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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To want to be in my rented flat when viewings are taking place?

79 replies

maroonballoon · 08/06/2022 13:21

My landlord is selling the flat I'm renting. He's said I can stay here on a rolling tenancy until it sells.

The estate agents have started viewings and mentioned at the last viewing that I should offer them times when I won't be home.

I'm trying to be as accommodating as possible (within reason) but I am not comfortable with strangers snooping round my home when I'm not here. I really doubt anything bad would happen but I'd rather not take the risk. All my stuff is here and some of the last viewers have been very bold in going through all of my cupboards. I'm not sure how the contents of my wardrobe (not built-in and won't come with the flat) helps them in their purchase decision.

I'm happy to stay out of the way when any prospective buyers come round. I find it a bit awkward too but much prefer that than worrying about my things.

I do see where the estate agents are coming from but I'm still paying rent (which isn't cheap!) to live here. If it was my own home I was selling, I'd be more willing to do whatever was needed but I'm not benefitting in any way from this sale. I don't want to be kicked out of my own home every Saturday afternoon.

AIBU to insist that I am present in my flat for all viewings?

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 08/06/2022 15:49

The flat my daughter recently purchased has a tenant in situ. It was a bit irritating (from a potential buyers point of view) because the tenant only allowed viewings on Saturdays and evenings after 6pm (in winter when it was dark by then). She was home for viewings despite the estate agent doing them and followed people about from room to room. Still, I guess she was entitled to do that as she was still paying rent

Skinnermarink · 08/06/2022 15:50

dianthus101 · 08/06/2022 15:35

In contrast to what some posters keep saying on this and other threads, I think that if it is in your contract to allow viewings then you do have to allow it. I'm sure you can insist that you stay there though.

england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/what_to_do_when_you_leave_your_rented_home#:~:text=You%20do%20not%20have%20to,with%20getting%20your%20deposit%20back.

Bollocks. Things written in a contract do not override statutory law.

ClaudiaWankleman · 08/06/2022 15:51

Ponderingwindow · 08/06/2022 15:24

people advising op that she could force the landlord to take her to court to evict her, won’t that put a court based eviction on her leasing record and make it harder to find a flat in the future?

What do you mean by 'leasing record'?
A possession order isn't the same as a county court judgement and there is no impact on your credit record. There would have to be a money order made by the judge for rent arrears for a CCJ to be issued.

Original poster
maroonballoon · 08/06/2022 15:54

I'm not clued up on my legal rights around eviction and always planned to leave after the 2 month notice period, whenever that is.

I'm not convinced the situation is dire enough for it to be worth going through all the legal hassle of not leaving, though admittedly I don't know what exactly the process would be. Trying to find a rental is a nightmare at the moment and I don't want to screw myself over by getting a bad reference or not being able to provide a reference at all.

The landlord has put the flat up for sale before. It didn't sell and he ended up renting it out again, after losing a decent chunk of rent income while it was empty. I think that's why he's keen to keep me around as an insurance policy in case it doesn't sell this time either (imo he is wanting a lot more than the flat is worth) and why I'm not sure he will be inclined to evict me in August unless he has a buyer. I could be completely wrong of course.

I do think some of the previous posts about being more willing to compromise to avoid him getting frustrated and kicking me out are very valid. I completely understand its preferable for the estate agents and buyers if I'm not here. I think I could make my peace with an open house afternoon where I disappear (along with all my valuables) and try my best to not think about the strangers in my home! Then I can be more strict about being present for other viewings.

OP posts:
easyday · 08/06/2022 16:24

I did viewings during the pandemic snd I wasn't allowed to touch ANYTHING (doorknobs, even the bannister), so I don't see why you can't tell the agent to ask them not to go through the cupboards, especially if they are not built in!
Be there if you like, though I do see the agents point of view. No one likes looking around a prospective new home with the current occupier there. But totally up to you.

JuneJubilee · 08/06/2022 16:32

Wannabegreenfingers · 08/06/2022 13:59

Can you ask that they do blocks of bookings, say all on a Saturday morning where possible. I've recently brought a new property and I'll be honest it was horrible viewing a house where the tenant's/owners were in.

That's as may be, but that's NOT the OP's problem, it's the LL. if he doesn't want her there he needs to give her full notice, not try to get every penny he can 💁🏻‍♀️

Not Anti LL either as I used to have rental properties.

Brainwave89 · 08/06/2022 16:50

I am assuming the rolling contract is advantageous? In which case I would be nervous about visits when you are not there, but I would be much more concerned that no visits were unaccompanied, i.e. you do not have randoms turning up with no prior briefing.

Boredsoentertainme · 08/06/2022 16:54

JuneJubilee · 08/06/2022 16:32

That's as may be, but that's NOT the OP's problem, it's the LL. if he doesn't want her there he needs to give her full notice, not try to get every penny he can 💁🏻‍♀️

Not Anti LL either as I used to have rental properties.

Show quote history

Um it’s her who wants to stay, she’s no idea if he will give her notice or not. But keep going trying to get the poor woman evicted.

EinsteinaGogo · 08/06/2022 17:09

@FrenchFancie

I rent out several properties.
You are 100% talking complete nonsense.
I do hope you don't actually believe anything you've said.

TibetanTerrah · 08/06/2022 17:13

dianthus101 · 08/06/2022 15:35

In contrast to what some posters keep saying on this and other threads, I think that if it is in your contract to allow viewings then you do have to allow it. I'm sure you can insist that you stay there though.

england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/what_to_do_when_you_leave_your_rented_home#:~:text=You%20do%20not%20have%20to,with%20getting%20your%20deposit%20back.

Can you imagine all the shit that slum landlords would put in their contracts if this were the case. The law is the law, landlords cant just make up their own clauses to override that.

EinsteinaGogo · 08/06/2022 17:13

@dianthus101

Again... if you write something UNLAWFUL in a contract, that doesn't make it legal and enforceable 🙈🙈

Yodaisawally · 08/06/2022 17:20

I would never rent or buy a property if the tenant / owner was in there when i viewed, its so bloody awkward and would make you out as a tenant to look like a sitting tenant so I would walk away. What are you actually worried about?

Jott · 08/06/2022 17:25

Good afternoon, Letting Agent

I have checked the terms and conditions of my contents insurance and having prospective buyers view the property while I am not here would make me unable to make claim should anything get damaged or go missing. There have already had several instances of prospective buyers attempting to access my personal belongings therefore with immediate effect I will be present on the premises for all viewings.

You do not have my permission to access the property while I am not present or to arrange viewings without giving me prior notice.

And then let them crack on with themselves, they have no right to access unless you say they can so it benefits them to keep you onside.

Skinnermarink · 08/06/2022 17:30

Yodaisawally · 08/06/2022 17:20

I would never rent or buy a property if the tenant / owner was in there when i viewed, its so bloody awkward and would make you out as a tenant to look like a sitting tenant so I would walk away. What are you actually worried about?

Not the OP’s job to care under what circumstances you would or wouldn’t rent or purchase a property.

Notmytiep · 08/06/2022 17:35

OP has said what she’s gonna do which is sound. Any normal rational person with a working brain would do the same. Good luck OP x

NightmareSituation · 08/06/2022 17:38

Your landlord cannot make you leave for viewings and you have a right to say when it is convenient. I would accompany within reason but insist that there is an estate agent present at all visits and arrange with them to hand over keys when they arrive and take them back as soon as they leave.

What are you concerned about people looking at? I would expect people to check in cupboards/wardrobes if they think they might be able to negotiate you in to leaving them. Perhaps have a chat with the estate agent first and make it clear that anything free standing is not for sale. Also, I’m pretty sure someone would notice them carrying a TV or PlayStation out but take any small valuables with you to put your mind at rest.

BreadInCaptivity · 08/06/2022 18:18

OP I had similar when we moved out of our house due to work being done.

Our LL was pretty good, so we didn't want to be difficult, but we did want our privacy and belongings respected.

We agreed time slots for viewings and a notice period of them being confirmed.

We were lucky that we had a lockable wardrobe and we would put our valuables in that.

I then got busy with post-it notes marking everything that was "ours" with instructions to the EA that these things were not part of the sale and not to be opened etc and if I found they had then game over. No more viewings.

I wasn't bothered about someone viewing the inside of a fridge that "belonged" to the apartment or built in kitchen cupboards, but I didn't want people going through my wardrobes and other self owned furniture.

Worked fine.

Fact is you don't have to allow viewings at all so it's up to you to set the boundaries you're comfortable with.

iCorvidae · 08/06/2022 18:22

Badqueeen · 08/06/2022 13:24

Nope not unreasonable. Technically you don't even have to let them in for viewings. You're entitled to quiet enjoyment of your home. If they're not happy with you being there then they can wait till you move out.

but then the landlord will ask her to leave in a month?

britneyisfree · 08/06/2022 18:25

We left the baby monitor on (during covid, just come out of first lockdown) and watched as some women - who wasn't meant to touch anything- laid on our couch (to look at the ceiling), opened windows & cupboards and who knows what she did in the bedrooms/ toilets.

I had to go round and sanitise bloody everything as covid paranoia was still so high!!

dianthus101 · 08/06/2022 18:56

TibetanTerrah · 08/06/2022 17:13

Can you imagine all the shit that slum landlords would put in their contracts if this were the case. The law is the law, landlords cant just make up their own clauses to override that.

Show quote history

What is the law though? I'm not sure that it is against the law for prospective tenants to view the property if it's in the contract. Shelter don't seem to think it's a problem. Has anyone tested it in court to see if it spoilt “peaceful enjoyment” and is an unfair term?

dianthus101 · 08/06/2022 19:00

EinsteinaGogo · 08/06/2022 17:13

@dianthus101

Again... if you write something UNLAWFUL in a contract, that doesn't make it legal and enforceable 🙈🙈

As I said, I'm not sure it is unlawful.

roarfeckingroarr · 08/06/2022 19:17

People on Mumsnet are nuts. It's incredibly unreasonable to not allow viewings when a landlord wants to sell their property.

Original poster
maroonballoon · 08/06/2022 19:20

Just wanted to say another thanks to everyone who took the time to read and respond, it's very much appreciated.

I'm fairly set in my position now as I outlined before - I'll offer one open house slot and disappear with all my valuables, while reminding the estate agent of what is my furniture and that I'd appreciate people not going through my wardrobe etc. Otherwise I'll stand my ground on being present in the property. If the landlord evicts me because of it, then yeah I'd be a bit annoyed but I guess I'll be free to find somewhere and enjoy living in it without all the viewings, even if I get tied into another 6 month contract.

OP posts:
BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 08/06/2022 19:22

roarfeckingroarr · 08/06/2022 19:17

People on Mumsnet are nuts. It's incredibly unreasonable to not allow viewings when a landlord wants to sell their property.

How? Why should a tenant facilitate this? They are legally entitled to refuse.

undermilkjug · 08/06/2022 19:24

roarfeckingroarr · 08/06/2022 19:17

People on Mumsnet are nuts. It's incredibly unreasonable to not allow viewings when a landlord wants to sell their property.

It's incredibly unreasonable and pretty ducking stupid of landlords to try and market their property for sale while it is tenanted, or at the very least serving a (proper valid and checked) s21 notice.

I know the op in this case is prepared to be reasonable and work with the landlord, but how many potential buyers will hang around for 12 -18 months while the landlord goes through the eviction process if a tenant doesn't leave. Tenants are only able to be considered for social housing if they've actually been evicted so they have to stay until there is a court order telling them to go.