To think that 10% pre-tax income is a LOT to give away annually?

[notnownorma]

Friend is a member of one of those tithing churches that encourages people to give away (not just to the church, to foodbanks, development/medical charities etc) 10% of one's annual income. They do it pre-income tax [don't think that's mandated but they do] and cut their lifestyle accordingly (very modest). That's a lot, surely?
What do MNetters give as a percentage? Not looking for actual sums, more a percentage.

It's not your money, why does it bother you so much that someone chooses to give that much away? That's a commendable action, particularly as it's going to a range of charities.

It doesn't bother me and of course it's their money, I was just gosh and wondered if it was the norm or something.

Yes it’s a lot but I think that’s the point. It’s supposed to be a genuine sacrifice not just what you can afford to give without noticing it.

Lots of Churches do this, though more usually out of net income. I do try and give to charities when I am able. Where I have been fortunate I would try and help those who have not been so fortunate. Noting that it is not just about money. Volunteering can also be important.

It's too much if the church's accounts are not public...

Yes it’s a lot. I do give to charity regularly but definitely no more than half that. If I had dependents then I’d question whether reducing our (already fairly frugal) lifestyle was in their best interests.

I have friends who culturally give to charity, the church and their parents. 10% is a usual amount if that's what you want to do/is expected. I was shocked that even those on benefits are expected to do it. I think that if you are in danger of not affording essentials (which people on benefits/low income are) it would make more sense to save 10% and see were you are just at the end of the year. Luckily the friends who are expected to keep their parents live in the UK and their parents are still in Africa, so it's affordable.

@Cyclebabble

Sure, me too: I volunteer and give, but not at that level. I'd have no holidays whatsoever if I did, and I like to travel.

Most of it doesn't go to or through the church, as I understand it. Goes direct to the organisations, though of course they do give some to the church to run it. No different to a club imo. And independent churches accounts are publically available via Charity Commission

We give away at least 10% of post tax income each year and many years it’s over 10% of pre-tax income. Slightly more than 10% (post-tax) comes out of our main account each month by DD into a separate ‘tithing’ account, which we use for regular support of various charities and our church. We also use that account for some one-off charitable donations.

However at least once a year we give larger amounts from our main account to charities as the need arises - eg a couple of thousand to the DEC, a similar amount to a charity which had a specific appeal etc.

For us, keeping the money separate means we don’t miss it, and although we are now very comfortable financially, we’ve done this for years, including individually before we were married and had far less income. We’re following the teaching of the Bible, but also what was modelled to us, particularly by my parents, who give generously in time, money and resources despite having less income.

If we didn’t do this, of course we’d have more disposable income, but actually the mindset is more valuable to me - material possessions don’t bring happiness, everything we have is God’s and we are to be wise stewards.

This doesn’t mean we live a miserly existence, we have a nice house, go on holidays etc, but our mortgage is very small compared to our income level, we don’t spend lots on new cars etc. we don’t buy our kids (or ourselves) the latest iPhone.

I’m realising this is all sounding a bit smug, and I really don’t mean it to, I’m trying to say that living generously, holding material possessions lightly, while not always easy, brings contentment. That’s why the Bible commands it.

I do 10% of net income - it's paid into a separate bank account each month, I have some regular standing orders and I also use it for one-off charitable gifts (sponsored events etc). I'm well paid, though, so I'm not sure that it's particularly laudable: I'll probably increase it when DD is off my hands.

@percypig

I get what you are saying and respect that; friend says the same, but what if one never gets to the level where you can still have nice things but fewer of them? Like the people on benefits mentioned by a PP?
Your lifestyle sounds like mine, actually quite a bit better. Take off 10% and it really wouldn't.

I come from a family who goes to one of these churches (I don’t, personally).

My advice — check what kind of car the pastor drives before signing up. There was a series of scandals in my family’s church when people started noticing the pastor was driving around in a brand new Lotus and yet the community centre roof still leaked in five different places. Turned out pastor had been creaming off a percentage of the tithes.

We do 10% post tax, for some they give less financially and volunteer, as giving time is valuable too.

it’s up to the individual. If I were to pay out 10% of my income I wouldn’t be able to live, but I don’t choose to. I volunteer regularly and give when I can, which right now isn’t very often.

I think the problem however might come if the church and community insist on it, and if you can’t afford it you are then shunned. I would hope that would never happen.

Probably tiny as a percentage. DD to RNLI, food bank and shelter.

I give around 10% post tax income to charity (not church related).

I can afford that and still have an OK lifestyle right now, it wasn't anywhere near as high a percentage when I was on a low income.

I would agree with those who have concerns about churches which demand 10% directly to them. For what it’s worth my church doesn’t, our paid staff don’t have high salaries and apart from the treasurer, no-one would have any idea who gives what.

I actually understand people’s point 10% is easy to give if you’re on a high income, but the point of the principle is that it’s proportional. To those who have been given much, much is expected. I would never judge anyone for how much or little they give, but I do think the principle of giving a proportion away is good - it doesn’t have to start at 10% if that’s impossible.

It’s interesting because if you asked in the context of a student loan everyone would say 10% for the rest of your life is nothing 😂

Personally I think it’s a lot.

So why is it in AIBU?

It must surely be relative to your expendable income. Someone on benefits (obviously assumes they are on low income and are topped up to help them afford necessities) should not be giving 10% to charity. Many people are struggling to afford necessities and so I can’t imagine have a spare 10% of their income and give what they can when they can. I think living modestly is a good thing to keep you grounded and stay connected with your community but I think most people I know already have a modest way of life (buying second hand where possible, budgeting for food and concerned about bills).

My parents did ten percent of Pre-tax income for most of their working lives, I think they stopped for a while when they had a surprise 4th baby and all their expenses went up, but then went back to it. It definitely impacted on our lifestyle but we still had everything important.

We do ten percent post tax income, as we never actually get the full Pre-tax amount plus a lot of that tax already goes to charity if that makes sense. So ten percent of post-tax feels more reasonable.

obviously we wouldn’t do it if that meant we couldn’t give our children what they need, I certainly wouldn’t expect/encourage people on very low incomes or benefits to do it. But for those of us can afford it, it feels the right thing to do.

Our joint synagogue membership is £60 (as I am below 30, but DH is over 30) so basically 1% of take home pay? Synagogues tend to charge flat fees (but you can request to waive the fees if you are poor). But there are a lot of people on a modest income who may not feel like they are 'poor' and they pay a much larger percentage of their income than someone who is rich.

I have an issue with churches that expect tithing from people on benefits.

benefits are not generous enough that people can give away 10% and still live ok.

A church that encourages its congregation to not have enough for basics is not w good church imo.

We give about 15% of our pre-tax income to various charities and church organisations, which still leaves us plenty to do the things we want to do.
Not really looked at it from the pre-tax angle, it's about 1/3 of the monthly budget.