Anyone have a friend who needs leading by the hand for everything?

[URaflutteringcunt]

You ask if they want to go out, they can’t decide on a date, they give no offers of where they want to go, even when provided with a list of places they ask where you want to go, even when the place is decided they ask you how to get there, they ask you where to park, they ask you for the menu, they ask what you’ll be having, they ask what the dress code is, they ask what time it starts, they ask how far to walk from the car park, they ask how much do you think it’ll be for the night…

all of it provided and easily found with a simple Google check. It’s exhausting. And then they pick at the food, look awkward and say mmm it’s ok. With no input in to the evening whatsoever. It’s almost like they take no responsibility so they can say, I didn’t pick it.

Some people are just very passive, and unfortunately I think often it is women. I know a few women who went straight from living with their parents to living with their husband and they're used to someone else organising everything. Or sometimes it's about not wanting to be direct.

I get a lot of free theatre tickets which I offer around, and I have two friends I love but who I can't do things with anymore because they're just so vague. They'll do stuff like accept theatre tickets then on the day (sometimes only an hour or so before) turn around and say stuff like, "oh I don't finish work till 9pm so I'll pop down and join you then" or "oh I my friend is doing an open mic so I'll just go to that then wander down to you whenever" when they know it's a formal ticketed event with a fixed entry time and start time. Some people live their lives in a kind of haze.

Wonder if it’s a codependency / childhood with an overbearing parent kind of thing. I think either you need to tell her how you feel and make an effort to understand where each of you is coming from and what you each want/need in future. Or you stop engaging and see if she initiates. I think your mistake is to quietly seethe while she has no idea - unfair to her and breeds resentment in you. You can’t expect her to read your mind or to have been brought up with the same social expectations as you.

Why not simply tell her that you're fed up of always being the one to organise the outing and that its her call from now on for a while?

If she refuses I'd bin meeting up entirely

Could be signs of

Anxiety
abuse survivior
neurodivergent

or something else.

but writing her off /looking dow on her is not being a good friend, is it?

Did it ever occur to you to bring this up, kindly, and ask her why?

You don't seem to enjoy spending time with her so I wonder why you're so determined to keep the friendship going?

I’m probably this friend.

I get extremely anxious about going somewhere that is new to me.
I Google of course but become overwhelmed by the volume of choices and can’t see which is right.
To me, it’s easier to be told by someone with experience who can explain simply.

I am an extreme people pleaser and again get extremely anxious about choosing wrongly or letting people down.

I know I’m annoying. I know it. But luckily my friends are very understanding and tolerant and well…. Just kind and good people.

@ColinRobinsonsfamiliar but do you complain about their choices, blame them if they turn out not to be great?

Your comment about your friends being “good and kind people” reads to me like you’re insinuating that the OP is not. If so, I find that very unfair.

I had a passive/indecisive friend like this who is part of our group who meet up every month and who was also continually late. She's intelligent and high achieving in her career but just can't get her head round making any decision about her social life outside of work. Logistics and timekeeping defy her.

I already have 2 DC and finally decided I didn't need a third (her), so after putting the ball firmly in her court to organise our next meetup I've finally stepped back.

No response as yet - it's been 3 months. Saddened, but not surprised.

Op. This behaviour drives me bonkers so I’m not friends with people like this. Happy to be friendly but no capacity to carry the load/make decisions for someone else (outside my family).

@fabicelolly , you said “Wonder if it’s a codependency / childhood with an overbearing parent kind of thing.”

My best friend in the sixth form was just like this. If we ever ate away from home I had to order something for myself that I thought she would also like, because she would always choose the same dish I did.

Her parents belonged to a strict religious group and I think she and her mother just did everything her father said. Looking up the faith now, they still only have male leaders in the church.

Her father died unexpectedly. Her mother drove a three-wheeler car, which presumably her father had chosen. Very soon after the death her mother changed it for a normal four wheeled one.

@Wheelibinsoutinthemorning yep exactly that - I was brought up similar to your friend with religious oppression and abuse in the mix and just hadn’t socialised enough growing up to understand that I could spend my money how I like, choose what I wanted in a restaurant, be assertive about saying I needed company and wanted to meet up etc. Still learning and finding my preferences after a lot of therapy. It’s so hard to speak up about when you’re still psychologically gripped by the fear and lack of self-understanding. Which is why I think not writing people off and communicating clearly is so key.

I help people for a while, usually in trying to ‘build’ a friendship.

It rarely ends in an equal friends situation.

@fabicelolly it must be very hard to change that way of thinking. I hope your therapy has helped.

I agree about not writing people off, although it can be very tiring to decide for another adult all the time. I suppose if the reason for their lack of input is the way they were brought up, they are unlikely to complain about what you chose for them both.

You both, not them both.

We were brought up in very similar circumstances, except I am an abuse survivor, she is not.

Have spoken about it in the past and always told “you always know the best places” or “you like organising”. I do know some nice places but when friend sits there picking at her food or umming over the menu I think why on Earth did you make me pick this thing for us both which you obviously dislike. It sets me on edge. And I feel like saying it but I don’t want to hurt her and end up apologising for the night, or trying to convince myself that it was alright.

it’s tough mental admin and we have spoken about it but I don’t want to be a bad person by saying “why didn’t you say something” if she is having a hard time but in the end I feel like a bad person anyway. She doesn’t openly say it wasnt good, so if I suddenly said “you don’t like it do you?” I would look like i was starting some kind off confrontation.

I have other friends who plan things and I really love going to new places I don’t know, we do our fair share of organising.

Gosh, are you me? I also get cheap theatre tickets and a friend of mine is constantly saying " I would love to go but I can't afford it". But when offered tickets, she is forever saying "oh but how do I get there?" or " I don't know where that is.." or "what time does it start?" . I have stopped offering now. Another friend always wants to travel with me, but can't make any decisions or suggestions or stick to dates. I still meet these friends but only for coffee. Some people can't handle anything beyond that.

I already have 2 DC; can't handle any more.

I used to have a friend like this. We came to the conclusion that the reason he would never initiate or take responsibility for anything was so that it wouldn't be his fault if it was a disaster or a disappointment.

He acquired the nickname "Blameless" as a result.

If anyone has spare / cheap theatre tickets, I’m often free. Can make my own way to the theatre, can find the loos and bar too. Just saying 😁

Oh we all know one like this

I use this seatfiller site. Got several really good deals here. Be warned, if you sign up, you will get daily mails which may feel spammy. But I set up a separate email address for these and I go through them once a week. centraltickets.co.uk/

So when she suggests meeting up agree with "sounds great. Let me know where and a suggested date and I'll confirm".

Then leave it.

She'll either not organise anything or she'll have to actually do it because otherwise you won't meet up.

To be fair at least “What time does it start?” is a reasonable question - shows may vary from 7:30 to 8pm not to speak of matinees. Also, “I don’t know how to get there” I wouldn’t mind at all - if I knew a route I’d be happy to explain and if I didn’t, I’d just say so.

London theatres. None of us drive there. We all take the Tube. The best route is whichever tube line is best for you. The what time does it start would be after I had already told her once, but she would have forgotten to note it and need a reminder. I think if people have done the homework and done booked tickets for you then a non- ND adult should be able to get there and remind yourself on your own.

I don't want to be anyone's Siri any more.

The only thing worse than someone with no opinion is someone who has no opinion until you make a decision for them, then they have a really strong opinion.

”Where do you want to go?”
”I’m not fussed, you just book”

(You book a Thai restaurant)

”Oh, that’s fine but I didn’t really fancy Thai. We could try [xxxx]”

@JanisMoplin ooh thank you