To think the country is b*gg*r*d, and life as we once knew it is over?

[RejectedFleece]

Just that really.

So if things continue as they are, which is that we are in total shit, that would prove that brexit wasnt so bad in the end??

That makes no sense at all, I hate brexit, it is utter sabotage of our wellbeing, I am deeply grieved about it, I do NOT want things to continue as they are, we are failing and failing badly, the bottom has fallen out of this country.

Brexit only exacerbated and brought forward things that were already on the cards. The pandemic kinda papered over cause and effect, but the global economy was not in a good way in late 2019.

The EU is not a sustainable entity. You would see it fail with us in it or without. When we're discussing the fact that technological civilisation is grinding against physical limits, with prosperity being more or less on hold in the West for two decades now, there was no other outcome possible.

Pandemic, war, inflation, shortages - that's all happened before and as a country and as a species we will recover from those, though obviously many individuals have had their lives ruined by them.

Climate change though, I think we've passed the point of no return. That's it now. Our species lived through the ice age, but there were far fewer people and movement from unliveable areas to other places was possible. It won't be possible this time.

This is something different- it’s a timing issue- Tail end of a pandemic and a war in Europe.
Fiscal policy of governments around the world have driven inflation by flooding the markets with money when there is supply issues and then the war creating a wheat and energy crisis.
To add, the apathy of an appalling government is permeating our society A very bumpy road ahead.

Forget about climate change being addressed. Americans certainly have.

@FortonServices you are right. There is no financial incentive in the uk to farm on a small scale with higher welfare and quality priorities. Commercial farming is all about input costs. The investment needed to farm at a commercial level is eye watering with little long term commitments from supermarkets. I really don’t know how some farmers sleep at night with the debts they owe to the banks. But no need to worry about food production we’ll just import more food from the other side of the world to help climate change!! 🙄

The UK economy faces a dire situation at the moment. We have the highest inflation of G7 countries and are expected to have the lowest growth rate in the coming year.

What we will see in the coming years in more and more people descend in to poverty. Many older women, dependent on state pensions, will face the very real prospect of severe food and fuel poverty.

The outlook for healthcare services is particularly grim due to staff shortages. The shortages will predominantly affect older women who live longer and more likely to need care in their old age.

Climate change dwarfs all concerns very real though they well may be. That puts us in an unprecedented position and I'm mid to late 50's so well remember shitty times from days gone by. It does all feel a bit grim right now.

@MrsIsobelCrawley an economist friend was explaining that the uk is further forward in the economic downturn than other countries due to us coming out of covid ahead of others? I don’t think any countries are going to swerve the recession tbh. The poverty gap is very concerning and looking after our elderly should be an absolute priority for the next government.

So if things continue as they are, which is that we are in total shit, that would prove that brexit wasnt so bad in the end??

No. 'Turning around' does not mean continuing as things are.

We certainly are further forward in the economic downturn.

Unfortunately, forecasts show the downturn is likely to be deeper and longer here than elsewhere. This will have a huge effect on our standard of living.

The big concern though is whether we remain in long-term decline. The UK is facing a long decade of decline and underperformance due to its departure from the EU, an ageing population and the challenge of making the economy less reliant on fossil fuels.

I'm cynical enough to believe that the politicians running this country are doing nothing for us and and are just doing it for the money.

Feathering their own nests, greasing the palms of their mates who'll give them jobs afterwards or are so rich it doesn't matter if they fuck up (Rishi, I'm looking at you).

They haven't a clue, about politics, the economy or us.

It's all about them and their own coffers

Wage stagnation means peoples wages havent gone up, so how have more people entered into higher tax rates?

Fiscal drag. Tax bands not uprated with inflation for decades therefore more higher rate taxpayers than ever before.

I would also say again that the tax take is lower than its been in modern times

Nope, it's the highest it has been in 40 years (36% GDP).

Well yes. But shorter term a Government deliberately debasing the currency in a country reliant on imports for the majority of its fuel and food was not going to end well, was it?

I think the whole way of life here has changed since covid. Food is increasing along with fuel .flights are less affordable and unreliable. Food has been low price and we are seeing big increases and less choice.yanbu !

We need a PM focused on economic growth, who ignores media issues such as the current gender debate or scandals like the current drama. We need to rejoin the EU cut spending and get everyone out to work. We need to focus on our place in the G7, the problem is no candidate is currently promising and they are heading into summer recess

Economic growth globally will be over well before 2040. This is almost exactly in line with the standard run model the Club of Rome published in ‘72.

There are no economists who have a track record anything like this one book from fifty years ago. Time to change the record on “we need to focus on growth”.

@Bloodyel , not everybody by any means gives a toss about flash cars -even those who could well afford them.

And if you think it’s only the UK where people idolise cars, you’re way out. I’ve lived in countries where people would honestly almost rather not eat, than be seen to have an ordinary old car.

Carbrain is a chronic condition. Medical science has yet to find any possible cure.

Which was my original point, that the people that grieve about brexit are not the same people that want things to continue as they are, which you disagreed with.

My point was that some people are so entrenched in their Brexit whinging that they'd be partly annoyed if it actually turned out to be a good thing and they were wrong.

These types of people are not dissimilar from the corona moaners revelling in the whole "OMG, she's walking the dog for the second time today. Somebody call the police!"

The only people who want things to continue are the ones enjoying the drama and whinging. I've not met anyone that voted for Brexit that is actually enjoying it now. It's the ones on their high horses that are getting stuck in with the doom and gloom.

You're off your rocker, there is a desperate need for us to get back the advantages that we enjoyed while in the EU, we have lost so much, it sounds to me as if you're so entrenched in your views that you fail to see what is going on around you and you cant understand what people are experiencing or wanting.

Of course people who hate brexit dont want things to continue as they are we are virtually ruined.

You're a right wing ideologist by the sounds of it, so I will end the discussion

amp.theguardian.com/business/2022/jul/07/uk-unsustainable-debt-set-to-reach-320-of-gdp-in-50-years-obr-warns

This is a scary article about the changing demographics

I've not met anyone that voted for Brexit that is actually enjoying it now

Well, no surprise there. As they were all told beforehand. And they and their children and grandchildren will continue not to enjoy it in perpetuity.

Thanks so much.

Looks at the charts. Why do you think inflation and growth forecasts in the UK are the worst outside of Russia?

Clue: GBP fell in value a LOT and will continue to while politicians can't even name the issue let alone propose solutions. We have no food or energy security, we import basic essentials. If you cut yourself off from your largest market and increase the trade deficit by 300-400% and deliberately debase the currency as a direct result, do you expect to become poorer or richer?*

*Unless you are one of JRM's investors whp he told to move into other currencies directly after the Brexit vote.