To wonder why posters think MN is MC

[AnnaFri]

I've been wondering this for a while and two threads I've posted on today have prompted me to ask the question.

I always see posters trot out that MN is very middle class

But from being on here in various guises over the years I just don't understand why

There are threads going about high earners and the majority on there are saying anything over £50k a year is a high earner

The thread about pay rises and the majority laughing at the concept

The competitive PIP and UC posts that often crop up a few times a year

There was a thread a few months ago where the OP considered anyone on 30k plus a year to be wealthy

Plus the many others where it's clear the majority posting aren't well off at all

AIBU to think MN is definitely not middle class at a majority level, and it's most likely due to so many low earners being on here that gives that impression?

It is wannabe MC. Have you ever read the Class threads? The majority of replies state how very solidly MC they are.

It's not middle class anymore. It was when it started. It's full of daily mail readers and benefits bashers these days.

Benefits bashing is not a working class occupation, and posters frequently have to explain the realities of being poor to people who are more offended by the title 'poor' than they are poverty.

Just as an aside...wealth and class aren't the same thing, are they? You can be working class and wealthy, or at least come from a working class background and be wealthy.

Schroedinger’s salary. Where both £125k is horribly squeezed and barely enough to get by - and GP is overpaid. 🤦‍♀️

I think it depends where you live. In my area if you are earning £30k you could live comfortably because house prices are low compared to everywhere else, typical 3 bedroom terraced house is around the £100-£150k mark. I know in other parts of the country you couldn't get a shed for that money.

One person's idea of rich is another person's idea of poor, we all set the bar in life differently.

1. There’s an odd MN view that class has nothing to do with your income: so you can be a single parent living in a council house and claiming benefits, but if you went to university, own a lot of books, and visit museums sometimes, you are somehow higher in the social pecking order than somebody who works as a plumber and has an annual income of £75k.

1. MNers come from all over the UK, so any reference to money is contextual. £50k in London isn’t an especially high salary (although it would certainly include many people in “middle class” occupations) whereas in the North or in parts of Scotland it would be a very decent salary for somebody in senior management of a small to medium company. When I moved from Scotland to London, I tripled my salary overnight whilst not taking on much greater seniority. My class didn’t change, though, did it?

I think it's mostly made up of mc pretending that they aren't and hate anything mc, while secretly being proud of how mc they themselves are. With perhaps a side helping of "me I'm just a little bit different for doing <insert something that most people do>" .

Years ago I came on here and saw a lot of posters with high earnings, and brilliant careers, any threads about income were quite eye opening (even taking into consideration that posters can say whatever they want...), now I am surprised by what comes up in posts, people commenting on the privilege of being able to afford a holiday every year, or assuming a decent income means a lavish lifestyle.

This isn't the point but I'm not even sure what I am? I have been solidly working class (brought up on benefits), started working life on £2 an hour, initially worked up my salary but only through the introduction of minimum wage, retrained and I am now on a solid middle class income. But I am not middle class, I don't feel middle class. But that's the category mumsnet would put me in. The class system isn't great is it?

It was very MC indeed when it started, and probably for most of its first ten years. The demographic has widened a lot since then, but that early reputation has stayed.

Threads relating to social class occur quite frequently on the AIBU section of the forum, but not in other sections of MN. I am not sure why.

itsnotdeep: It's not middle class anymore. It was when it started.

Isn't that typical of this sort of thing, though?
When Facebook started it was limited to Harvard students. You wouldn't believe it to look at it now.

I don't get the impression most posters are MC - but defining MC is a minefield!

I'd define it more by profession and educational level than by income. Being rich doesn't make you MC, just as being poor doesn't make you WC.

Class threads are doomed to end in insults and anger, I know. It's one of the most difficult subjects for anyone (even professional sociologists, I guess) to make any meaningful statements about.

Part of the problem is the way society has changed over the last 50 years. Once, if you did a manual job (and there was a differentiation between skilled and unskilled) you would be called WC, and that wasn't any sort of insult - just a fact. But since manual, physical jobs and industry in general have declined in numbers there are more grey areas.

Also, many highly educated people earn very little - often not enough to afford to buy a house, once a marker for being MC.

You'd be very brave to wade into a discussion about class nowadays!!!

🤣🤣🤣

Schroedinger’s Salary! I love it!

I think MN seems to be fairly representative of society really. It’s neither WC or MC, there are people on here from both of those and above and below.

People are just too quick to accuse others being MC as an insult because they don’t understand every aspect of what it’s like to be in poverty, as if being financially poor is the only real problem anyone can have that matters.

I think it skews quite poor, a lot of the time. So many threads of women struggling with no jobs, no qualifications, wondering what they're going to do. There are MC threads in, like, Housing and stuff, but that's concentrated around a theme.

This is another point, so many daily mail views on here over the last couple of years.

It seems to have really diversified in the worst way

Who said anything about benefits bashing?

I was referring to the race to the bottom threads almost comparing how little they get on PIP and UC

Yes the holiday threads are always eye opening

But the sheer amount of how to live on £0.40 a day, how does anyone afford a holiday, how do anyone afford childcare etc. threads really paints a different picture of the majority on here

I feel people think it's MC because a large portion are anything but, and therefore think those posters on average but low salaries are rich

Absolutely wealth and class are not the same thing at all. That's an American idea.

It's closely linked though

Some roles go outside of this for example tradespeople who often earn very well but are firmly working class via their job. But most of the traditional MC roles are relatively well paid

No, seems like a vast proportion of mn children play out on the street from the age of 7 which is a more wc thing. I think there's quite a good mix actually. Geographically speaking too, possibly Scotland heavy, but not London centric anyway.

I once met a group of MNers IRL (under a different username) and it was very mixed.
I think it is mixed here - you can ask for advice on high budget holidays/house reno etc and get it, but obviously there are also people really struggling to make ends meet.

But I guess the reputation is from early days as others have said.

Class isn't just about wealth. It's a mentality, I've never heard class being discussed in real life as much as on MN some are obsessive. Middle class is about keeping up with the neighbours and comparing yourself. The WC and UC don't care about this. I'd say middle class is the worst thing to aspire to be, I'm WC and we earn good money I'm confident in my choices and if I want a tacky crushed velvet sofa I will buy one !

This thread is fascinating: http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amiibeingunreasonable/4610834-to-think-this-income-savings-and-wealth-calculator-might-give-people-some-perspective-on-where-they-fit-in
It shows that many people who completed the survey and commented on the thread are middle or below average earners. It's a self-selecting group of course, but supports your theory OP.