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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Manager phoning on day off

73 replies

ZibbleDibble · 07/06/2022 12:45

Today is my first day of a weeks annual leave and my manager phoned me. Firstly, there was no apology for phoning me on my day off.

A bit of context, I am very organised and proactive so a lot of the department organisation falls to me. I had volunteered to send an email organising an appointment for tomorrow. I copied in a colleague to the email plus saved the email on our shared folder.

So this morning my manager phoned me and asked if I had sent the email. I said yes and that I had copied my colleague in (who she was with)! I also explained that I saved it in the shared folder. She didn’t seem phased that she had phoned me on my day off and praised me for being so organised.

AIBU to feel irked that not only was I called on my day off but that she didn’t even bother to ask the team or check the shared folder first?

OP posts:
JassyRadlett · 07/06/2022 14:07

Sounds like you’ve never made a mistake yourself.

Better to have some understanding of the pressures managers may be under. prima Donna employees are the worst. Entitled and high maintenance.

When stuff like this happens to me I remember two things. That everyone is allowed to have a bad day and most bad behaviour at work is driven by the amount of stress people are under.

I've made plenty of mistakes in managing many teams, small and large, over the years in very high-pressure environments.

I try to own them as my own poor behaviour, not make excuses for them.

As a manager, you have responsibilities to your staff, not just the other way around. Entitled managers are just as toxic as entitled employees. Ensuring that you don't disturb your staff when they're not working unless it's unavoidable is one of the basics.

OP's manager behaved poorly. Even if it had been an error, they couldn't even muster the 'insincere apology' you say you'd have offered (which indicates a basic lack of respect for the people you manage - you don't sincerely regret interrupting their leave? Pathetic and entitled.)

OP is justified in being annoyed at thoughtless management.

ZibbleDibble · 07/06/2022 14:17

Thanks everyone. Of course I don’t expect everyone to agree with me, I wish I could have shrugged it off like some people in the comments.

The good thing is I’m now no longer annoyed about it. It’s made me realise that my sometimes thoughtless and slightly disrespectful manager is a hell of a lot better than being managed by someone like @DontBlameMe79

OP posts:
DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 14:18

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 13:58

You'd 'deliver a marginally insincere apology' to an employee that you've disrespected so much you've called with a trifling question when they're actually on leave?

You should be disciplined frankly. What an appalling attitude, firstly to think you can impose on people's time off and secondly for being so rude and unpleasant that you think an insincere apology is enough.

I really hope you're talking hypothetically and you don't actually have staff because you're the kind of boss that everyone completely hates. Understandably so.

I see the keyboard hotheads are out in force today.

My point is that this is a trifling thing and nothing to be clambering on any high horses about. There are more important things to be getting upset about. This sort of lack of tolerance is what makes a lot of workplaces so toxic as it ends up being reciprocated to everyone’s detriment.

Choose to be kind is not a bad way to live your life.

JassyRadlett · 07/06/2022 14:21

My point is that this is a trifling thing and nothing to be clambering on any high horses about. There are more important things to be getting upset about. This sort of lack of tolerance is what makes a lot of workplaces so toxic as it ends up being reciprocated to everyone’s detriment.

Ah, the manager who thinks their position means they get to decide what's important to their staff. One of the classics.

Keep going! This is turning into a fun game of Bad Manager Bingo 😂

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 14:24

Is it a full moon? Because the crazies are out in force on this one.

Just listen to yourselves work yourselves up into a lather over such a trivial incident.

Settle petals.

cooliebrown · 07/06/2022 14:29

If I had to ring a member of my team whilst they were on leave my query would be prefaced with a grovelling apology making it clear that I was calling as a very last resort.

If I were in your shoes I'd be asking to be credited with half a day leave in recognition of the unnecessary interruption to my time off.

JassyRadlett · 07/06/2022 14:33

Oh honey. This isn't a lather. Bless you, it's people calmly pointing out to you that you're saying some really stupid things.

If you see that as 'a lather' I can see why you have such problems with 'prima donna employees.'

GCAcademic · 07/06/2022 14:35

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 14:18

I see the keyboard hotheads are out in force today.

My point is that this is a trifling thing and nothing to be clambering on any high horses about. There are more important things to be getting upset about. This sort of lack of tolerance is what makes a lot of workplaces so toxic as it ends up being reciprocated to everyone’s detriment.

Choose to be kind is not a bad way to live your life.

As is usual with the "be kind" brigade, the command only extends to other people, not yourself.

I'm a manager in a pressured job, routinely working 80 hours a week, and I think you sound like a terrible manager. The irony of you calling other people "entitled and high maintenance" when the entitlement you clearly feel to your staff's non-work time is evident for all of us to see. . . .

ZibbleDibble · 07/06/2022 14:42

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 14:18

I see the keyboard hotheads are out in force today.

My point is that this is a trifling thing and nothing to be clambering on any high horses about. There are more important things to be getting upset about. This sort of lack of tolerance is what makes a lot of workplaces so toxic as it ends up being reciprocated to everyone’s detriment.

Choose to be kind is not a bad way to live your life.

You forgot to be kind in every single one of your replies. Perhaps you should consider that you’re the one who makes somewhere a toxic place to work. You come across as being very unpleasant

OP posts:
Mariposista · 07/06/2022 14:58

This is the reason work do not have my personal number and my work phone stays switched off on days off/holidays/sick leave

Ihaventgottimeforthis · 07/06/2022 15:12

Your manager knew full well you were on leave but she couldn't find a way around her own incompetence, so was happy to disturb you in personal time. I'd be irked too, and not feel like 'helping out' again.

It seems that a lot of managers have little respect for their team's work life balance and feel entitled to take advantage of them when they can't figure stuff out themselves, perhaps more managers should take some of the "be kind" medicine, or at the very least be organised, competent and civil to their team.

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 15:24

cooliebrown · 07/06/2022 14:29

If I had to ring a member of my team whilst they were on leave my query would be prefaced with a grovelling apology making it clear that I was calling as a very last resort.

If I were in your shoes I'd be asking to be credited with half a day leave in recognition of the unnecessary interruption to my time off.

Comedy gold…

AclowncalledAlice · 07/06/2022 15:25

This sort of lack of tolerance is what makes a lot of workplaces so toxic as it ends up being reciprocated to everyone’s detriment.

I'd say the toxicity in the workplace is probably more to do with your management style than anything else.

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 15:34

My goodness we’re all a bit prickly today aren’t we over What sounds like a 30 second phone call.

I’m pretty confident that none of you would actually show any of the bravado you recommend to others in real life. Because you would be daft to do so. You should really give more practical advice rather than projecting on others what you fantasise about doing, but know you never would. Look up living vicariously.

JassyRadlett · 07/06/2022 16:05

I’m pretty confident that none of you would actually show any of the bravado you recommend to others in real life. Because you would be daft to do so. You should really give more practical advice rather than projecting on others what you fantasise about doing, but know you never would. Look up living vicariously.

Which bravado is that? I've had to manage, coach, performance manage and ultimately discipline more than one manager with your attitudes in my time. The ones who improved (and who ultimately improved the performance of their team by being a better manager) were those who were able to muster a small amount of self-reflection, didn't think staff were at their beck and call because they were So Terribly Busy And Important, and were willing to listen when their shite behaviours were pointed out to them. Ultimately, some of the managers I managed weren't prepared look upon management as a vital skill that needs to be constantly worked at and taken seriously. They were invited to work elsewhere. As my career had progressed, I've been fortunate (and skilled) enough to be able to pick and choose employers who take good management as seriously as I do.

So here's my practical advice to you: think about treating your staff with respect. That means not just respecting but protecting their non-working time, including from themselves. That means understanding that what you see as trivial is actually important to someone else, and that your view of it is no more valid than theirs. That means agreeing clear expectations of your staff, but also agreeing with them what they can expect of you - agreeing, not dictating. It also means never, ever apologising insincerely.

But I suspect you're still caught up in the fantasy that your staff exist at work only to make your life easier, and if you can save yourself two minutes by taking up ten of theirs, or interrupting their leave, or being lazy, then that's fair game. Fair enough, a lot of workplaces encourage that mindset; overall management skills in the UK are notoriously poor. And as long as the labour market wasn't hugely constrained, bad managers had a lot more power to stay bad, despite their impact on productivity. Things are changing, though, so good people will have more options. Firms that treat people badly will be left with slim pickings (just ask the air travel sector...)

Enjoy your prima donnas though! I'm sure their behaviour has absolutely nothing to do with yours.

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 16:10

My goodness that’s me told.

You may lack a lot of things but it looks like self regard is not one of them.

alphons · 07/06/2022 16:19

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 16:10

My goodness that’s me told.

You may lack a lot of things but it looks like self regard is not one of them.

I had a manager like you, many moons ago.

She thought we were lucky to have our jobs, and expected us to treat her with the gratitude and deference last seen in serf-Lord of the Manor days.

Her attitude didn’t go unnoticed by anyone, below and above her. She was middle management at its absolute worst. She didn’t last long at all.

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 16:27

alphons · 07/06/2022 16:19

I had a manager like you, many moons ago.

She thought we were lucky to have our jobs, and expected us to treat her with the gratitude and deference last seen in serf-Lord of the Manor days.

Her attitude didn’t go unnoticed by anyone, below and above her. She was middle management at its absolute worst. She didn’t last long at all.

Another pointless personal anecdote. Yaaaaawn.

retiredtrafficcop · 07/06/2022 16:28

you have been asked to do work related stuff on a day of leave, claim the day of leave back

alphons · 07/06/2022 16:30

DontBlameMe79 · 07/06/2022 16:27

Another pointless personal anecdote. Yaaaaawn.

How old are you? 12? 😂

BalloonsAndWhistles · 07/06/2022 16:32

Yes, I would be extremely annoyed. From now on, ignore her calls and any texts during annual leave. There is literally nothing she can do as this is your time and you need time to relax. I ended up telling DH this in the end as his boss dragon lady kept phoning him unprompted whilst he was off sick. Slightly different I appreciate but her calls were in addition to any approved KIT calls. In the end, he told her that anything work related was to go to his work email account to be dealt with on his return and he advised her that he would only answer the phone, or respond to a text, if it was a pre-arranged communication. You should do the same.

SonicHg · 07/06/2022 16:36

@DontBlameMe79 Bet you’re as miserable as you sound 😂

thing47 · 07/06/2022 16:43

It's all down to the nature of the relationship and whether you respect other people isn't it? If my manager was someone I liked and enjoyed working for and I thought they were ringing me because they genuinely couldn't resolve the issue without recourse to contacting me, I wouldn't mind where or when it was. If, on the other hand, they were a lazy fucker who couldn't be arsed to look into it and thought it was simpler to disturb me than do a bit of work himself, then I would be less inclined to help.

Surely most human beings understand that if you are asking someone for a favour (ie something they are not obliged to do), the very least you should do is ask politely and be grateful for their help.

myuterusistryingtokillme · 07/06/2022 16:50

Choose to be kind is not a bad way to live your life.

Says the Manager who doesn't give a rats arse if they disturb an employee's holiday because it's no big deal.

It is actually a big deal, OP has already said that she works in a stressful job and needs to switch off when she is on holiday, we all do. And being contacted by work makes you think about work which makes that hard to do.

She certainly shouldn't be answering inane questions from a manager that is only contacting her because they can't be bothered to look for the information. But apparently managers get a free pass on the 'Be Kind' bollocks.....

Beamish22 · 07/06/2022 16:54

Well, next time you won't answer so problem solved. Seriously though, there is no "being kind" about dealing with work issues while you are on leave. Not answering would usually get the message across. Or maybe waiting until the evening to ring your boss back on their personal phone to ask what they needed.

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