AIBU to buy the horrible house next door

[thegreenlight]

We live in a lovely (but small 3 bed semi with no scope to extend) next door has just come on the market - it’s horrible having been rented out by the guy across the road for years and he did the work himself. Our house has an extension, downstairs bathroom and utility. Next door has none of this but massive scope to extend to the back and side. We have never done a renovation before! Do we offer to buy directly from the owner and pay asking (it has been put on sale this morning through a local agent) what should I do? We LOVE our area but can’t afford a ready renovated house. It would mean a real dip in living standards while we do the work. Any advice? Am I being stupid!?

Re cooking, it would be a microwave upstairs, washing dishes in the bathroom sink and possibly a camping set up. Then takeaways and asking family/friends/launderette. It's living with the constant dust and in a confined space. You have to be really organised and I don't know anyone who has done it without having a few nights in a hotel or with family. Everything into storage that you don't need while the renovations are being done.

You really need to do your sums, taking into account all costs (EA, sols, stamp duty etc, architects etc etc). Can you go round with a builder to get a ballpark idea of the renovation costs?

Bear in mind that it can work out cheaper to move into rented while the works are done, as builders working around a family can make a job take a lot longer.

I think the days of easy profits from renovations are over, so I would only do this if it's worth it to you in terms of the house you end up living in. I also think you need to think clearly about your aims- the choices you make for a house you're renovating to live in might not be the same as those you'd make to maximise profit.

Sounds like you're excited at the prospect.
I wouldn't do it, as wouldn't want the hassle or the (no doubt extortionate and ever increasing) expense. But only you know if you want to take on such a project!

A tip when trying to buy quickly is to use the same estate agent - I did this and the estate agent was more motivated to ensure both sales go through. It doesn’t mean you get a better price or anything obviously - but once you are sale agreed on the new house communication is much easier with only one estate agent involved.

I would go for it. It will be disruptive for a while but you get to build your dream house! How exciting

If you thinking you can save a bit by buying a house not renovated and do it up, this almost never works unless you are in the industry.

Everyone I know who has done it has simply spent the price difference doing the work, and had to live in a shithole for 2 years while it was being done

I think it sounds like a good idea.

An even better idea might be to speak to a mortgage advisor to see if there is any chance of buying the second one, while keeping your own (to rent out)…

Go and have a look to see the condition inside. We've done full renovations with small children, no roof, ceilings kitchen etc it's not impossible and you just get used to it
But bear in mind materials and labour are increasingly hard to get hold of now and it's very, very expensive. If you can cope with doing it in stages all the better
Don't cut out the agent, it's not unheard of for them to take people to court for this

We bought a renovation job with 2 youngish children and it was fine. Is 100k enough to do all that though? Mine was 50k for no extension, 1 interior wall removed, new kitchen, new cloakroom, new utility and a garage conversion.
Another thing to think about is whether your children might be upset about living next to their old house, I think mine would have been.

We bought our house as a doer Upper. We had 2 extensions (kids were 1, then 2 and 58 when we did them) and DH has redone most of the inside himself - new bathroom/kitchen/floors etc. The bathroom and kitchen took about 4 months each as he was only doing evenings/weekends and we lived there the whole time. It probably took around 8 years to get it all finished. We couldn't afford an already extended house, or to rent somewhere else when it was done. I took DD to my parents for a day during the first extension on a day it was unbearably noisy and went away for a week when the kitchen was being finished.

2 and 5!! (Not 58!🤣)

Planning has been granted before for the side extension before the current owner bought it but that was a long time ago. I’m worried I’m taking something on I won’t be able to cope with but I want a new kitchen, bathroom and garden office in this house which will cost.

A family member of mine has actually experienced this from the other side - i.e. the previous owner of her house moved to the distinctly run-down property next door and did it up whilst living there. She thought he was brave/mad, but having seen the process as it was happening, she gets why he did it - he now has an amazing house in an area he already liked and knew was desirable, done almost entirely to his spec (he virtually rebuilt the old one) - and with any money from the sale of his old/her new house left over post-renovations as a profit.

I will add though, he did not have young children, so didn’t have to factor that in whilst living through the renovations.

Do you have experience in renovations?

Can you just make an offer for some of the garden? Depending on the layout of course.

@thegreenlight

It’s livable currently but has a tiny kitchen. I’m concerned what we would do for cooking when the whole back of the house gets knocked out!

Do it!! Microwave and air fryer (see thread re not using oven / getting air fryer).

We have £100 + equity in our house the start the works with.

100 quid won’t get you much work though

I’d buy it if you can definitely but ensure you know exactly the timescale, cost etc of renovations before proceeding.

It’s doable but won’t be easy or for the faint hearted. We moved 4 years ago into a doer upper. We still don’t have proper flooring as it was way way more expensive than we planned, obviously covid didn’t help. We’ve done three bedrooms and the kitchen (unfinished), and part of the garden including small structural changes.

We still have porch, hallway, bathroom and lounge and eventual extension to go. We’ve sunk £50k into it so far. I don’t regret it but I wish I hadn’t done it with a newborn in tow!

Agree that testing the water with the owner is the right place to start.

But be prepared to walk away. We extended and renovated (back to bricks; walls down, steels in; all new electrics, plumbing and windows) in 2020 and the price increases and supply issues put us 30% over our budget. We moved out, in with family, and even so it was one of the most stressful things I've ever chosen to put myself through! :) I'm glad we did it and the house is lovely but we'll be paying off that overspend for the next 3 years...

From what I hear, prices are only increasing further and contractors are hard to find. Jobs are taking longer because of general scarcity - waiting for people and supplies before you can carry on.

There are real safety issues with kids living around a building site - dust being one, especially if your kids have asthma, but also our (then) 2 yo consistently got himself into a pickle on our brief site visits - running towards holes in the floor he hadn't noticed, etc etc.

As well as doing the maths around purchase costs, professional fees, stamp duty, extension/renovation costs VS the potential re-sale value, you also have to cost up stress, mess, and time spent in a half-done house. Try to put a number on what all that means to you, and add that into the equation.

And then speak to the vendor and see what his number is, and work out what to do from there.

Best of luck either way :)

With the difficulties in getting trades and the cost of materials being so high, I don't think it's a great idea. Now is not a good time to be starting a big project unless you have lots of skills and contacts in the trades.

People manage living in building sites all the time but it's not very pleasant and can be disruptive for the kids.

Do it, we have renovated houses with young children. We also had a kitchen extension 9 years ago and the children were 10 and 7. They just accept it. Bunked them in together, used one of their rooms for all the kitchen crockery and everything that lived in cupboards. Used the dining room for all the kitchen carcass etc.

Re cooking, we had a 2 ring portable induction hob. I also let my friend borrow mine when she was doing her kitchen renovation. Slow cooker and a plug in Teriyaki Grill. We still use that for pancakes and frying lots of eggs at the same time, no more pan sized restrictions.

We have also had a double garage conversion, boiler replaced, all radiators replaced, bathrooms which we fitted ourselves. Just be realistic about budget and how much of your personal free time will be taken up with decision making re buying stuff so tile choosing, kitchens, appliances, sinks, taps, flooring. It can get overwhelming which is why I short list stuff and Dh then chooses from that short list.

Good luck.

Have you considered the emotional cost of living next door to someone enjoyed your (current) “finished” house while you endure the renovation slog? We finished one and moved last year to a house that needs extending and renovating (liveable) and I would have found it hard to be next door to my old house while enduring the mess even though the end goal is better

We’ve been told by the EA that our house is worth more than we thought - he’s saying £320k. We’ve said that we will sell through them and they’re coming to view today. He said he has 12 viewings booked today for the other house and it only went up for sale at 7 this morning .

Can you do a loft conversion in your current house to get an extra bedroom? Costs of moving are insane so you need to add that to your financial calculations. I’m not convinced it wouldn’t be a very costly way of ending up with a slightly bigger garden tbh. Can’t you go up rather than out on your current house? Also remember building costs are way over what they used to be.

I get your desire to do this.
But you really need to do your numbers. Is it liveable as is? Can you fund the works? And make sure that you are not going to be living in a project for most of your kids childhood. I had relatives who bought a grand doer upper. Their kids point out that is was the parents vision and they spent their formative years living on a cold building site that was ever changing. The "adventure" was all in their parents minds.
First step is to speak to a mortgage adviser I think.

It’ll be short term pain for long term gain.

But builders are charging loads now because they are in such demand and materials have gone up. Check that 100k will get you what you want.

The pitch of the roof is too low for a loft conversion and to build one metre out to side to increase the box room would cost a fortune and we would never get it back. My eldest has autism so that has to be considered. It’s probably a pipe dream. Thankyou for all the advice, definitely something to think about! DH’s dad is a builder so we will speak to him and see what he thinks.