Why do people keep dangerous dogs???

[Ori18]

Another little boy pronounced dead this morning on the news - the toddler who was mauled on Monday and subsequently suffered a cardiac arrest. The dogs in question are not thought to be banned under the Dangerous Dogs Act - but I'd be interested to know which breeds they were as it's quite evident that certain breeds are more dangerous to children than others - why aren't Rottweiler's on the banned list for example?

And even though Pitt Bull Terriers are banned, people still go out of their way to own them, and are then shocked when they attack small children, maul babies, tear limbs off people. It makes me so angry. Same goes for German Shepherds and Staffordshire Bull Terriers. The Bull Terrier dogs are/were specifically bred for fighting - why would you even consider having one of these types of dogs around a baby or a small child? What is going on there? Is it lack of intelligence? Lack of education? Lack of giving a fuck? Because I think there need to be more dogs on the banned list, and heavier penalties served to people who insist on breaking the law to keep these dogs.

Aggressive/dangerous dogs and babies/small children do not mix, should never be mixed and it shouldn't take more deaths for the law to change around this. AIBU?

Everything @bozzabollix said. 100%

The hysteria on this site is ridiculous, as is the openly classist stereotyping of large dog owners.

Oh and @BlackCountryWench2 I am a middle class middle aged woman with a board director role in a FSTE 100. I also have a Chihuahua so im not sure i look 'hard'!

@Thewindwhispers

I think you should need a dog licence to own a dog.

Want a dog? Learn about dogs, show you know the behaviour theory, and pass a quick online test. If someone can’t be bothered to do this then yippee one less irresponsible dog owner.

Don’t control your dog and generate a constant stream of complaints to the police? Lose your dog licence and have your dog taken away.

Ohhh good idea 💡

Am I the only dog owner on the entire thread that had third party insurance?

When I was a teenager, a friends family Shih Tzu mauled a toddler and was put down.

Add that to the list as well??

@purpleboy you do realise that deaths caused by dogs is minute in comparison to how many dogs are owned in this country, right? You keep mentioning the words 'a lot' but in actuality it's not a lot, is it, it's a tiny percentage. The massive majority of dog owners are responsible, otherwise there would be hundreds of deaths per day rather than a few per year.

Of course any death by a dog is an absolute tragedy, and I reiterate that it's the owner at fault not the dog, but perspective in these matters is always handy.

@Thelnebriati

Am I the only dog owner on the entire thread that had third party insurance?

I expect you're not alone,, as it is included standard with pet policies from the major providers.

But if you don't get a general pet policy, then I think you're on to something - people just don't think about it, and might not occur to them. But if you stopped to think about the damage that your dog could do to others - say if it spooked a child, who ran into the road causing a car to emergency stop and another car to shunt them (whiplash? and one car crumpled boot, other crumpled bonnet) - then you'd definitely get it, even if you self-fund vet fees

I don't have strong feelings on dogs and am not in favour of blanket bans just because a breed is very powerful. As well as being unfair to the majority that are good dogs/owners, enforcement would be a nightmare.

That said, I cannot wrap my head around the mentality of deliberately choosing one of those big breeds if you already have little kids (like the American Bully situation). Why risk it? What's the point? No dog is 💯, but there are loads of breeds out there that would be easier to control if things go wrong. Why wouldn't you get one of those until the kids are out the equation?

Years ago you used to have to have a license, time they brought back,the DDA doesn't work,it's time the made huge changes.
Bad owners that should be vetted first,should be compulsory dog training lessons.
Any dog can turn and bite,owners not recognising the signs or understanding the signs.
I have a dog,he has grown up with my boys,now he's 13 yrs old and arthritis is setting in so we have to be extra careful with him,I don't allow him to be on his own with my grandkids as I know it only takes an accidental knock or step on our dog to hurt him,grandkids are little as as much as we tell them to be careful and gentle nothing is 100% safe.

I think a lot of dog owners are making the mistake of assuming their dog won't ever hurt someone because they've had it a number of years and it's been properly trained etc etc. I know friends whose child was terribly mauled by a small dog (forget the breed, but certainly not a traditionally 'angry' dog). They'd had it 6 years, it was properly trained and well behaved and was consistently left to play with their children. Until, unprovoked, it attacked our friends' child, who needed reconstructive surgery. So, I think no small child should be left unattended with any dog. I'll never understand why people with children choose ugly dogs, often breeds which are traditionally known to have aggressive tendencies. It can only be to look intimidating, because they certainly don't look nice!! Or is it fashion? There are some beautiful, placid dogs out there. Why not choose a family dog renowned for a typically mild temperament? And train it carefully, regardless. Just because your staffie, pitbull, rottweiler, doberman is a well trained 'big softie' doesn't mean you can ever fully trust them around children. I can't understand why an educated person would think this is a good idea.

@Thelnebriati No - All our dogs have proper insurance including 3rd party & I posted above you can get 3rd party insurance from the dogs trust.

But my point is all dog owners need to take responsibility for their dogs when around small children. Equally ( unless we want to live in a world with out any dogs at all - & I realise some would prefer this ) teaching your children how to be safe with decent dogs is worth doing. Poking them in the eyes and screaming at them is not helpful ( dogs not the children ) - but but but I will say the onus is on the dog owner to keep them safe around children. Any provoked or hurt or frightened dog might snap or growl however well trained Badly trained dangerous dogs - separate debate.

@SartresSoul

I wouldn’t class a staffie as a dangerous dog at all. The Staffies I have met have all been utterly stupid and docile. Very energetic but ultimately loving dogs. No experience with German shepherds but also never thought of them as particularly dangerous.

I frequent a beach that has two staffers who are walked on it. Both are terrifyingly unpredictable, snarly, they resource guard, snap at other dogs. Both have to be captured and leashed regularly when they get overstimulated or become a bit snappy... it's a matter of time it seems

Both are owned by what you would call a 'nice middle class family', owned from puppies by attentive (obsessed) owners and before kids arrived.

The Rottie we see is a big lumbering softie but I'm always far more wary of him than other dogs. If he decides to 'turn' then he's Always going to come off best. I'm always relieved when he's not there or they are walking in the opposite direction

The tiny dogs we see are angry, snappy impatient little fuckers who nip the heels of my patient, mixed breed. If my dog reacts to them and chases them in play the owners tend to give me a telling off for traumatising their floof ignoring the fact that they've spent several minutes aggressively winding up my dog.

I've got hand and leg scars from the beach. All of them from snappy little tiny dogs who have no recall and no boundaries. But that's a scratch. It's clear those staffies would do much much worse if they fancied it

I'll never understand why people with children choose ugly dogs, often breeds which are traditionally known to have aggressive tendencies. It can only be to look intimidating, because they certainly don't look nice!!

Please tell me you're kidding. Ugly dogs?? Being big doesn't make them ugly. A Frenchie or a Pug isn't exactly a pretty dog but I dare anyone to tell their owners that! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder you know. There's nothing ugly about an American bully or a Rottweiler!!

Yes, us big dog owners generally do understand and know our dogs. But nor are we stupid and complacent.

I always watch mine very closely around New people and children. I know his signals, I know when he isn't comfortable so I remove him from the situation.

It's exceedingly rare that I've had to. He is in his element with new people.

I can see from the slightest change in body language that he isn't happy. I remove him, for his sake and others.

ALL dogs can be dangerous if they are not properly trained and socialised. It's always the fault of the ignorant, lazy owners when a dog goes rogue.

I’m gobsmacked at some of the responses on here.

All breeds were bred by humans for various purposes. Some dogs therefore are more likely to attack humans than others.

Research dog domestication, research the history of each breed and research predatory drift.

There you will find your answers.

@Ori18

I'm genuinely curious to know - the posters who have a big dog - would you happily leave your baby/toddler ALONE in a room with your dog? Seriously, an honest question. Would you feel comfortable with this?

I have a German shepherd and a 1 year old daughter and honest answer, no I wouldn't leave them alone together because as soft as my dog is and as much as I love her she is an animal and you can never trust them 100%. But I wouldn't leave a child alone with any dog, that's just asking for trouble. I was raised around German shepherds and my daughter will be taught exactly the same as I was. You don't rough house with them, you don't invade their space when they want to be left alone and you don't pull or grab any part of them. Not because she's a large dog but because it's all part of teaching a child respect for other creatures regardless of their species, breed or size.

@justme2022 brilliant post.

@bottleofbeer

I've got an American Bulldog. He was treated with love and gentleness, and trained in the right way to behave.

He is the most beautiful natured dog and I'm not naive. I won't ever have another dog again because none will match up to him.

Let’s take your dog as an example. Good owner, well trained dog, nice natured dog and overall, well behaved.

Let’s take my child, who is older now, but was a whirlwind as a toddler. He would leap and jump and make noise, seemingly out of nowhere. It took a while to teach him “inside voice” and to control his volume. I could easily see how he could spook a dog, even a docile one used to the hustle and bustle of family life.

Your dog might turn because he was scared by something sudden my kid did. Your dog is likely going to do more damage due to his size and strength compared to a Pomeranian. That doesn’t make your dog an inherently bad dog or you a bad owner. It is a higher risk and some people worry it’s an unacceptably high risk. It’s not a judgement on you or your dog.

My DB and SIL have a dangerous dog, it used to be my DFs but when he moved in with us we were going to have it pts as it's an old staffie and got very aggressive. Baring teeth whenever you asked it to leave the room or go to its bed or away in a crate, snapping and trying to bite, growling at kids as it wanted to be on their beds. Anyway so they rehomed it and they're trying for a baby!!!

But of course they think there's no issue because they let the dog do whatever it wants and sleep on their bed and never say no to it at all. I honestly dread to think what will happen

[quote VampireMoney]@purpleboy you do realise that deaths caused by dogs is minute in comparison to how many dogs are owned in this country, right? You keep mentioning the words 'a lot' but in actuality it's not a lot, is it, it's a tiny percentage. The massive majority of dog owners are responsible, otherwise there would be hundreds of deaths per day rather than a few per year.

Of course any death by a dog is an absolute tragedy, and I reiterate that it's the owner at fault not the dog, but perspective in these matters is always handy. [/quote]
That tiny percentage might be acceptable collateral damage to you but it isn't to me.

That tiny percentage might be acceptable collateral damage to you but it isn't to me.

Please read the last paragraph of my post. Of course it's a tragedy. Of course it's not acceptable. But you cannot demonise all dogs because of a tiny percentage have killed, just as you can't demonise all humans just because some of them have killed. Children are more likely to be killed by their parent than by a dog. So should we ban people from having children in case they kill them?

@SartresSoul I didn’t really have any opinion on bull breeds previously. They aren’t my thing looks and personality wise but I didn’t dislike them.

However with watching a fully grown (sweet submissive) Labrador get its throat torn out while about 5 grown men failed to get the attacking staffie off changed my opinion massively. I’ve never seen anything attack with such intensity and just completely refusing to give in no matter what was thrown at it. The more they tried to get it off the more aggressive it got.
I’ve never seen anything quite so horrific as that and I never would want one around my dog or my children.

@VampireMoney

That tiny percentage might be acceptable collateral damage to you but it isn't to me.

Please read the last paragraph of my post. Of course it's a tragedy. Of course it's not acceptable. But you cannot demonise all dogs because of a tiny percentage have killed, just as you can't demonise all humans just because some of them have killed. Children are more likely to be killed by their parent than by a dog. So should we ban people from having children in case they kill them?

I think your confusing me with someone else. I haven't demonized all dogs, or even certain breeds. I don't agree that certain breeds should be in the hands of bad owners and when children are involved it's a receptive for disaster.

I agree it's the owners not the dogs, but some dogs have the potential to do more damage/fatal than others, and those dogs should be kept away from bad owners, and if we can't do then then they should be kept away from kids.

The innocent children have to be the priority in this, not negligent owners, and good owners whilst they might feel confident they have control over their situation, they are taking a risk as dogs are animals and are unpredictable.