Anybody else feel like we are heading for an equivalent of the "winter of discontent"?

[Ihatethedawnchorus]

There just seems to be more and more talk of strikes from different areas and it just feel likes a build up of general discontent(not blaming anyone, things are bad, not likely to improve in the short term and people are getting desperate and disillusioned with good reason)

Which is why any competent Government would have been focusing on energy and food security for at least a decade now as their top priorities. Not fucking about messing up our trading relationships.

Agree.

I’m not looking forward to the winter at all. Hoping that we (as a family) manage to have a nice summer to get us through. We have a holiday booked that I hope we get to go on as haven’t been away for years but then again flights being cancelled and covid on the up, makes it unlikely. We also have a trip to London booked but again train strikes threaten that. I (personally) am really hoping that these things happen for us over the summer as it’s going to be a long, worrying winter.

This is an excellent description of the English approach to voting (I say England rather than the UK, because Scotland, Wales etc. have very different political climates).

It's the race to the bottom, the gnawing fear that someone, somewhere, who in your view should be worse off than you are is getting something you're not. Pure spite against any group not deemed to be worthy, whether that be single mums, asylum seekers, disabled people or the unemployed.

Exactly what you say about any competent government. It seems that they are deliberately trying to blow up an economy which is already in very serious trouble.

GDP forecast for the UK from the OECD and IMF are still higher for the UK than France or Germany.

No, it isn't.

www.icaew.com/insights/viewpoints-on-the-news/2022/apr-2022/chart-of-the-week-g7-economic-growth

This really is just the beginning. We have countries like China, Brazil and India moving out from under the shadow of US/Western hegemony and looking to assert themselves on the world stage and raise living standards for more of their population whilst the western powers desperately try and fight the tide and their populations become increasingly unhappy as their own standards fall. All battling over the same dwindling resources while the climate wreaks havoc.

the Ukraine conflict is just the first of what will be several wars over resources and territory, climate change will drive mass migrations towards us, right wing nationalism and authoritarianism will rise everywhere. Basically unless we magically discover a cheap and easy source of power (working fusion anyone) or aliens invade, we’re all screwed. The rich and powerful have already realised this, which is why they’ve been busy stealing as much wealth and power as they can over the last 20 years, literally printing more money in order to do so. It might even save them.

Very good question.

Tax rises and pay freezes should be directed exclusively to those who voted to be poorer.

Yes I don't think people quite realise the scale of what is to come. 8 of the 10 most populated cities on Earth (tens of millions of people living in each) are in coastal areas that will be flooded if sea levels rise. Mamy countries near the equator will become entirely uninhabitable. There will be huge population movements the like of which have never been seen.

Many of the areas which provide a large proportion of the world's food will become unfarmable. There will be wars and violent conflict. Fresh water will also become a precious resource.

If it doesn't end in nuclear war, it will still be carnage. In the UK we are in the somewhat fortunate position of having plenty of water (if we had the infrastructure to store it properly). We also have plenty of wind and endless miles of coastline so could be self-sufficient in energy with the right investments using wind and hydroelectric power. The channel protects us a lot from the conflicts and population movements as it always has, so geographically and geologically we are incredibly fortunate. Our main national security issue should be food security and there are innovative farming methods that could help to address this but again, nothing is being done.

Sadly the electorate do not vote on this basis. It's all about "sovereignty" or "expel the foreigners" or "I think that guy is funny" or whatever. There is no much time left but many things could be done with competent people in charge. No sign of any, though.

I keep reading these anecdotes about how other countries are looking down on us, yet somehow our soft power rating has still increased. Also read that we've now renegotiated all but three of the 40 trade deals which we had previously (and paid billions to access). Not sure if true as haven't had time to Google it.

Don't get me wrong, I despite BJ as much as the next person, didn't, and would never, vote for him, but all the things you quote happened AFTER the last general election, so nobody (other than the idiots MPs who voted against the no confidence motion) has had the opportunity to vote against him. Yes, he had a dodgy reputation even before he became PM, and I don't know why anyone voted for him at that point, but I don't get how you're suggesting people have kept voting for him since partygate/parliament/BJ in his office etc have all come out when 99.99% of the population haven't had the opportunity to vote for or against him. Unless I've missed a general election in the last year?

As @MongoOnlyPawnInGameOfLife says, resources are dwindling and are certainly not enough to sustain the population. Energy is the chief one and the reduction in usable energy is causing economic collapse, but also minerals, food and water. Others countries are asserting themselves against the order that has held for a considerable time so things are changing.
The UK is particularly badly placed as it imports most of its energy and food and has few natural resources. It also has an economy based on 'the city' and services. It has only survived the last 40 years because of encouraging 'investment', turning a blind eye to money laundering and allowing our infrastructure to be bought up by foreigners. Not a great long term plan!
I'm not convinced that the rich and powerful fully understand the situation.

On top of this, as @EverySockIsOdd says, we have serious risks to the environment.

Put together, the likelihood of conflicts, disease and general dissatisfaction increases hugely.
The electorate certainly don't understand this in general and seem to think the government will sort things out with some clever tricks and that things will dip for a bit and then set off again.

At a global level, nationalism has been on the rise for a decade as politicians have found that what appeals to the dissaffected masses is FB-sloganism, protectionism, macho hotgirlfriend/horseback/holdagun bullshit and base-level fear (e.g. of immigrants). This is universal from the UK to China to Russia and the US.

What always baffles me is why WOMEN fall for the macho hotgirlfriend/horseback/holdagun bullshit part of it?

Don't get me wrong, I despite BJ as much as the next person, didn't, and would never, vote for him, but all the things you quote happened AFTER the last general election, so nobody (other than the idiots MPs who voted against the no confidence motion) has had the opportunity to vote against him. Yes, he had a dodgy reputation even before he became PM, and I don't know why anyone voted for him at that point, but I don't get how you're suggesting people have kept voting for him since partygate/parliament/BJ in his office etc have all come out when 99.99% of the population haven't had the opportunity to vote for or against him. Unless I've missed a general election in the last year?

That's fair in terms of voting for the current Government. That said, per polling many people are still saying they would vote for these charlatans? And as you say they voted a known liar with no morals into the highest office in the country, why? Not to mention of course that many people voted for Brexit and some still don't have the moral fibre to admit it was a huge mistake, that has made us all poorer and will continue to do so.

I honestly couldn't get upset if the current cabinet were all put in front of a firing squad, to be brutally honest.

Agree with you absolutely.

2006?

I am not sure you are very well informed.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Surely NO women would be dumb enough to fall for that! One would hope.

www.imf.org/en/Publications/WEO/Issues/2022/04/19/world-economic-outlook-april-2022

Sorry I was referring to this year, I should have been clearer. Also I would be careful about assuming anything about 2023, very much depends on what Russia does to German supply and what happens with Frances nuclear reactors given they are having problems with ageing and maintenance.

I agree.

If a series of strikes is what it takes to knock some sense into this fucking awful government, then bring it on.

I was 23 during the winter of discontent, so remember it well, and it wasn't so bad. Yes, there was a build up of rubbish, but I've seen several rats in my road in the last few months and didn't see any then. Funerals were delayed and there were concerns about sufficient space in mortuaries, but councils arranged to book cold stores if needed. Sometimes the supermarkets didn't have all the items you wanted, but that's no different now.

People in low paid work need to be properly rewarded for it. It's obscene that people providing essential services have to resort to food banks to feed their families, so I wish all the union members who are prepared to take action every success.

And well done Unite, for getting a cracking pay deal for their members working for British Airways.

Tbh this is probably more a reflection of how people feel than hard economic data. People feel ashamed so they believe everyone thinks they have something to be ashamed of. I didn’t vote in the referendum, I have no dog in the fight but this really has very little to do with brexit or the government. This has everything to do with globalisation, supply chains and Russia. Its the habit now to use your feelings as proxy for facts. It is a supply side problem not a demand side problem, so it’s actually very difficult to deal with, otherwise whacking up interest rates would absolutely be a big part of the answer. At this point we are just trying to keep up with the dollar to keep inflation from being imported.

The impact is being felt around the world, Pakistan is experiencing 12 hour blackouts due to increasing demand for energy (I assume they didn’t vote to leave the EU or vote for Boris). Some african countries are looking square in the face of actual starvation. It’s incredibly navel gazing to believe this isn’t a global problem with consequences for countries with far less resource to be able to do the basics.

It will be horrible in the west but far worse in developing countries. That doesn’t mean it doesn’t matter about people suffering in the UK but it does mean we should focus on what’s actually going to help. Mass pay rises at this point in time will be dreadful for inflation. Tackling the cost of fuel will help, reducing the cost of food. Brexit is a distraction from this. There will be a very real impact, can people eat, can people stay warm without instigating further inflation. Thats what matters right now.

Reverse crowdfunding. What I’d really like is an app where it can filter companies for individuals involvement or ethics.

So, let’s suppose you take against say, Jacob Reese Mogg (because why wouldn’t you?). You search his name and get a list of all the goods or services you can possibly buy that eventually line his pocket, and you can avoid them. Eventually he’d wither away, if every time he trotted out one of his absurd Victorian views, sales of anything associated with him plummeted, he’d soon be voted off the board of anything and have to come and live in the 21st century or be poor. That’d bloody teach him.

These people are insulated from decency and morality by their money and anonymity. They have to learn that being awful has awful consequences. They DGAF what we think. They only want our money. We CAN choose not to give it to them, at least to some extent.

Yoi could also choose a standard. Say, living wage. Or tax dodging. And get a list of the worst offenders and avoid them. Or maybe the best and actively choose them.

There are huge, huge problems though. Firstly, there are so many fat cats with such complex and obfuscated income generation and that have their fingers in so many pies it might be impossible to fully identify their interests, let alone avoid them all if you did. if you picked half a dozen of the top offenders, you probably wouldn’t be able to buy anything at all, and have to grow your own turnips to survive. It might be quite a gradual shift, with the odd viral landslip.

It would be a massive piece of work.

Someone, somewhere would have to set standards and a ‘pass mark’ and where it should be would fracture the pool of potential activists and reduce the effect. Divide and conquer is very effective.

There are plenty of utterly vile people who make money in utterly vile ways that are never in the media. It would disproportionately focus on public figures (although that would be a start)

It’s just massive. You’d almost need to organise targeted strikes. This week Danny whatsit the anti-abortion guy would take a hit. Next week, it might be any of the usual suspects, but focussing sanctions on one at a time for a sustained period would be most effective. It could really work with social media and the Information Age, though. But it would take conscious consumerism from a lot of people, who put ethics before price, preference and convenience for longer than a viral attention span to work. I don’t think this could be managed. It’s a shame, because where you spend your money is an ENORMOUS amount of collective power. It would be easier than storming parliament or marching in the streets with no personal risk and no bloodshed.

It would have ordinary casualties too. JRM isn’t churning out anything his own self - his interests taking a hit would mean job losses, too. But it would hold individuals accountable for their actions. It would impose meaningful, truly democratic consequences by trickle-up economics. But I don’t think ‘the people’ can be cohesive enough, or principled enough for long enough. The people who are really suffering don’t have realistic choices about where to spend money, and are too busy just trying to get by. The people who could are not motivated enough yet by outrage, or principled enough to tolerate the inconvenience.

It’s already possible to do it. Nestle has had a pretty high profile boycott in place for years, because of the baby-milk thing, but they're still in business because not enough people boycott it thoroughly enough. You can just buy everything from local independents, if you really want (and you have them left) but it’s cheaper and easier to order from Amazon or Tesco. I almost had it completely wrapped up, except audible, but now we have a lot less money, it’s simply not possible.

It could prevent politicians from taking unpopular or complex but necessary decisions that are beyond the scope of understanding of Joe Public for fear or ruination (Brexit, anyone?)

It could become a witch-hunt. It might not always be fair, I suppose. Can’t say I’d lose sleep over it. You might get people going bankrupt from one or two stupid comments that are highly publicised. It gives the media a lot of power, too. The daily wail will be first off my list. Obviously, I don’t buy the DM, but I bet I unwittingly contribute to some it’s people one way or another. If I had better information I might be able to change that.

Yep.

Tories + Brexit = Economic carnage = Greater human suffering

People in low paid work need to be properly rewarded for it. It's obscene that people providing essential services have to resort to food banks to feed their families, so I wish all the union members who are prepared to take action every success.

Absolutely. So do I!

Ds is heavily involved with the Green Party & he gas told me tonight that parties have been told to prepare for a snap election to be called within the next month. I wonder if Boris is doing this because of Beergate & the hope that Labour will be without a leader if Keir Starmer & Angela Rayner get FPN & resign?