To risk everything for beliefs

[Silentlyseething1]

I’ve name changed for this as it could be outing but I am getting more and more annoyed by people abusing the system and the fact that I know a whole group of people who are committing benefit & council tax fraud. The poorer families are all due to get support and all these people I know are due to get some help too but then they are jetting off on holiday abroad etc. because they don’t declare their husbands live there etc.

I just sit and silently judge them when I talk to them as me and my other half do everything by the book and we don’t claim UC or anything even though we probably could. I probably know about 12 people who are committing one or the other type of fraud and most are committing both.

it just makes my blood boil as I work hard for my money, should I report them all and risk making my own life difficult or not?

I feel exactly the same OP. I reported someone about 7 years ago, but nothing ever came of it. She still enjoys a lifestyle I could never afford. Still claims benefits. Still claims to be single when she's lived with her partner for the best part of 10 years. The worst part is that she's quite open about it and even a bit proud. Makes me absolutely livid.

I just can't get worked up about this at all. If you add together all of the benefit fraud that takes place in the UK, it's a mere drop in the ocean when compared to the outright cash grab of billions upon billions that's been/is being committed by the government, the energy companies, huge corporations, tax dodging billionaires etc. It's literally not even worth worrying about. The fact that people are only up in arms when it's one of the plebs doing it on a miniscule scale just shows what a great job the powers-that-be have done of dividing and conquering us.

Absolutely this

I say the same thing on all these threads: if you're so sure, shop them. Just do it. Don't come whining on here about how everyone is abusing the system and you work so hard and pay in yadda yadda yadda

And know that this kind of reporting can be malicious and ruin lives.

You should be claiming what you're entitled to - don't wear that as some kind of badge of honour.

You should also report the fraudsters, of course (if you are sure they are cheating the system, that is[.

SallyWD · Yesterday 20:10
In the grand scheme of things these people are still pretty poor. The small amounts of cash they're claiming are absolutely nothing compared to the corruption and tax avoidance amongst billionaires. I just can't get worked up about it and would stay well out of it.

Aaarrrgghh....not this again.
This always gets trotted out on these threads - benefit fraud is OK because there are wealthy people who don't get taxed enough. No it's not OK - 2 wrongs don't make a right. Benefit fraud takes money away from hard-working taxpayers (sometimes those whose living standards are possibly lower than the fraudsters) and from genuine benefit claimants. It's not OK by me that my taxes go to support the lifestyles of criminals and fraudsters.

Also, and more pragmatically, the more lax the system and the more people who appear to get away with this exploitation and dishonesty, the more people will think it's OK.

Just report them. You can do it anonymously online. If they have nothing to hide then there shouldn't be a problem..

Benefit fraud is tiny and it shouldn't be something to worry about worry about the rich companies not paying taxes and tax havens and the govt wasting huge amounts on money on their friend's businesses and subsidising hugely rich fossil fuel companies instead of investing in renewable energy.

Worry about the NHS and the climate crisis.

Honestly. The last thing you should be worrying about is a few people getting insignificant amounts of money. They don't affect us at all. It is everything I've mentioned that does. Be indignant about that and vote accordingly

Absolutely this.

We would be entitled to quite a lot as we are a low income household (family of 4 living on £25k). But we have too much in savings, so we get nothing. We live very frugally as we know the responsible thing is to avoid dipping into the savings unless there is an emergency. I wonder what the response would be if I said I was going to hide the savings and start claiming!

That's for the authorities to worry about. As a member of the public all we can do is report our suspicions, and the authorities can then investigate and draw their own conclusions.

I imagine this depends largely on where you live and who you're surrounded by. It's easy to be in a bubble if you live in a nice middle class area where the only claimants are people who have fallen on hard times and so you imagine that it really is only 1 or 2 people committing fraud because you don't come across it frequently; equally it's easy to fall into the bubble where you live on a HA estate with a tight knit community where virtually everyone you know is claiming something and half of them are fraudulent somehow.

I don't have an opinion on it tbh but what I would say is that if you are living near people who are openly making fraudulent claims (as I used to) and you focus on it then it will make you bitter. Make a decision to either report them and move away or have your life made difficult, or ignore them and stop thinking about it.

I absolutely would not do this, and I think your professional capacity is very relevant.

A doctors receptionist or GP reporting everyone she thinks is claiming fraudulently would be completely unacceptable, IMO, for example. There are some places where people should be able to be open about their circumstances without consequences.

If it's people you see at the school gate, well, then that's on your conscience.

The cases I've known of people "playing the system" were all in absolute desperation, in circumstances most people would, luckily, never have to deal with. The system had completely failed them, and they did what they had to do. So I would never judge.

Yes, I would report it. If your report turns out to be wrong then no harm done, but if you're right, then you have reduced the National welfare bill and freed up some money to spend somewhere else.

To those thinking each case is too small to matter; they all add up to a lot of money. Each family that claims an extra few hundred here and there mean less money for education or hospitals or crime prevention or road repairs or military provision or or or or or.

Behind all the politicians whip seem untrustworthy and slapdash with money are a bunch of civil servants trying to make recommendations based on the projected income to the treasury. If a few million can go back in the pot, then they'll spend it somewhere else, o promise you!

It’s genuinely incredible what people are willing to openly admit to in public, to people they don’t even know very well, and with no thoughts as to who might hear them.

That’s not sarcasm or disbelief btw, I do believe it. I’ve been told, and overheard, similar.

So much defence of benefit fraud on these threads points to one thing. That many of those defending it are doing the same, and that it’s even more common that people think.

I don't understand the MN's trope of 'mind your own business'. If you knew someone was stealing from your home, you'd be mightily pissed off and do something about it though.

If these people truly are fraudulently claiming benefits, that's potentially 100s of 1000s of pounds. Why would you not report them? If you wish to, do it anonymously and they likely won't know it's you.

Report them. They are stealing.

Lol. It does seem that it’s only a duty to report when people aren’t declaring revenue, not when they’re stealing it.

Go ahead, report everyone you know! Everyone will celebrate you in the streets 🎉

(Benefit fraud doesn’t take money from anyone, deserving or otherwise. There’s a huge figure of unclaimed benefits. Therefore there is plenty more benefits money in the pot. Simple maths.)

Report. That's what I'd do

Makes me laugh that people seem to think that £8bn is irrelevant. How much other money should we write off? Small businesses not paying tax? Fathers not paying child maintenance, small amounts in the scheme of things, no?

I suspect there are a lot of people on MN committing benefit fraud. Why else would they defend doing so?

Honestly I probably wouldn't bother, but I wouldn't judge someone else for reporting it.

What does your contract/professional code of ethics say about passing on information about people @Silentlyseething1? Is it in conflict with your beliefs?

I don't think you've answered my question OP.

This