To be scared the NHS won't go back to 'normal'? Does anyone actually know if it will?

[leafyclover]

I'm not sure if this is a case of unreasonable or not or it's just my anxiety. Also, I'm not trying to start a political bunfight nor am I NHS bashing, I'm genuinely scared.

I'm on a low income. I can't afford any form of private healthcare.

After being lucky enough to be in relatively good health most of my life, I've recently developed a gynae problem related to my births years ago. I'm in a lot of discomfort every day and it's causing symptoms which are really impacting on my life and I don't know how much longer I can continue to do my job like this.

I've been to my GP who has referred my to the hospital, but she says it will be at least 8 months, possibly even a year. A YEAR!! To even speak to a consultant?? Then presumably waits for tests etc before I even start any treatment??

I'm almost more depressed about this than I am about the condition. I remember being annoyed about waiting 8 weeks 16 years ago.. It feels so incredibly unfair and scary that I am mid 30s and could be looking at years and years of my life like this until I get treatment.

Please tell me that this is temporary backlog and things will get better..

I am so down about it and scared for the future.

Not unless they sort out the pensions crisis which is actively driving consultants and GPs away from the NHS.

Not sure my hereditary migraines or long covid agree with this.
Or my sons wound infection after cutting a leg on a hike.
i think we make healthy choices but still need medical care.

Sorry if this has already been asked but what specifically could Labour do to change things? Anything now would just be too little too late.

I don't vote either Conservative or Labour but even in the devolved nations the NHS is a complete shambles. I know because I work in the NHS in a devolved nation.

People just don't want to work in healthcare anymore. I don't think decent pay rises (although much deserved and I am prepared to strike for them) would make a huge difference. There are much better jobs and employers out there.

I have a long term health condition so have been a regular out patient for 25yrs and my DH is a senior consultant.
Nope it's not going to go back to normal, the system has been inflicted with serious wounds, the essential support systems that help it function (emergency services and care system) have also been inflicted with serious wounds.
Serious staffing crisis are being exacerbated by government policy rather than eased and burnout among staff is a serious issue.
Privatisation of services has caused massive waste due to inefficiency (the thing they are supposed to solve). For example I have spent months trying to sort out my essential meds which come via a private company because my hospital/gp is not allowed to prescribe/dispense it directly. My specialist nurse has spent hours, my gp has spent hours and I have spent hours trying to sort it out because the private company is incompetent but they have the contract "to prevent waste in the NHS" (literally this week alone my specialist nurse and I have spent 6hours in the phone)
For context it's only become a problem since I moved hospitals so is an administrative issue and is definitely the private companies incompetence not helped by the fact they constantly lie and never answer the 'helpline' it's not because they are complicated drugs.
My DH is now permanently stressed and we are trying to work out how he retires early, this has become a stark issue after a colleague recently took his life due to stress. DH has now been working in acute stress mode for over 2yrs and it's getting worse not better, it's not sustainable.
Equipment in his hospital is coming to the end of its life and there is no money to replace it so essential services are becoming unsafe. This isn't the hospital wasting resources but a failure of the government to anticipate that things (scanners, surgical suites)don't last forever and will need investment.

@wonkylegs
totally agree. Dh is a hospital consultant and has also been working in crisis mode well for years to be honest. The austerity measures decimated his department fairly quickly. He works with equipment so old it can’t be insured anymore, and companies won’t fix it because they don’t even make the parts anymore!!
He was originally planning to work another 12 years at least but we are now looking for him to retire in 5 years, or sooner if possible.
Staff are literally being driven out.

Nope this is completely bollocks and if you actually believe this and aren't just shit stirring then you are deluded
Yes a healthy lifestyle can help but it's no guarantee
I have an auto immune disease which cannot be 'cured' by healthy diet and exercise (no matter what some people say)
I got it after catching flu as a teenager and believe me if there was a way to avoid hospitals or drs or meds I would. I have tried many things over the past 25yrs, desperation will do that to you.
I eat a healthy diet and exercise everyday but unfortunately it's the drugs and the medical support that limit my disability and will hopefully lengthen my life... in the past I would have been horribly disabled and die early (this is evidenced) rather than living life, having a career, kids, paying taxes and being a functioning member of society.

They didn't ever get told a 6-8 month wait, they were just told that there were no appointments available. And despite them making doctors appointments every couple weeks and multiple visits to A&E it's now too late.

Sorry about your relative, @Jollygreen.

In case it helps others, you can check waiting times here nhs waiting times checker .

I've just been referred back to the consultant who did my knee replacement last year, because it's gone wrong. The wait to see them is 15 weeks. I'm lucky to have (very basic) private cover through work, so will make an appointment to see them privately just as soon as my GP gets round to sending me a copy of the referral letter.

If they put me on the NHS waiting list for the corrective surgery, it'll still be a 24 week wait, but that's still 15 weeks shorter.

I hate doing it, I've always been a massive supporter of the NHS, but the pain and impaired function is really quite severe.

It needs a rapid overhaul. The waste and cottage industries is shocking. We need to think of a co payment system like France, or Spain. It’s not the envy of the world and we don’t need a USA system but throwing money at it is not going to work. Why aren’t we looking at France or Spain and why isn’t it seen as an option.

Labour run Wales and it’s worse than the rest of the UK so all those stating it will be fine if Labour were in power are not right.

People also need to take some personal responsibility for their own health. My DS’s partner is a Health Vistor. She says there is a huge sense of entitlement amongst a number of patients and lots of quoting that they have paid their taxes etc.

DH is in the middle of a cancer "journey". His treatment and support has been without fault. But boy has it highlighted
•how much treatment like his must cost - I estimate £500k
•how much the NHS wastes on inefficiencies of the system. Just the amount of printed paperwork we've received as a really small example. Every update is posted to our GP, with a copy posted to us.
Every set of exercises is printed for us
Every diet plan is printed for us
Every appointment schedule is printed for us
And so on.
In the electronic age when airlines' tickets are electronic, when shops ask you if you need a printed receipt, when you have to print a returns label yourself etc, it's obvious that these companies save £££ just from the paper saving and postage costs.
With the relatively small investment needed to put all the info we've been given on line, and for notes to be emailed instead of posted the NHS would save millions over a year.
Granted there are some who aren't on line, but this is an increasingly small number of people, and stuff could be printed on an ad hoc basis in this situation.

I booked my Asthma review this week. It's over the phone because they're not doing the Peak Flow breathing tests. (Covid...) I did say to the receptionist that that's one of the main tests so why bother with the review at all? She said it's Box ticking. But really, why bother? They'd rather your Asthma got worse than see patients face to face.

Request a peak flow meter. I check mine that way

I think the fact office workers can work from home will hit NHS, teaching, police recruitment.

Same here. Clinical staff are complaining as things are nobut there's not enough admin who are already overworked.

Just the amount of printed paperwork we've received as a really small example. Every update is posted to our GP, with a copy posted to us.

Might be to reduce the risk of litigation

I doubt it.

My relatives are now in 60s/70s - so many tests needed. Pre op, scans, ultrasound, blood, angios, major ops, minor ops. These examinations weren't available to previous generations - and more are constantly being developed as its money in the bank for USA pharma/ medicine. We are well behind many countries in the sophistication of treatments.

I just hope we go to a sensible state healthcare system with means tested top up payments. Most Western and Northern European countries have much better state healthcare than we do - France, Germany, Scandinavian countries.... We need to look to them and get over this idea that a standard nominal fee (with exemptions for low income) for basic healthcare is a bad thing. It's either that and the possibility of a functioning system, or the unequal shitshow of US style privatisation which would be disastrous.

OP to clarify - if you have the diagnosis and the scan it's possible the consultant can put you on their NHS list if you need surgery.

Good idea to say if you can take short notice cancellations too, if you can.

The situation is very complex. Management is a part of the problem. Some managers are so "nicey-nice" that staff walk all over them. Some are totally unapproachable and many are just totally ignorant. The HR and Occupational Health Services are pretty dire at managing long term absences too.

I had a previous manager who was a lovely person but didn't know how to say no. For example she gave too many people Annual Leave at the same time and our department was on its knees. Another who tried to force a new shift system on staff without going through the proper process. Thankfully the unions got involved and put a stop to it. But by that time the damage was done and about 20 staff had left in disgust.

I also agree with a previous poster who suggested the Government look seriously at the model of healthcare that other countries use and consider a complete overhaul.

I've done hundreds of asthma checks over the phone using home peak flow readings. Treatment can be adjusted as we normally would, and a peak flow reading is only one part of the assessment. You actually get more valuable info talking to the patient. They can also usually be done quicker than face to face, so less appointment time needed and a shorter wait.
That's why we bother, as well as the box ticking bringing in money for the practice to pay wages so there are staff to run clinics.

The NHS in Wales and Scotland is run by Labour and SNP respectively. Nothing to do with the Conservative Party. The system is broken there too.

Thanks to Brexit we now have a chronic shortage of nurses and doctors in the NHS. We need to relax immigration requirements asap.

It needs a radical overhaul with clarity on what it should be achieving and how it should be funded.

There are many international models we could be learning from and implementing the best bits of.

Social care needs to be revamped in parallel.

Unfortunately this is an enormous job and there is no political will to do it, despite its urgency.

@Davyjones - aren’t you a peach! And very self-righteous.

Like another PP, my sisters and I were adults when we discovered our family carries a genetic mutation (BRCA1) that vastly increases lifetime risk of a whole smorgasbord of cancers. Barring risk-reducing surgery (and guess how long the wait on the NHS is for that!) there is NOTHING that will appreciably minimise the risk.

Anecdotally, one sister’s cancer treatment - during the height of the pandemic - was very good. So, too, were my dealings with genetic oncology at my local Trust.

However, in the last year, my mother has had to pay thousands for mobility-saving spinal surgery. We’ve also paid for my daughter to have GA dental work that had a 3 year NHS wait. Had we not been able to scrape the money together, she’d have lost one of her front teeth as another tooth grew sideways into its root. Meanwhile, my uncle is bloody lucky to have survived after finally receiving life-saving heart surgery, which was cancelled 3 times and initially involved a 36 hour stint on a chair and trolley in A&E.

The NHS is being expected to serve a population that’s far larger and longer-lived than was the case in 1948. I don’t know if we’re asking the impossible of it but I’m pretty sure that deliberate and willful underfunding by successive governments is leading us inexorably towards a two (or more) tier system where the services you get largely depend on what you can pay or are insured for. It’s terrifying.

If we cannot recruit then it will get worse and worse. Recruitment is at an all time low and certainly in my department we are beginning to panic. We are a weekday only service and we,ve had to open weekends and pay double overtime to clear massive backlogs. But unfortunately nobody wants to work weekends and nobody has volunteered. Maybe when winter arrives and people realise they can't afford heating they will.
We are an essential service without which people die.