to think that horse riders shouldn't be given equal access to woodland paths as walkers etc?

[Yeahreally]

Read this article in the Guardian and it kinda made my blood boil: www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/aug/12/give-horse-riders-equal-access-to-english-woodlands-say-campaigners

IMO the spokesperson for the Trails Trust is completely ignoring the safety issues at play here. I have no issue with horses but they are big animals and can cause injury if spooked. So is it really sensible to allow them on all pathways of whatever size where runners, cyclists and people just walking their kids or dogs might be? How exactly do you give them a suitably wide berth on a narrow path?

Being a bloke, I'd be massively interested in the MN view on whether there is some sort of inequality issue at play (ie. because riders are more likely to be women there are being disproportionately affected by the current restrictions)? The argument that current laws were unfair because "They (riders) don’t want to walk, they don’t want to cycle.They feel safe in the countryside on a horse,” is incredibly weak and massively ignores how this affects other path users.

Bridleways have been disappearing for decades. There is a huge huge reduction in off road riding available for horse riders.
When new housing or developments are built footpaths are reinstated, cycle paths put in but the bridleway access is never restored.

I'd sooner share a path with horses than with dogs.

@hothorses oh god yes. The stupid French bulldogs, completely in in socialised with live stock, they chase your horse, yapping at its heels. Owners with no control whatsoever. Then shout at you if your horse stamps a foot.

its always bloody designer dogs. You never get this from a springer spaniel or Labrador owner.

Bridleways have been in decline for years. There's less and less safe space for riders, so banning us from woodlands is utterly ridiculous.

Cyclists and dog walkers (especially lockdown purchased dogs on walks) are way more problematic than horse riders round here.

that it didn't take long for cyclist bashing to start and the OP is about horse riders!

• am a cyclist, horse rider and car driver.

Unless I'm mistaken, most bridleways were and are for horses, so surely a case of the horses were there first, then it's the foot walkers that should be privileged to use the routes, but horses first ?

Or a counter point, @Yeahreally , if horses are restricted then what about limiting bridleways to horses only ?

@lochmaree not cyclist bashing, just speaking the truth about my experience.
Horse riders/pony trekkers tend to stick to bridleways around stables in my area and these are not necessarily popular with cyclists. I am a cyclist, I'm not cyclist bashing, just giving MY experience.

Horse shit is bloody disgusting and the read loads of it! Would they clean it up on paths shared with pedestrians?

Talking about woodland paths as well, quite often we riders are paying for a permit to ride in these woods unlike walkers, cyclists etc who can use for free.

Meh it's pretty much just grass. Dog shit is way worse I don't even bother using the footpaths near me because of it. Also, how would you expect the riders to clean it up? Get a shovel out of their horses backside?

Thanks for all your thoughts and comments.
@Stupidbonfire - you're spot on in that I am a little nervous around horses. I've was brought up in a rural area and because I've occasionally seen a spooked horse (and would emphasise this was occasionally) it's still stayed with me.

FTR, horse sh*t doesn't bother me (it's nothing like dog poo).

Wouldn't disagree that cyclists and some dogs can make the countryside unsafe but I don't think that justifies letting horses use smaller pathways that have been designed for walkers only. Again, bikes aren't allowed on these pathways so I'm missing the logic...

donkt they want access to what are currently footpaths according to that article?

Surely the solution is to sort out the bridleways, not to take something away from walkers?

I think the point about user demographics is very valid. Over the past 10-15 years there have been on going efforts and projects to add cycling infrastructure (admittedly not always successfully, but it is planning focus for many developments). What are the main demographics of cyclists? I hazard the proportion of middle aged (white) men is likely to be very high.

In contrast, at the amateur level, horse riding is highly female dominated. When there have been numerous articles in the recent months on lack of exercise uptake by girls and women at various ages it seems bonkers to not do more to encourage participation in a female dominated sport. Following the (well deserved) media fawning over the Lionesses’ victory and how this is a turning point in women’s sport there continues to be wholesale media blind spot to our successes at a sport primarily enjoyed by women. This week we’ve won team silver at the World Dressage Championship and the new world champion is a British female rider. We’ve won a bronze and two silvers at the concurrent paradressage World Champs and will likely get a team medal when the final riders go tomorrow. Not a peep of any of these (primarily female) successes from the mainstream press!

In order of who I'd like to come across when out walking

1. Horse and rider - always lovely (except one grumpy male rider I occasionally see)

2a. Walker with big friendly dog 2b. Walker with nonchalant dog 2c. Walker with small friendly dog 2d. Walker with unfriendly dog

1. Cyclist - they just seem to have a complete disregard for anybody else. Coincidentally always male.

If we're banning footpath users, I'd rather get rid of dogs than horses. Horse shit isn't toxic and it's nowhere near as fucking disgusting as dog shit - and horse riders, can't very well stop and pick it up, whereas dog owners have no excuse and still choose to ruin local beauty spots and public spaces out of sheer selfishness.

Horses are considerably less of a hazard and general nuisance than dogs, too. They're generally much more well-behaved and their owners generally less blithely oblivious/dismissive of other people's right to enjoy public spaces unmolested. I've never had a horse knock over my toddler/jump up and spatter mud over my clothes.

A huge proportion of dogs have no recall, chase, jump up, get under your feet, have owners who
exoect you to be charmed by them.
Most horse riders and don’t expect passers by to accept interaction with their horse.

Horses and there riders are way less irritating than dog-walkers. Cyclists are too mucc dc h a mixed bag to generalise... some are psychoticaly aggressive, others polite and friendly.

"There are bridleways that they can already use in the countryside"

There aren't nearly enough (due to years of bridleways being blocked, overgrown, taken off the map either legally or illegally, plus roads are busier than they ever were) and you often have to ride on roads to get to/between them. Horses and riders are vulnerable road users and car drivers are less and less likely to drive appropriately around horses. That's why it's being proposed to open up miles of existing safe off road paths for horse riders.

So is it really sensible to allow them on all pathways of whatever size where runners, cyclists and people just walking their kids or dogs might be?

We are used to runners, cyclists and people just walking their kids and dogs on bridleways. We co-exist there just fine because we're an extremely safety conscious lot who don't want to mow you down any more than you want to cause us harm.

How exactly do you give them a suitably wide berth on a narrow path?

With courtesy and care, the same way you pass a pedestrian on a footpath, or another road user on a narrow road. If you think all bridleways are wide and even and nicely kept, nothing could be further from the truth. You'd be amazed at the amount of times we haven't ploughed through a mum, 3 toddlers and baby in a pram on a bridleway or road.

I wouldn't want it. They chew up the pathways making them all but impassable in wet weather and with hard ankle twisting ruts in dry weather.

Walkers already have very little safe space.

I've been hit by a cyclist, lost skin off my heels when a mobility scooter shunted into me. Never had a problem with horses or dogs in our woods

I am a keen cyclist and I often share paths with horses and walkers. Good to see all users out enjoying the countryside and I have never had an issue with a horse or know anyone that has. Given horses will have been suing these paths for at least 2,00 years they hae kind og earned the right.

Surely the solution is to sort out the bridleways, not to take something away from walkers?

Nobody's taking anything away from walkers. They are free to use the footpaths as they have always done, and they are free to use bridleways as is their right too.

And do you really think we haven't thought of fighting for our bridleways? We have been fighting tooth and nail to keep what we already have for decades- but landowners want privacy, people want new homes and bypasses, local councils have less and less resources to deal with complaints and access being illegally blocked, and more and more of the countryside gets built on, paths get split up, combined with more and more traffic making roads a more dangerous place for us to be.

As bridleways disappear before our eyes we don't have the ability to create more bridleways either - landowners are unwilling to give permanent rights or go to the cost or inconvenience of creating and maintaining new bridleways. Safe access for horse riders doesn't feature in anybody's plan for a new housing estate, dualling a road or creating a bypass because it's extra expense and hassle for nothing but the gratitude of local riders.

I've ridden for 30 years, over more bridleways than I can count including v v narrow ones
Never had an issue. Mountain bike riders will shout they're behind, walkers move over or I stop, it just works if you're sensible

The only thing I've ever had an issue with is car drivers and a loose dog with absolutely no recall
If someone is nervous I'll move over, find a gateway to stand in, whatever they want