts on social media by saying that they will be having the heating on all winter “as much as they want” (T shirts all winter I guess?!) as they work hard / deserve it / the kids deserve it but will be cancelling their direct debits and won’t pay a penny.

Now I have a lot of sympathy for being who use a bare minimum and won’t be able to pay the new prices - and maybe they should go into debt to the energy suppliers for it - but for people to decide the answer to the increased prices is to carry on heating the house at 21oC 24/7 and just STEAL it blows my mind. Wouldn’t you at least pay what you deem a fair price? How is not paying ANYTHING seen as fair?

We can afford a bit of an increase. Not as much as is coming so I’ll split it between paying more and using less - that’s the logical option for us. I wish prices would come down again but I would never, ever expect to receive my electricity and gas for free.

Meh let the idiots do it. They'll soon realise how bad an idea that is, I'd personally laugh if I see a for sale sign go up at their home as they've screwed themselves so badly. You can't help that kind of stupidity.