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AIBU?

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Original poster

Absentee Landlord

42 replies

ClementDrive · 09/04/2022 02:19

I'm an absentee landlord with two properties a long way away from where I now live. Work moved me away about ten years ago and I was unable to sell either property at the time and have been renting out since then.

It is now clear that I am not moving back and I am now happy to sell both properties at the first opportunity. Work has become difficult and I am doing everything I can to keep my job.

For ten years now, I have employed a property manager at 16 hours a week to manage both properties. However, I have got myself into a silly situation.

The problem is that the tenants in both properties are complaining that the property manager is not doing her job properly. Complaints are logged, nothing gets resolved. Tenants are now contacting me directly.

I have been trying to address the issue but every time I try to arrange a meeting / phone call with my employee she says she is not available.

I work during the week. My work is "difficult". I fear for my job. I have been told that my performance at work is unacceptably poor. I don't agree with this assessment but I am working as hard as I can.

Meanwhile my employee has been "off sick" for the last six weeks. Once a week I text her and ask if she is better but she says that I am unreasonable to keep on asking if she is feeling better. She says she will tell me when she is better.

I keep on asking to arrange a phone call to discuss matters but she says I am unreasonable to ask her to take a phone call in the evenings or at weekends.

I have said I want to meet with her but I can only drive there at weekends and she has said she is not available to meet at weekends and that I am bullying her because she is ill.

I have sympathies with her being unwell but ultimately I am paying her to do a job that is not being done because she is not well.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

OP posts:
AlmostAJillSandwich · 09/04/2022 03:09

Notify her you're firing her? The complaints from the tennants justify that surely?

blisstwins · 09/04/2022 03:16

Absolutely fire her and 16 hours a week? I have no idea how many units? Unless she is doing all repair work herself it is very unlikely she is doing that much work. When people post about landlords here I always want to explain it is not a passive way to earn money—stocks would be. If you cannot manage the properties or find someone to do it, then do try to sell. It is clear the stress is affecting you greatly. This manager is doing you and your tenants a great disservice.

blisstwins · 09/04/2022 03:18

And what are the tenant complaints? Do you know anyone else in the area from when you lived there who can help? Perhaps you can arrange workmen from where you are and ask tenants to give access? So much can be done with photos and via FaceTime and other kinds of tech.

TakeMe2Insanity · 09/04/2022 05:18

How many tenants do you have that justify a propert manager for 16 hrs a week? An agent would have been a better idea. It sounds like she has a full time job in addition to the 16 hrs. Definitely fire her then organise stuff yourself.

SolasAnla · 09/04/2022 05:40

Is she an employee or a letting agent?

If she is a UK employee you have a problem as you are effectively bullying a sick (potentially disabled member) of your staff. As you have assets she can collect a cash payout if she won a case against you. You need legal advice on how to manage the relationship as a employer. Plus if you want to stop employing her you need to follow the correct process. Redundancy may be the quickest method of ending the relationship.

If the tenants are complaining you will either have to hire another person/company to manage while she is off sick, or make the arrangements yourself.

Elbie79 · 09/04/2022 06:34

Do you definitely need things fixing before selling? It might get a higher selling price, but would it be worth it if you lose your job in the process?

The sooner you sell the sooner you can make this pisstaker of a property manager redundant.

Take a weekend - go up there, get agents round to value, do what you personally can in those two days to perk the properties up, get them on the market. Agents to liaise with tenants over viewings. Bypass this woman completely.

And by the way I hope you're not still paying the manager her full wage? Even a generous employer would have put her on statutory sick pay by now.

TorringtonDean · 09/04/2022 06:42

16hrs a week seems very excessive unless these are blocks of flats or something. An estate agent would just deal with the odd enquiry from tenants about a dripping tap or whatever. Two houses wouldn’t need 16hrs.

Mindymomo · 09/04/2022 06:48

Sounds like the tenants have been waiting longer than 6 weeks for things to be sorted. It’s not fair on anyone in your situation. Can you book some holiday and sort it out. If you are employing the person, don’t they need to provide a sick note.

londonrach · 09/04/2022 06:52

Get legal advice on this but look to firing the property manager as sounds like not doing her job for weeks prior to being ill but you need to be careful.

Teeturtle · 09/04/2022 06:55

@SolasAnla

Is she an employee or a letting agent?

If she is a UK employee you have a problem as you are effectively bullying a sick (potentially disabled member) of your staff. As you have assets she can collect a cash payout if she won a case against you. You need legal advice on how to manage the relationship as a employer. Plus if you want to stop employing her you need to follow the correct process. Redundancy may be the quickest method of ending the relationship.

If the tenants are complaining you will either have to hire another person/company to manage while she is off sick, or make the arrangements yourself.

Rubbish. Being off work for six weeks does not make somebody disabled. And even if they were disabled, they need to tell the employer this and discuss reasonable adjustments, not going to work is not a reasonable adjustment. OP is being too soft if anything, they should be starting dismissal processes by now.

I assume this is two blocks of flats that are being managed for 16 hours a week and OP has responsibilities towards tenants.

Ivegotalovelybunch · 09/04/2022 07:06

You need to speak to Acas to ensure you do this correctly. If she is a direct employee, you can make redundant as legitimately wrapping up your business.

Original poster
ClementDrive · 09/04/2022 07:21

For those asking, there are two properties, one let to a family and one let to students. Both properties are furnished. Local letting agents won't take on the properties on as they are furnished. Until now I have not wanted to lose my furniture.

The advice I have received is that I can't dismiss someone if they are ill, and I can't make them redundant if the job still exists.

I have previously suggested to the tenants that they get the work done and deduct the cost from the rent. but they are unwilling to do that.

OP posts:
Okeydoky · 09/04/2022 07:21

What on earth is she doing for 16 hours a week?! Our rented property takes us less than 16 hours a year to manage and we always arrange a tradesperson within 24 hours of the tenant calling us.

The quickest option would be to ask around on local Facebook group for recommendations for a really good agent that can deal with renting and selling. Then get them to deal with ending the tenancies, organising any essential works and then selling them. Get some legal advice on making her redundant on the basis you are using an agent to sell the properties.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 09/04/2022 07:29

Stop paying her.. She needs to be in ssp.

16 hours is a maaaad amount of time!! She's on to a nice earner there 😁😁... And she isn't doing anything.

Get the houses on the market... Then the job disappears...

Original poster
ClementDrive · 09/04/2022 07:41

Thanks for the replies. Had not thought of SSP. Tenants don't want to leave so it would not be fair on them to put the properties on the market until they want to depart. The only solution I can think of is to make the property manager redundant and tell the tenants they can stay provided they accept there will not be a property manager.

OP posts:
dizzydizzydizzy · 09/04/2022 07:43

You're not bullying her. Fire her.

I'm a landlord too. Also wonders about the 16 hours a week. It is a lot of work but not as much as that.

kirkandpetal · 09/04/2022 07:48

You can't not sell just because your tenants don't want to leave. You may never sell at that rate. I have no idea legally what the options are but surely you need to provide x weeks/month notice to tenants that they need to go as you are selling??

dizzydizzydizzy · 09/04/2022 07:49

I recently had 6 weeks off my PT job due to sickness (covid). I kept in regular email and WhatsApp contact with my employer.

My GP gave me a note for my employer to say I was ready to return to work but needed extra beaks.

jay55 · 09/04/2022 07:50

Have they produced a sick note?

Squidlydoo · 09/04/2022 07:50

Wow.

Firstly I would say that I can see that you are a nice, caring person and don’t want to do the wrong thing/upset people

BUT you need to see your properties with more of a “business” head. 16 hours a week is a huge amount of time and money. I would agree with others that properties with regular tenants would need a fraction of this.

The way I see it, the issue is whether you want to keep the properties? Many student properties are furnished so I am unsure why a management company will not manage it this way for you.

If they are students, surely their tenancy ends in the next few months so you could sell/change the management terms at this point?

You are spending far to much money on having your property “managed”

Squidlydoo · 09/04/2022 07:52

Two months notice is needed to evict tenants. This is done with a section 21 notice and you can give notice for any reason (assuming you have an assured short hold tenancy agreement)

elbea · 09/04/2022 07:57

I say this as somebody who has managed rental properties professionally… she’s having you on. It does not take 16 hours a week to manage two rentals.

I managed 100 rentals, commercial rentals plus a 4,000ac farm and doing PA work for the UHNW family in 24hours a week. I’d make the role redundant, there will be a letting company that will help you - they usually charge a few % of the monthly rent. I highly doubt they’d do more than 16 hours work all year.

Original poster
ClementDrive · 09/04/2022 08:07

Can I check the redundancy pay calculation? I think I have to give ten weeks notice and then pay her 15 weeks redundancy pay. That's a lot of money!

OP posts:
dfendyr · 09/04/2022 08:11

Can't you put her on a warning for poor performance?

Okeydoky · 09/04/2022 08:11

How long has she been your employee?

Other option is to put her on statutory sick pay and then when that runs out she will get nothing.

I assume you've been doing it all properly with PAYE and therefore can claim statutory sick pay for her?