Advice on how to react to DS 17 sexism

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DS 17 seems to have a real sexist attitude towards women and I don’t know why.

He has a gf who dotes on him and apparently (she told me) when he’s at her house he orders her around to make him food, get drinks, find stuff he’s lost etc. I said to her don’t put up with that nonsense, tell him to do it himself! When she stays at our home he will send her to the kitchen to get snacks or whatever, put his laundry in the basket and generally bosses her about. I have told him to stop behaving in this ridiculous entitled way and he says sorry mum, and also apologises to his gf but he just carries on with this behaviour as if nothing has happened.

it’s other little things like someone pulled out in front of me at a round about and he said ‘I bet that’s a bloody woman driver’, I told him off and he just sniggered thinking it was highly amusing.

on another occasion he was on the phone trying to sort out something and I heard him say ‘can I speak to someone who may know what they’re talking about like a bloke!’

He is not like this with me, he is respectful and uses manners. My other son 16 is the complete opposite to him, he is very humble and unassuming towards everyone (including women!).. This is not a learned behaviour as his Dad is very respectful towards me, does his fair share around the house, and generally shows a lot of appreciation and gratitude for everything I do.

How should I respond to this apparent disdain for the opposite sex? Or is this some kind of Macho alpha male thing which is hopefully a phase?

Is he watching the incel/alpha influencers on YouTube or Instagram? They're horrifically sexist and believe women are for breeding or serving men only.

Perhaps get your husband to have a word with him?

What's his Internet use like? What websites is he on? He sounds like he's being red pilled, radicalised into misogyny. It's great you've picked up on it and are challenging it.

Sorry posted too soon. Agree with getting husband to speak to him. Can you ask him to break it down logically why he thinks these things?

His GF needs to dump him, it's dangerous for her to think it's okay to put up with this. You need to protect her from your son.

If he is not seeing this behaviour at home then he is clearly learning it from somewhere and I think it would be a good idea to find out where.

I'm not sure asking your husband to speak to him will do anything other than reinforce the idea that women shouldn't have any authority or are unable to assert themselves. I think it would be better if you and your husband spoke to him together so that he can see you and your husband are in agreement that he behaviour is unacceptable.

I would also introduce some chores for him to do and encourage some independence with other tasks such as doing his own laundry just so that he can learn that domestic chores are not " women's work". I would gently intervene when he starts ordering his girlfriend around, perhaps by asking him to get things for her, such a a drink, because she is his guest and it's good manners.

I thought it was interesting you said your other son was respectful t everyone and then put "including women" in brackets. There are only makes and females so if he is respectful to everyone then no further clarification was needed. I wonder if you don't see yourself as equal to men which is why you expressed it that way.

I feel for his poor girlfriend, your son is training her to accept being treated badly in relationships and this is likely to have long term consequences for her but I'm not sure how much you can do for her. I think you need to concentrate on addressing your son's behaviour. I'm sorry to say he sounds unpleasant and disrespectful towards women.

if he said that to me while I was driving I eould pull over and let him out. He can't insult women drivers whilst being ferried around by one.

I'd also stop washing his clothes and cooking his food.
drop any washing (dirty) from the basket into his bed and do the same with dirty dishes.

Show him what it's like when a woman won't do anything for him and also keep an ear out for his girlfriend and tell him she needs to leave when he treats her like a slave.

disgusting behaviour but he I'd still a boy eww and hopefully he's just gotten caught up with being a 'man' vile things and you've got a chance here to fix him up like the little boy he still is.

my dads gotten terribly sexist lately and I've started pulling him up on it every time. it's ridiculous. I suggested moving the bbq today and he said no. he then asked my dh if he thinks we should move the bbq and my dh said yeah... so we moved the bbq. AS I SUGGESTED. But its his issue and I said 'oh inly move it when a man has given you permission to use my idea'.

they look stupid to most men and all women. The only people who agree are twats. sexist twats

Whilst I think you and his father should speak to him, I do think his father should really make a point of pulling him up on it every. single. time.

Having a man model that this is NOT appropriate behaviour as well as you stands a good chance of helping, because it is likely somewhere, somehow, he is learning from some man, that this is ok.

I would go absolutely fucking nuts tbh, the car incident, I'd have pulled over and told him he could walk if women drivers weren't acceptable to him!

Pound to a penny he's on some fucking disgusting incel site that is preaching all this misogynistic crap.

I'd tell him he'll be lucky to keep a girlfriend with such a horrible attitude and that I'd recommend his current girlfriend look for someone better if he kept being so awful.

I suggest making fun of him when he makes remarks. I would also ask him why he said that. You want to know what's driving this. If you come down hard, he won't tell you.

On the other hand, if he'd sniggered after I'd told him off I would probably have pulled over to the kerb and asked him if he'd prefer to walk and extracted an apology from him.

I would consider telling his GF that she's not to wait on him in your house.

Is he watching the incel/alpha influencers on YouTube or Instagram?

Goodness, is that a thing? 😬

Every time I heard a comment like that, I'd refuse to include him in family supper and tell him to make his own.

Comments in the car, I'd stop the car and tell him to walk.

Respond by doing nothing for him any more. Show him that women, including you, aren’t second class citizens or slaves for men. Don’t confirm to his sexist stereotype. No lifts, cooking, cleaning, washing, money. Restrict access to things - you’re a hard working woman and why should an entitle man boy who doesn’t respect you be able to use your car/internet/TV subscription.

Yep. It’s called the manosphere and it’s coming for our young boys. Watch out for the way he says things OP - for example if he moans about the women’s football and makes it about the men. These boys are being heavily indoctrinated into these dangerous ideologies

Does he have responsibilities around the home? I know you said he's respectful and uses manners towards you but do you do everything for him?
I can see that if he is catered to and picked up after by you, he would be the same with a gf.

I agree with pp, tell him to get out of the car and walk.

does he do his share of domestics? If not, he must start immediately.

I'd also sit him down and ask him what his problem is.

plus - if you hear him talking down to his girlfriend, I'd make a point of telling her not to put up with his crap and she should leave him. Which I hope she does.

Yes, has been for ages.

I'm afraid it is. There's all sorts of awful shit on there. Which is why I think it's important as parents to be very careful about how these topics are broached. I'm not saying that we should ignore disrespectful behaviour, but a big telling off might close the door on a discussion about where these ideas are coming from, a discussion that might fix the problem. Relaxed vigilance works much better in my experience to a big lecture. Not only that, if the OP's son is watching incel crap then a big lecture will play into the hands of the incels.

I agree with pp that he’s picking this misogynistic poison up from somewhere, almost certainly online. I’d have zero tolerance for any of the examples the OP has given - just confront it very directly.

OP you also say he apologises and carries on behaving that way.

Worth noting - This is a tactic in itself. He doesn't mean a word of it. I used it when I was 17! It didn't come up much, but sometimes to avoid aggravation from parents, I would apologise for things and just carry on doing as I pleased.

It mattered less in that generation because we were keen to earn money and leave as soon as possible, even if for a grotty room in a houseshare with a foul smelling mattress.....But also at 17, it was all doing own laundry, own cooking at least a few nights. Lived in London so no need for lifts.

But these days people seem to get lumbered with a adult children at home for a while.

He must do his share and lose the attitude.

When she stays at our home he will send her to the kitchen to get snacks or whatever, put his laundry in the basket and generally bosses her about.

It's your house. He gets his own snacks and does his own laundry or it doesn't happen. He speaks politely to everyone or he finds a new place to live.