to think it’s not just the most vulnerable households that will need help with soaring energy bills?

[Itsokay2020]

Just that really, I appreciate that all households will receive £400 from October (and we’ll be saving this money!) but we are a working household, with a mortgage but little other personal debt. We earn decent salaries, or at least they were, but if our energy bills increase from £130 to £350 plus, we will find things tight. We are not expecting any significant salary increases in the next 12 months.

We haven’t had a family holiday abroad for several years, our cars are 9 years old, we rarely had takeaways and have stopped them altogether now. We’ve performed a financial review of our household expenditure, we can cut back if necessary (gym/tv subscriptions) but even so it doesn’t leave a huge amount of room for manoeuvre. I would prefer to get a second job than stop pension contributions, and have started to look more seriously at this.

We’re questioning whether to sell up, and could potentially have enough equity to be mortgage free, but leaving family, friends and jobs we love stops us in our tracks.

So, AIBU to feel that many households will need help, not just those deemed vulnerable?

We earn decent salaries, or at least they were, but if our energy bills increase from £130 to £350 plus, we will find things tight. We are not expecting any significant salary increases in the next 12 months.

Disabled people on DLA or PIP etc aren't expecting their conditions to get better in the next 12 months.
Pensioners, living on £10k a year, aren't expecting to get young again in the next 12 months.
So on and so on.

If someone is earning £40k, they may struggle to afford to pay everything.. but.. being on 40k puts someone in a better position to manage than someone on £11k.. or 10k or the unemployment rate of £4116 a year.. electric bill is going to be more than unemployment payments in the UK in 2022..

we are lucky we are on a fixed deal from last year at an okayish rate. However our holdhold income is just above 40k of which over 30 of that comes from one wage. We don't qualify for any support or and UC or anything else, however because of that as well we are stuck renting.

I get everyone will suffer, but some people dont get help, nor do they have assets or equity behind them, so if they fall on hard times there arent just downgrading lifestyle but losing everything

I am seriously thinking about how we can stay warm without the heating.

Single people.
People on a typical salary living by themselves.
Heating and electric bills don't half if you live by yourself.

stringent rules on how much profit energy companies can make before any being required to go back to the customers

You need to look up "capitalism". In capitalist societies, there cannot be limits on profit. That is the point of a free market economy. Are you advocating the nationalisation of energy companies? Many of which we can no longer nationalise as they are global companies. You can no more achieve this than you can tell Morrisons what to charge for beans.

Also I agre with a PP that a good portion of people are on in work benefits are so are also tax payers, castigating people who claim benefits as scroungers is just showing how much the daily mail has done a number on you

I'm also thinking about this, and a year from retirement. I've solved it. I'm moving. To another country....

It really doesn’t. That’s only about £2.5 k take home. If that’s paying a £500 gas bill and rent of £1.5k and that’s being really conservative in the sour. That’s £500 left for everything, food, other utilities, council tax, commuting. With kids, that’s not going far. They won’t get any help either.

as an FYI its not the energy companies which are making exorbitant profits, its the companies which mine/drill/explore for gas/oil which are raking it in. Even if we nationalised the energy suppliers it wont stop the issue it will just move the cost onto the exchequer which we would all end up paying anyway.

Unfortunately its times like this where Norway managed their reserves well with a mixed market approach and ring fencing the fund with proper rules, where as we turned them over to companies for pennies and a small marginal tax

Part of me is wondering if we can combine households in the winter with extended family to avoid heating 2 homes or something. We are feeling very squeezed middle right now.

That's a sensible idea. Take turns to have a 'warm' house

Yup, layers and blankets will feature heavily in this house.

unfortunately the energy companies seem a bit too slick to this and make sure your standing charge is profitable enough that your usage makes a much smaller dent if you reduce it.

I'd do this if I wasn't with dh. He is .ore introverted and likes his own space

I often say that I'd quite like communal living and think that more 'evenly sized bedroom' homes are needed so that people could live together more easily and fairly

@Itisasecret people don't seem to get that , if im paying £200 in but getting £300 out , I am not really paying am I
Not peoples fault as its sad state that wages can't cover costs of living

No and that’s the problem, it’s no-ones fault it’s the shit show of low wage and high subsidy economics which always will collapse at some point.

Like the 40k being thrown around as a high salary - it isn’t nowadays. That means you’ll not get any help, no cost of living payments no UC. However break down all the bills it’s not a salary which can withstand high bills without support (especially in the south).

People who just hit the 40% tax threshold are often worse hit as their tax burden is so high. There is a difference between being a positive economic contributor and a negative one. Unfortunately the former are the ones who shoulder the biggest tax burden and they too may well struggle with everything going on. Which means less in the pot to distribute to everyone else, less in the economy and less jobs.

YANBU minimum wage and tax thresholds both need to increase significantly if there aren't going to be 'handouts' for middle earners.

40% tax at 50k is ridiculous.

Some pensioners are on low incomes, but many are not. Most are also not paying rent, or mortgages, child care costs, commuting costs etc etc.

A single person over 25 with 2 DC born after 6/4/2017 and whose LHA is £400 (conservative example) would still receive a small amount of UC if their net earnings are 2.5k.

Standard element: £334.91
Child element x2: £244.58 x2
Rent: £400
Total = £1224.07

Earnings minus work allowance ——— 
£2500 - £344 = £2156

Earnings x 0.55 ——— £2158 x 0.55 = £1185.80


Total allowed - earnings deductions = total UC per month

£1224.07 - £1185.80 = £38.27

You won't be able to save it, it comes straight off your bill. It doesn't come to you.

So you think people should starve & freeze to death?

It's a good suggestion but would cost far too much to implement.

@likeminded apart from the 53% of the population are net recipients instead of net contributors to the state. About 30% of people claim some for of benefit, and 42% of those people work. The rest is made up by pensioners, people who are not well enough to work and a small proportion of long term unemployed. Realistically, most people are contributing very little to other peoples benefits.

I'm already planning my thermal underwear wardrobe.

I never thought I'd be grateful for the hot flushes of the menopause. Sometimes it really does feel as if I've got my own, internal, central heating system. That's gonna come in handy this winter when I can't afford to heat my house!

Tbh I was all set to say you were not being unreasonable until you said you could be mortgage free!

Not unattainable at all - many are mortgage free since buying their council properties many years ago, many because they have remained in their houses for many years and not 'moved up', many who earn a lot, many who have downsized to become 'mortgage free'. I don't think being 'mortgage free' automatically puts you in an elite group.

Everybody is going to be affected by the rising energy costs. Not sure who has planned to suddenly pay thousands for their electricity bill! Generally people cut their cloth according to their predicted expenses - to suddenly be lumbered by a price rise of this magnitude will affect most people who are not sitting on a fortune.
We have Johnson , still being paid to being PM doing absolutely nothing about this! It's outrageous.