To miss the cleanliness of the pandemic when eating out?

[Monkeytrousers04]

I’ve just been to a kid-friendly pub for tea. We were invited there by two other families we know who go there all the time. I knew it wasn’t going to be the most up-market place after looking at the website but did not expect the filth I encountered when we got there!

The table had a a decorative ridge carved into it, about 3ins in from the outside and all around the whole table but the whole thing was full of old bits of food - crumbs, salt/ pepper, general dirt - AIBU to think this should be cleaned after each sitting?

I’m genuinely curious because the people we were with did not seem bothered in the slightest… the chairs were all sunken when you sat on them too and had these grubby covers on them that were also covered in bits of food, squashed in from people having sat on them throughout the day. I didn’t notice until after I’d sat down and I pulled out the chair next to me for my son to sit on. He’s three and was not bothered in the slightest but then all I kept thinking about was “what am I sitting on?” and “I’ll have to take these jeans off (and put them in the wash) before I sit on the sofa when we get home”. Again, is this weird? AIBU to think these things?

I’ve always been a bit OCD on the cleanliness front so found eating out during the pandemic amazing as everything was so clean. I really miss this aspect of it. Why has it not been upheld in most places?! We now all know so much about how germs are passed on, etc. etc. and types of surfaces that hold on to germs/ bacteria more than others - why have some places and people just forgotten about this and why do I feel like I’m the odd one out for not wanting to eat my dinner off a table that still has the remnants of at least today’s customer’s dinners, if not more, on it?!

AIBU or am I just overly sensitive to this stuff?

I have other examples from other eateries I’ve been to too recently - sticky tables, stained chairs, dirty cutlery, etc. and sometimes I’ll complain and get the waiting staff to wipe the table again, etc. but then I start to wonder whether it’s a clean cloth they are using or whether it’s the same one they’ve been using all day?!

I worked in a pub when I was at uni and the chef there was so clean (she ended up retraining as an environmental health officer in the end in an attempt to clean up all the pubs/ restaurants in our city) so perhaps I’ve been a bit over exposed to how things should be done in a pub/ restaurant setting. It was a busy student pub I worked at and we were generally run off our feet, but I would always clean my tables between customers and if I saw something on a chair or the floor nearby would clean that up to. (I’m not even going to mention the floor of the place we we’re at today).

Anyway, just wondered if anyone else ever feels sick when they eat out due to the dirt and detritus on/ around the table, or if it’s just me?

Sorry I don't accept short staffed as an excuse. If you don't have time to do basic cleaning like clearing crumbs then you need to shut off some of the tables. It's greediness to have more customers in a restaurant than you can adequately service. Ditto for hour long waits for food etc. yes I've worked in hospitality

I think you sound self aware enough to know that your concerns about grimy tables are not necessarily rational but you are looking for someone to validate what you are currently feeling.

Throughout your posts you are talking about feelings and thoughts - you aren’t identifying an actual hygiene issue as such. A restaurant table would have to be pretty filthy and you would have to be very unlucky to catch anything from it. That’s the scientific truth. It’s not pleasant, as a paying customer, to sit at a sticky table but you (presumably) have a functioning immune system which is constantly mopping up the millions of viruses, bacteria and other ‘germs’ that you come in contact with on a daily basis.

Feelings about germs / grime / filth / being ‘dirtyI’ - that’s the OCD talking, and maybe you’d benefit from a refresher in whatever therapy helped you to get past it before.

I used to clean tables in a fast food restaurant and I would get a LOT of dirty looks when I was wiping down or sweeping around a table someone wanted to sit on.

I think you anbu to want a clean table but I do think maybe you are extra sensitive because some things - like thinking you need to wash your clothes because of some crumbs, or worrying the server cloth isn't clean - are a bit excessive.

I think you are over-focusing on this. You said in a previous post that you’ve received treatment for OCD in the past. So you know that your personal tolerance for cleanliness is low, and impacted by your condition. This is not how non-OCD people process these kinds of thoughts, so in that respect you are, as you say, overly sensitive.

You’re using the abnormal hygiene approaches of the pandemic — largely pointless, as we all subsequently discovered that covid was spread by aerosolised particles, not picked up from surfaces — as a kind of crutch to allow you to continue to externalise whatever trauma triggered your OCD in the first place.

You’re basically saying, ‘I’m uncomfortable here but I’d be ok if it was cleaner.’ But if you’ve had treatment for OCD you’ll know that this is externalising your locus of control, and indulging in a kind of magical thinking that thrives on unrealistic expectations.

^ This
Decorative wood, fabrics- they’ll all get grubby. YANBU I don’t have OCD but I wouldn’t like it either.

Most places weren't any cleaner during Covid. It was performative rather than effective.

Tables should be cleaned between customers, that's basic hygiene.

I have a dyspraxic child who leaves a toodler-esque zone of destruction after coming into contact with food. I always do my best to wipe the obviously crumby bits and spills with the napkins avaliable, but it always needs a proper wipe clean before it's fit for the next customer.

I've noticed sad, worn looking seats when out. Maybe it's seeing things afresh where we hadn't been much in two years, but also where things have been excessively cleaned with Covid requirements, the chemicals involved damage surfaces and coatings/ finishes. Places have a limited budget for refurbishing and timber shortages affect costs and timescales for replacing furniture. Also tradespeople are in short supply and prices up again.

Places aren't observing pandemic levels of cleaning any more because, aside from it not actually doing much, it was expensive. And they often were having to bear the costs themselves. You probably know it was a very tough time for the hospitality sector.

As with a lot of things some people liked during the pandemic like reduced numbers, booking in advance, table service etc, generally the customer wasn't the one bearing the cost and expecting businesses to fund it was unsustainable. So if you want it to carry on you're going to have to pay more for it.

I agree. Cleaning the table should be a basic necessity, not an optional that gets dropped when it's busy.

A dirty groove in the table would put me right off my food! It's a daft design.

I'm surprised how many people are perfectly happy to eat in filth! I am definitely not OCD. My home is very lived in. I don't even always get around to wiping my table after every meal (looking at yesterday's crumbs now). But there is a difference between a few stray crumbs and the kind of build-up of old food and grubbiness on a restaurant table that is never properly cleaned. I know exactly what you mean. Our local pub is like that, hence we don't eat there. Of course bacteria are going to build up there, and even if your food doesn't directly come into contact with it, your hands will touch it and then touch your food (certainly children will). It's really unhygienic! It gets a smell about it too when it's never properly clean and it makes me feel ill.

Who on earth chooses tables and chairs that are not easy to clean in an environment like that?

Actually had noticed this - though it probably bother us less than OP and we do carry wipes/tissues around as had them in pandemic and still there in pockets and bags.

It also sounds like poor table design.

Our main problem though is getting through the door in the first place - as IL and DH often don't want to pre-book and with kids we are a large group.

Even our more reliable locations near us - food quality/cooking and service is down and when we have pre-booked sometimes they've still not had large enough table and squash us in and when we'd already pre-ordered hadn't got the information.

We had experience of really struggling to find anywhere to let us in - and consider we usually have several drinks, main meal and dessert - it's a fair bit of money to turn away. TBH though we still going out much less than pre-pandemic and finding somewhere to eat isn't helping there.

I've not noticed any difference in cleanliness between now and the pandemic but I do agree with your points generally, about grimy tables and chairs etc. Yes, some could be down to staffing issues, but some places have been like this for years. I think at the least, clean cloths should be used when wiping tables down, and then they should be dried with paper towels to get rid of the residue.

Also restaurants should have a thorough clean maybe once a week, so there would be no food building up in ridges. Menus should be cleaned every day ideally and if looking too shabby replaced, it can't cost much.

I asked for a gherkin with my fish and chips and the girl opened the large jar and stuck her hand in and speared a gherkin for me with her long, painted fingernail!
Needless to say I said nothing and didn't eat the gherkin.

Oh my goodness, that last post made me retch! It reminds me of a time years ago, back in days of Little Chef, when I ordered a toasted tea cake and the guy felt the need to itch his own armpit (by putting his hand inside his sleeve no less) and then use this hand to remove my tea cake from the toaster. I told him it was disgusting and demanded a refund. It just makes me question peoples own standard of hygiene when they do things like that at work, on duty, and and in full view of customers!

Short staffing seems to be the new excuse for everything.

Our village pie shop/bakery changed hands in the Spring. New owners "couldn't find staff" so ended up shutting it after a month as they couldn't cope on their own, even putting up a sign saying "closed down due to staff shortages".

6 months later and it's opened again under new management. Funnily enough, the new owners found staff, apparently without any problems - fully staffed from day 1 and ever since, usually 2 or 3 staff plus at least one of the two owners. Even better is that the staff are really pleasant and helpful.

I do think that sometimes business owners/management don't actually know how to recruit staff and rely on "amateur" methods such as a piece of paper in the shop window or a post on a local facebook page!

You're view of it is not mine. The idea of most germs hurting us, I don't have. As an alternative I think germs are good, and because I have high tolerance me or dc are never ill. If I drop a bit of food off my dinner plate at home I might bin it, most likely I'll pop it straight back in my mouth. The covid rules seemed ott quite a lot to me. The fact you are hankering after them shows your ilk to the more angst ridden.

The girl with the ice is grim though. Why not use a cup or a scoop?

To be fair, I’m not bothered about my own germs or those from my own house… I too am rarely ill, spent my pre-children years outside, looking after animals - poo, mud, none of that bothers me… even today a bit of mud under my kids finger nails tells me that they have had a good day.

But the crumbs in the table groove we’re truly disgusting and I’m reassured that others have responded similarly. Squashed food on the seat covers, equally grim.

I feel like I know when it’s my OCD and when it’s just unacceptable filth. I have concluded that the filth at this particular pub was unacceptable and wont eat there again. My response was perhaps ruled slightly by my OCD tendencies, which is another reason I wont eat there again, knowing that it’ll set me off.

I’ve eaten at other places since and not had the same response - mainly because everything was clean and inviting.