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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To ask for my money back - car purchase

43 replies

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 00:47

Purchased a car approx 5 weeks ago, mid Feb. It's the second time I have purchased a car from this trade seller. Last one was great, no issues hence the return.

This one needs a cambelt change. He promised to do it but I needed the car quite urgently so we agreed he would book it in. He did and when I was on the way driving to the appointment, he called stating the garage had some delays and they would need it over night and I could drop it off at his preferred garage and get a train or taxi back. As I had to make the decision quickly I said it would be best to rearrange as this would be expensive for me. I have also noticed an issue with the clutch which I mentioned straight away. He said he would look at it. This appears to be a significant issue after talking to a mechanic and will need to be fixed/replaced. I was chasing prior to the cancelled booking and then got covid so didn't chase for just over a week. I have chased since. He has stated the garage is very delayed and there are stock issues for parts but he is chasing. I then hear nothing.

We are going to the coast on holiday in April so I need it fixed by then but it's looking unlikely. I will also be returning to the office next week which will mean I need a car and make it more difficult to fix due to it being in use more.

From research, I believe I can return the car if less than 30 days. However, it's probably 40 days now but there has been a delay mostly caused by him. It came with a 90 day warranty.

This car was just under 10k. To me, this is a lot of money and I expect a reliable car or issues fixed.

Am I unreasonable to ask for my money back in this instance rather than wasting more time? What would you do if this was you? How would you raise it? The trader is lovely.

OP posts:

araiwa · 23/03/2022 00:51

It needs a new cambelt and clutch with less than 10k??

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 00:59

No it cost 10k.

OP posts:

Netaporter · 23/03/2022 01:11

I’m afraid you are out of time to demand a refund so you need to concentrate on ensuring he makes good on the conditions of purchase I.e the cam belt change. How quickly did you report the clutch to him? They are not usually covered under warranty as it may be considered a wear and tear item so you need to check that. Personally I’d write an email covering what was agreed and the date on which you informed him about the clutch issue and ask him to confirm exact dates when he will be fixing the car as per the condition of purchase. He only has to agree to fix the issue though, not provide the most convenient garage location, provide a loan car etc so you need to be prepared to work with him regarding that.

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 01:24

I was hoping he would understand as the delay is mostly caused by him and refund. Although it muddies the waters that I had covid and I made the decision to rearrange. It would be easier for him to fix at his leisure and resell.

I would agree with a standard extended warranty that the clutch is wear and tear but as the car is just purchased, I would expect this to be fixed. It does drive for now but it is getting worse and will soon not be fit for purpose. That probably also muddies the waters. When I raised it, he didn't seem concerned.

I stated the clutch felt strange on the test drive and he said it was fine and if it wasn't warranty etc. when we were booking the cambelt, as it had been driven more I stated it also creaked and stuck sometimes.

I do have his email but have mostly been communicating via text.

OP posts:

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 01:28

Also, I have no concern with him using his preferred garage. I mentioned this more as a note of distance and it's not that easy for me to get there and home. Originally I was to work from the local costa etc while they did it. When I'm back in the office, I can't do this. He lives £35 in a taxi from me. Around 20-30 miles. I suggested dropping the car off one evening this week and he returns it fixed as I can do without this week. He essentially said no point as garage busy as parts in short supply. It's on that basis (and the delay so far) that I want to request money back.

OP posts:

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 01:29

Garage busy and parts in short supply.

OP posts:

Netaporter · 23/03/2022 01:39

You can request it but he is not under any obligation to refund you. Keep screenshots of the text exchanges but I’d try the friendly but insistent approach first. If you paid using a credit card you might consider a section 75 claim.

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 01:44

That's exactly it, I need to be very nice so as to not piss him off but firm that he doesn't continue to faff.

OP posts:

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 01:45

Pressed send too soon. No, he only takes bank transfers which is annoying and this is probably why 😂

OP posts:

Ponoka7 · 23/03/2022 02:18

You could have a local garage look at the clutch. Then you'll have something definite to challenge him on, rather than take his word. The car has got to be fit for purpose. My ex had this issue and it turned out that the trader had insurance policies to cover car repairs/parts, but needed it to have been sold for a time period for it to click on. That could be going on. You need to calculate in the cost of travel back. He won't buy it back for what he's sold it for. So you are going to lose out anyway.

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 02:24

My neighbour is a mechanic. He didn't look at it but from the symptoms apparently it's clear what it is. Some bearing right under the clutch and while you're there to do a proper job You change the clutch or gear box. I should have paid more attention.

It could be that! But then just say that, not the palaver it's been.

I don't mind a small amount being knocked off. I've done good mileage in it and I would valet it.

Urgh. I hate buying cars! I am awful at it. I also can't sleep because of it. I'm up in four hours.

OP posts:

Thebestwaytoscareatory · 23/03/2022 02:56

90 days warranty is irrelevant. For faults within the first 6 months of purchase the onus is on the dealer to prove it wasn't there at the time of sale. This is tempered by the age/price/mileage/condition of the vehicle, by your use of the since the time of purchase, and by the type of fault.

Within 30 days you can reject for whatever reason. 31 days to 6 months the dealer has one opportunity to repair your vehicle. If this is not successful, or the fail to do it, you are entitled to a refund. 6 months plus it's on you to prove. In all instances the dealer can make a 'reasonable' adjustment to the amount refunded depending on your use of the vehicle. I can't remember off the top of my head if your right to reject automatically pauses if you raise an issue within the 30 days or not and that would be worth checking with the folks on Moneysavingexperts motoring forum.

Do not take it to another garage to be worked on or even looked at (unless it is purely visual but even then I'd be wary of telling the dealer) before you have given the selling dealer the opportunity to fix it. This will be a get out jail card for them as they can (and often do) argue that the fault was introduced by the other garage.

With regards to costs/issues getting the vehicle to/from the selling dealer that is entirely on you as you chose to purchase there I am afraid.

From what you have described it sounds like you have a noisey/faulty release bearing. These are general housed inside the bell housing of the gearbox as part of a concentric slave cylinder and require the box to be removed to access them. Your mechanic friend is right in that it is good practice to replace the clutch while in there due to the labour involved. However, if the fault is a release bearing then the dealer is not under any obligation to replace the clutch at his expense, so you may have to take that on the chin.

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 07:03

Thank you so much @Thebestwaytoscareatory. That's a great answer. That's exactly the problem my neighbour said. I also expect them to ask me to pay for the clutch as it's a nice to have. I imagine they are a lot of money but also that I'd be silly not to pay it as it could cost a lot more down the line.

I've no problem paying the transport costs to get the car back to him. I would never assume this would be on him. Nothing to do with him that I live where I do and he lives where he does.

OP posts:

EishetChayil · 23/03/2022 07:05

He's not going to honour any of the repairs. Mark my words.

2DogsOnMySofa · 23/03/2022 07:12

A clutch isn't a nice to have, if it's worn out then the car won't drive, and if your cam belt goes, it'll likely be a costly exercise to fix.

In your shoes op I'd do some research, ring the main dealer and find out how long it takes to get a cam belt and clutch ordered. That way you'll see if he's bullshitting you or not we parts. Then I'd speak to him, allow him to have the car for a day or two, even if it meant a hiring a car or borrowing one of his. The work needs doing otherwise you'll have a car that doesn't run.

As for returning the car, im afraid you e missed the boat. You could try asking, but he's a used car salesman, it's unlikely he'll do you any favours

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 09:03

Yes agree @2DogsOnMySofa but in this instance he could tell me it's not worn or required and I'd have no clue. I believe it's mostly good practice to get this done too rather than being essential, unless obviously when they get in there the see it as essential as from the sound it makes, I'm guessing it's not happy!

OP posts:

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 09:15

Just done a date calculator and it's 35 days!

OP posts:

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 10:39

@EishetChayil you might be right. Two calls this morning and no answer. I know he can be busy and he does get back later. Fingers crossed.

OP posts:

Thebestwaytoscareatory · 23/03/2022 11:53

OP you can go onto eurocarparts.com, enter your cars reg and search for a "clutch kit" and "timing kit" to get a rough idea of availability. I checked for my car, which is mildly obscure, and can get both the next working day.

That said, if they're fobbing you off they're fobbing you off and it's unfortunately a difficult and frustrating process to reject/return a car to a dealer who isn't playing ball. If you are going to pursue that route then please be aware that if you continue to use the vehicle and it does breakdown (clutch or timing) it will be harder for you to successfully claim as you knowingly used the vehicle with these faults present.

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 11:57

I did get a quote from a garage for the cambelt as thought it would be a few hundred quid and better to just be done with it. It was £450 plus VAT so I decided to continue this course. Likely to be available elsewhere cheaper as this was a highly recommended garage that I think charges more.

It's just so frustrating. I feel I am waiting around and shouldn't be using the car. His partner tested positive for covid on Monday so he's probably got it too which will delay. Annoying. I'm tempted to drive to his house and get him in person but that could be over reacting for now.

OP posts:

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 13:21

3 calls and no answer. I may send him an email/text message stating this. Does it sound ok?

Hi x, I'm becoming increasingly frustrated regarding the work required on the car. I have upcoming commitments for which I require a reliable, working car. If you are not able to get this completed before then, I think we need to look at returning the car. This seems easier all round as you are then able to get it fixed without any time pressure on yourself or the garage and I do not have to be concerned regarding my ability to get to work/enjoy my holiday.

OP posts:

HereComesTheSum · 23/03/2022 13:26

Get your money back, take your money and go and buy a brand new car on pcp etc. This is exactly why most people now do this. No hassle with any problems, 3, 5 7 year warranty (manufacturers all differ) no worries about MOTS etc. That's why 2nd hand cars are scarce and over priced right now - everyone is buying new because the hassle of 2nd hand cars is just not worth it anymore.

HereComesTheSum · 23/03/2022 13:28

@NelsonScrandela

3 calls and no answer. I may send him an email/text message stating this. Does it sound ok?

You can try that. It's well worded. Remember he is not "lovely" this is a business transaction, don't be fobbed off.

Original poster

NelsonScrandela · 23/03/2022 13:31

@HereComesTheSum I stepped out of the leasing world as was trying to save money. Hasn't gone to plan. I handed back my last lease car in sept 2020 (cost me 6k for the Two years I had it so thought I'll buy a whole car I can keep for that) and got a car for 7.5k. It was fine but too small for family life. Hence this change. I am tempted to do that tbh. Whole thing is a farce!

OP posts:

HereComesTheSum · 23/03/2022 13:37

Consider pcp rather than lease maybe. If you're not really into cars and want something reliable but cheaper Dacia is worth considering.

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