Overly sensitive employees/apprentices

[OhGoodnessItsSoExhausting]

Ok, so I pride myself on being a strengths focussed supervisor. I always want to mentor and help my employees and apprentices as much as possible. But the last two apprentices (all apprentices in this role are graduates if that's relevant) have been soooooo sensitive and just plain.annoying!

I can't give any feedback because they 'know it already.' I can't say anything right because apparently I know nothing about transgender issues or decolonisation of the workplace and I need to hear them 'educate' me on it all and lend me books because they (20 years younger with zero experience in this role) know how to resolve ingrained, inherent systemic racism and prejudice and clearly if they were in my role they'd have solved all the problems in society which impact the role, already.

They are always 'curious about X...' and 'wondering about y...' instead of just speaking in normal language

They are driving me insane!!!

They can't manage their workload (even though I'm so worried about upsetting them I give them half what I've given to previous apprentices). Apparently it's important to be 'boundaried' and assertive with your needs. (Yes,.I know that, but I'm just asking you to do your job - you are paid more for these apprenticeships than many of the more senior staff in the organisation).

They are so bloody self absorbed and self riteous. I find them so patronising.

Is this entitlement, condescending attitude and use of fluffy language a generation thing? Or (please tell me), I've just had a bad run of two extremely annoying apprentices!!? (who I found out today are friends! So I guess they feed off each other discussing how amazing and riteous they are and how everyone else in the organisation is incompetent.)

Grrr..

No, you don't. That's what mobiles are for.

Millennials 1984 and after? I think it's a younger generation who are like this. I'm 40, this isn't my generation, this is the generation after mine. I know people who say to employers 'I have difficulty getting up in the morning so I can't be here on time every day'

That's what I'm doing @OooErr and she is probably not going to last much longer. Not sure why me simply sharing that information made it seem otherwise.

What worries me is if these kids don't grow up fast, then we're going to see all sorts of things go wrong as most industries do actually need trained, efficient people with a work ethic to keep them running.

I can't say I'm surprised there are (more) young people with anxiety and motivation issues these days. In most places they won't be able to afford to buy a house, ever, even though mortgages are often cheaper than rent. Their opportunities are being curtailed by a Brexit they largely didn't vote for. There won't be any pension money available even if they live long enough to retire. Climate change is only going to get worse their whole adult lifetime unless something drastic is done (and I'm not hopeful seeing how our current Conservative leadership candidates don't bother to address climate issues, because most of the voting membership are too old to have to worry about it). And as a group, youngsters are constantly told by the media they'd be fine if they could only stop wasting money on avocados, or posh coffee or whatever.

OP (and others in the same boat), you might just have had a run of angsty youth apprentices, and some better ones are round the corner - but generally speaking, I'd be getting worried about poor mental health / despondency about the future amongst young people, as I can only see this increasing...

Whilst you should not specify the university, I'd bet it is one that was not called a university before 1992

Sussex and Bristol seem to have an influential cohort of both staff and students, in terms of cancel culture, susceptibility to being triggered etc…..

I think it comes from all sides really - universities have shockingly low expectations of students these days - we had three fucking sessions before placements on "don't wear trainers" and "remember to take some back up means of payment and your placement phone number in case you lose your phone" and it was just ridiculous - even for the dippiest 18 year olds on the course.

However students do come into university really clueless - and always have done I think - I remember my first degree where my housemate was amazed when she discovered the existence of ready grated cheese for the jacket potatoes that were the only meal she knew how to cook. I was sat in the student gateway waiting area a few years ago now waiting for something or other and there were at least 3 students came in who were amazed that they were expected to reapply for student finance each year - and hadn't done so they were facing suspension for non-payment of fees.

You also get some pretty crappy mentors as well - I've just finished final placements as a mature student and, because of various covid-related logistics, I had to do placements across two settings. One was run by a clinician who left me very little to do the first couple of weeks until we got into the swing of things - so I made sure I occupied my placement hours on independent learning, using training opportunities given around the trust for all their students and the like - and then after checking I knew what I was doing enough, I was very much given a few cases to manage and off I went, feeding back if I needed help. I did exceptionally well with the placement (to the point they tried everything to keep me on the staff) but it took a LOT of me taking the initiative and driving things through myself to do so. The other placement had a clinician who really did not like having a mature student and she set me up to fail from the outset - would schedule days of clients and then mark me down for not managing a full client load - when she had booked them all in and I had no accesses to do so! Again, would spend hours and hours telling me how amazing she was and how I wasn't as experienced as her - like, that's the whole point of me being a student! Just really really had students as a way to feed into her own ego and if I'd had her as the only placement I would have possibly quit the course!

The social justice and feelings that they are the only generation who know how to save the world - that's part of being young and thinking that your generation are the only ones who've spotted what is wrong and that you have the insight to change things from the previous ones... and then they blink and find they're discussing mortgage providers over a dinner party and are middle aged and turned into their parents. Decolonising is fucking HUGE in my uni at the moment, and depending on where you are - so are transgender issues - and it sounds like they're just trying to do everything "right" as they've been taught - same with the "wondering about x" type language - my brother picked that up on his social work course and he's still doing it these days.

You got a couple of weak ones who don't quite fit - give them clear targets and tasks - tighten it up a bit more than you would expect to have to do, and let the uni know this pair are floundering a bit.

Are you able to say which sector you work in and what are the uni courses the apprentices are studying?

I think this will be influential in their demeanour.

It sounds like they have been a 'dictionary' of phrases of how to raise concerns / queries to the employer without causing offence but it results in not asking direct questions which could be easier to answer.

I do feel sorry for all students coming out of University that has been affected by the pandemic. They haven't had a 'normal' experience and a lot of these students have been affected by mental health issues with zoom lectures and little socialising

@OhGoodnessItsSoExhausting Based on your posts, I think I know which profession this is! The uni teaching is likely to be where a lot of the identity politics stuff is coming from. That and (if I'm correct about the profession) the need to make performative "reflections" about their own sense of privilege (and other people's poor practice).

The salary issue is a complex one. After qualification, these people go straight into a senior position with some leadership responsibility. So they are supposed to be experienced and competent professionals even at the beginning of the apprenticeship. They are also very unlikely to be 21yo graduates. It's basically a requirement of the trainee position to have several years of professional experience in lower paid roles before starting.

It's also worth pointing out that the "uni" component is not just teaching/assignments. There is a heavy emphasis on original PhD-style research. That said, I'm doing a similar type of training myself and it is not at all more stressful/difficult than any other job I had and the amount of support (because it is supposedly very stressful) is extremely high.

Re the salaries, and also the generation:
DS is 25 and being paid 29k as a junior doctor. He recently paid for his ALS (advanced life support) course ( compulsory) out of this meager salary.
On his first ever night on call had three deaths' before midnight.
He is a coper because his education and training expects this.

These graduates need a stern word.

Fair enough.
The overall tone of the thread though is ‘this generation is X Y Z’. I can’t comment on uni lecturers, or other people with large cohorts but I’ve always remembered having a couple of people like this. Not just graduates, also people with a few years experience who think they’re hot shit (newsflash : nope).
But then I’m in an industry where career changers, ‘self taught’ etc people are common and I’ve dealt with all sorts.

Most universities were always like this, as others have posted, being idealistic is part of being young. My parents were the same at uni in the 70s. There’s nothing wrong with protesting and trying to change injustices!

A personal peeve of mine - the use of “triggered” in this way originally comes from mental health and PTSD paired triggers, so when we use it jokily, to mean “over sensitive person” it dilutes the real meaning and stigmatises mental health issues. You might think I’m over sensitive to point that out, but I work with people with PTSD and so I like to mention it, up to you if you take in on board or not

No, you don't. That's what mobiles are for

Rubbish. You can't phone the doctor and stay on hold for ages in the workplace. Or take personal calls very easily, depending on the workplace concerned.

Well the industries could start training people. Although I disagree strongly with Brexit, I have to admit that a shortage of staff from overseas will force lazy employers to train UK-resident staff.

I’ve found similar, weirdly.

I’m in my late twenties (so not exactly “old”) but work in management and had a new start recently who is absolutely infuriating me.

Wanders around work at a snail’s pace. Absolutely no get up and go about her. Will stand and talk to other members of staff who are doing their job and not see anything wrong with it. Huffs and puffs if you put her on a certain task, but also huffs and puffs if you put her on another task (only 2 tasks available at her level). Has rang in sick multiple times since starting. Has tried to ring in for a hangover. Starts a job then leaves it half finished and wanders off.

And recently, I’ve noticed they seem to be hiding in the toilet before/after breaks and during the shift.

They’re going to need spoken to for the second time within about a 3 month period. It’s an absolute joke. I’m very busy in my role; I don’t have the time to babysit someone their entire shift. I have my own management tasks I need to do plus picking up the slack and basically doing their job for them, too. Plus the tasks assigned cannot be more simple. It’s literally a case of moving item a from one location to another, as an example.

It will be spoken about, again, and an employment review needs to be carried out asap, but it’s just frustrating that people genuinely can’t go into work and work.

Also, it’s not everyone in this age group. Have multiple others a similar age to work hard and get on with it. It’s just really shit and annoying when one person takes the absolute piss.

I have hired many graduates in the last few years. I have never had this problem. I also remember people moaning at work about young people back in the 80's

What is SPAG?

It's spelling, punctuation and grammar @WhereYouLeftIt

And yes, I did ponder whether I should put an Oxford comma in there.

I work in a university and employ students to provide peer to peer support. I have found them all to be brilliant. I've not had any of the issues the OP has experienced.

Hear hear.

While your experiences chime with me with regards to some of our younger employees (one of which who has dropped to 4 days for a "work life balance" which I just baulk at looking at my past working history) I have to balance this out with regards to three of our outstanding voluntary employees from Uni placements who have now become full-time employees. Young and keen and examplary.

Wanders around work at a snail’s pace

Heh. That reminded me of a partner telling me to walk faster around the office to look busier, 20 years ago. I don't agree with this performative shite personally. Plus you might crash into people.

one of which who has dropped to 4 days for a "work life balance"

Good for them!

Thanks you. Hadn't seen the term before.

My DS 26 is doing an apprenticeship degree, but he has only one day in uni, so 4 days a week during term time. He worked there before he was offered the apprenticeship. He earns around 45k so not sure how unusual that is. This is a part time degree and takes 5 years. They also take on apprentices straight from 6th form , but not sure what they earn.
In this case the employer choses the apprentices and actually sets the qualification requirements for the degree.