Moral dilemma

[Cloudy90]

it’s a will and inheritance one

My friend Sandy was married to Bob but he passed away last year. Bob had been married before to Trish and had two sons (Bill and Ben). Bob paid Trish 65% of the equity when they divorced and Bill and Ben moved into a house with Trish. Sandy was with Bob when he divorced Trish but their relationship started years after the split.

Sandy helped Bob out financially as it was a long messy divorce using her life savings and some inheritance, she knows this wasn’t sensible but Sandy and Bob were desperate to start there lives.

Bob kept the marital home and rented it out to a relative (Steve) who covered the mortgage payments so Bob wasn’t making a profit. Bob passed away and steve has moved in with his girlfriend so Sandy wants to sell. Bill and Ben are wanting their “inheritance” but there isn’t any as Sandy inherited everything. They have got solicitors involved, and she doesn’t know what to do. A few things to note

bob passed away young and unexpectedly, with no savings

trish was given 65% of the equity so Sandy doesn’t think Bill and Ben should be looking at Bob’s estate for their whole inheritance

trish spent her 65% and doesn’t own a property

there was a verbal agreement between Bob and sandy that when the house was sold she would receive the money to cover the amount she lent to Bob

bob and Sandy had their own house but it was a new mortgage so not much equity, sandy has been left with an expensive mortgage and may have to downsize, so needs as much money as possible

the sale of the house won’t cover the sum Sandy lent Bob due to the remortgage to pay Trish off

I’ve helped Sandy as much as I can and said she could give them a small sum each from the sale of the house, even £2000 each. I don’t think they will get far legally as they are adults now. But I think Bob would like them to have a little gift?

what do you think?

Sandy shouldn’t give them a penny.

What moral reason? The money is morally Sandy’s.

Moral reasons don't pay bills.
Sandy needs to look after herself. If Bill and Ben want money they need to look to Trish, who had a settlement and spent it.

And this is why the world is going to hell in a handcart.

If I was Sandy I would send them an email explaining what you laid out in the OP so that they know that she is actually just getting her own money back, rather than taking anything away from them.

Do you not need life insurance for a mortgage any more?

I can. My DH had multiple mortgages and no life cover. I am more than a bit resentful about it, but it wasn’t me. We arranged life cover and he cancelled it. (I found out later through a friend that he thought it was too expensive. If I had known I would have arranged some life cover myself)

No someone doesn’t need life insurance for a mortgage

I think Sandy should keep the money and get herself back on track. She used the money in good faith to help their Dad out during a difficult time and they should accept that.

How so?

Go with the Will

Move over war in Ukraine, you’ve got competition in the form of Sandy.

or not.

Poor Sandy. She obviously should not pay a penny to Bill and Ben. Sandy/her solicitor should explain why in simple terms and leave it at that. I wouldn't gift them anything.

There’s no moral dilemma here that I can see.
If Bob’s estate doesn’t even pay back what Sandy foolishly gave him, then there’s no moral issue at all.
There’s only a moral issue if Sandy inherits more than she’s owed.

Even then, I’m tempted to say no issue as Bob could have named the boys in his will - but actually, if you know that he’d want that but was shit at admin then it does become a moral reason to follow his wishes.
They were both foolish.
I wouldn’t be advising Sandy to gift to the boys from her money.

Personally I would put half the value of the house in trust to be left to them upon my death. But I would seek legal advice about it.

They have no legal right to it but I would always want someone I lover’s children to be provided for.

@Meraas that's why I put it in inverted commas. Some people will say it's morally right to give his sons something...

Sandy will be pleased most people agree, she’s having a hard time but I think she should send a letter explaining the situation again but I know she has tried already.

thank you everyone.

As his wife Sandy inherits it all unless the will specified otherwise.
Bob should have made a will, most parents like to leave their children something in their will. It's sensitive when it's the family house that's being sold.
Sandys loan doesnt sound like an official one its more like a couple pooling resources with a joint aim.
Sandy should ensure she is not left in a financially vulnerable position but I think it would be decent ( and moral) of sandy to offer her stepsons something from their dad's estate, whether that's personal possessions or a gift of money or both.

I think Sandy should be careful she doesn’t say anything compromising in her letter.

Seems simple enough. As you’ve said, Sandy inherits Bob’s estate in full. Whether she did so under the terms of Bob’s will or in the absence of one doesn’t change that fact.
Bob’s adult sons expectations are just that, expectations.
no doubt Sandy needs the money for her future care. She will have lost out considerably on her investment returns over the years by using her savings to bail out Bob’s and his first wife.
If I was Sandy’s friend I’d be telling her to look after herself & that includes making or updating her own will and LPAs making her trusted friends, executors and administrators. She could, if she can afford it and wanted to, make token gifts to her stepsons now but I doubt that’d be in any way grateful.

As an ex financial adviser the key thing here is that Bob passed away young and Sandy still has a mortgage.

There isn't really any inheritance. Equity in a joint property rightfully passes to the surviving spouse.

It would perhaps be a moral dilemma if Bob was loaded and promised the kids an inheritance and died intestate.

Bob fulfilled his responsibility to Trish (with the help of Sandy so maybe the sons need a reminder / be advised of that) and in effect, started afresh with Sandy. I can't see any dilemma here.

Had Bob made a will, would he have made it so Sandy was forced to sell up? I very much doubt it.

No, she doesn't 'owe' Bill & Ben any money.

She needs to write to them explaining his settlement with Trish, how much SHE spent bailing him out, the fact 'Steve' only covered the mortgage, not the expenses & that their home had very little equity & that the profit from selling the rental won't even cover how much she lent Bob to sort out his divorce payments/costs.

She shouldn't have to do it, but it's probably the easiest way to stop them in their tracks.

I don't know why you think she should give them money when Bob/his Estate actually owes her money

Tell Dick and Dom to do one!

Stick to the will. Ignore them. Who is executor? They need to follow Bob's wishes as stated in his will. If she is executor then personally I'd invest in one appointment with a solicitor to talk it through.

I wouldn’t bother writing the letter. They’re focused here on what they want, and I imagine anything less than that they will consider unacceptable. They’re never going to ‘hear’ Sandy because they don’t want to, they don’t care about her needs now or in the future.

I’m not sure why some posters think Sandy needs to ‘morally’ consider people that are not only not considering her, but actively treating her like shit.