Do murderers rehabilitate in prison?

jobhunter7 · 2022-03-19T07:40:50+00:00

I've been reading about the awful Sophie Lancaster story and I was wondering whether people thought people who commit crimes like this do come out of prison rehabilitated by the system at all. As awful as crimes like this are, they were teenage boys. And sometimes people in prison haven't had the best start in life.

MagicDragonsPuff · 19/03/2022 14:42

I believe in rehabilitation, I believe in the UK justice system. I also know from experience of working with offenders it’s not a one size fits all approach.
Think about the one punch murders, there’s a fight, one person hits the other in a moment of anger and they die… is that anger different to someone who seeks revenge on another.
A DV victims who kills her husband is out for revenge.. is there a difference.
It’s a complicated question where many answers will differ, but if there isn’t a one size fits all approach how can it be tailored and can it be tailored to meet the individual needs of each of the offender

Hawkins001 · 19/03/2022 14:45

At present I'm not qualified to give an accurate analysis, however some research I've conducted in the past, does suggest it's different methods and different treatments, that can be used. How successful the methods are overall, varies from individual to individual.

Samcro · 19/03/2022 14:48

they kicked a young girl to death and nearly killed her boyfriend. people like that need punishment not help. should never be released.

NightmareSlashDelightful · 19/03/2022 14:48

SIL is a senior detective in the police and a friend of mine works with serious offenders.

Some do, some don’t is the short answer.

Also — ‘rehabilitation’ means different things to different people, and for different offences.

For some, such as those that are never going to be released, rehabilitation might mean therapy, or studying for a qualification, or simply accepting responsibility and ownership of their crime(s).

Rehabilitation doesn’t always mean ‘prepare them for release’.

LizDoingTheCanCan · 19/03/2022 14:56

I'm going to contradict myself here. Some are capable of rehabilitation, and I believe that those who are safe to, should be able to move back into the community and continual to rehabilitate. But the murderers of Sophie Lawrence, I wish they would rot in hell. Their crime was motivated by hatred of people different from themselves, they should be treated as terrorists.

I guess the murder of Sophie Lawrence feels differently because many of us were just like Sophie. Plus her mum and the charity set up in Sophie's memory have done so much work for good.

LizDoingTheCanCan · 19/03/2022 14:58

Also, they were sorry for what they had done because they were caught. They were not sorry when they were boasting about it afterwards.

Patienceisntvirtuous · 19/03/2022 15:01

@LizDoingTheCanCan

I'm going to contradict myself here. Some are capable of rehabilitation, and I believe that those who are safe to, should be able to move back into the community and continual to rehabilitate. But the murderers of Sophie Lawrence, I wish they would rot in hell. Their crime was motivated by hatred of people different from themselves, they should be treated as terrorists.

I guess the murder of Sophie Lawrence feels differently because many of us were just like Sophie. Plus her mum and the charity set up in Sophie's memory have done so much work for good.

Do you mean Sophie Lancaster? I've met her mum at events. Such a strong,inspiring woman and such a terrible crime. I don't think prison will change her murderers.

Jowel · 19/03/2022 15:03

I work as a community volunteer with young offenders. We have a wonderful scheme called 'One Punch' that just shows how one punch can kill someone.It can be life changing.

NameChChChChanges1 · 19/03/2022 15:05

@Samcro

they kicked a young girl to death and nearly killed her boyfriend. people like that need punishment not help. should never be released.

Agree. Her whole family as well as her partner (who survived) have been given a life sentence. Sophie wasn't given a chance. Why should they be.

howtomoveforwards · 19/03/2022 15:07

A DV victims who kills her husband is out for revenge

Are you sure? Surely the majority of DV victims who kill a partner/husband do so in self defence and/or fear?

lunar1 · 19/03/2022 15:17

I don't believe it matters if they can be rehabilitated. It isn't right to ask members of the public to take that risk.

The post is about someone convicted of murder and while I don't think they should be treated inhumanly, I don't think they should ever be in a position to risk the rehabilitation not having worked.

Smidgy · 19/03/2022 15:18

I guess some murderers will be rehabilitated, or didn't really need rehabilitating as such due to the nature of their crime. Others will continue being a danger to society no matter how long they're in prison for or what is done to help them. It's too broad a question to answer because there are so many variables.

However, in this case, I think it is an absolute insult to Sophie Lancaster's memory for either of the people responsible for her death to get early release, or a short sentence. The word "feral" was used in the article and that is exactly what they were. Their crime was inexcusable. It was done for hateful, trivial reasons. It was done for the fun of it. So for one or both to be released whilst they are still so young with their whole lives ahead of them is an utter disgrace.

HRTQueen · 19/03/2022 15:18

I work in forensic mh (ex offenders)

Some do some don’t depends on circumstances, back ground, support they get

Sexual offenders no they can’t be rehabilitated

Faevern · 19/03/2022 15:30

@MagicDragonsPuff victims of DV don’t kill for revenge and the anger from one punch is different from revenge anger. Have you worked with offenders for long?

Calandor · 19/03/2022 23:00

It depends I think.

If the murderer was: a gang member from youth, mentally ill, an addict, an abuse/SA victim, in a cult.

I think they can be rehabilitated.

If they did it because they enjoy killing I think it's unlikely.

EmmaH2022 · 19/03/2022 23:09

@lunar1

I don't believe it matters if they can be rehabilitated. It isn't right to ask members of the public to take that risk.

The post is about someone convicted of murder and while I don't think they should be treated inhumanly, I don't think they should ever be in a position to risk the rehabilitation not having worked.

Exactly this

Some might be rehabilitated

Some might not commit crime for different reasons. They may or may not have a hard time restraining themselves.

I don't have data, but was talking to a friend about this today. He said there are many situations where people have been harmed because of early release of prisoners (he used to work in a prison). He was alarmed by this news.

No one should be at risk because a panel thinks a murderer has been rehabilitated. A full Life sentence is appropriate for murder.

MrsKT123 · 19/03/2022 23:39

Speaking specifically of this case, I firmly believe Ryan Herbert cannot be rehabilitated - when you read the details of of what this monster and his friends did, I really don't see how you can think he would ever be fit to be let out.

To look at what her boyfriend said really brings it home for me - “I have never seen it as a hate crime. It was always like, “Sophie Lancaster was killed because she was a goth”. No, she wasn’t. She was killed because some a**eholes killed her. Why can’t we ask what it is about them that made them want to murder someone? Not what it is about someone that made them be murdered.”

He is a murderer. This wasn't 'one punch' this was a horrific and sustained attack.

When the paramedics arrived she and her boyfriend had been beaten so badly they couldn't tell facially who was female. He didn't stand by and watch this happen. He was an active participant.

It's an utter disgrace that he is out to walk free just 15 years later.

He was messaging girls on fbook from prison and laughing at someone getting attacked with a pool cue: www.rossendalefreepress.co.uk/news/local-news/mums-fury-sophie-lancaster-murderers-1705599

It seems all of this 'turn around' only happened in the last 2 years as he's part of a new programme. Obviously people want to see success from this and seemingly he is a benefactor of this.

Read Sophie's Mum's very dignified response... she got a life sentence, he did not.

Finallydoneit20220 · 20/03/2022 00:06

I have some experience on this.
My fil got released from prison two years ago after spending 20 years for a double murder. In a nutshell no i don't think he can ever be fully rehabilitated Mainly because of his awful crimes that tore a family apart not to mention his wife and kids dealing with the fall out. Also after spending so long in prison his mind thinks differently.
Some crimes are unforgivable

Lockheart · 20/03/2022 01:10

I think most people can be rehabilitated. Not all, but most.

It's a convenient and comforting thought, that there must be something innately evil about all these people who have committed awful crimes, something that separates us from them. That they're different from us and that we can never be them. Our children could never turn into them.

But they're just people like you and me. Deeply flawed, unwell, traumatised, stupid, in desparate situations, and yes in some cases just plain nasty. But still people. And people can, in most cases I believe, be rehabilitated.

ISeeTheLight · 20/03/2022 01:19

According to a friend (social worker in a prison) - some murderers are true sociopaths, they can't be rehabilitated. For others it depends on the person.

Dinoteeth · 20/03/2022 01:23

Totally depends on the person, and what drove them to commit murder in the first place.
But I'm surprised 'one punch' types are included, most of them probably get off with manslaughter / culpable homicide, and even at that some of them I have no doubt will come out every bit as nasty as they went in.

The sort to abduct, sexually abuse, then murder should never be released as they will do it again.

AlexaShutUp · 20/03/2022 01:28

I certainly believe that people can be rehabilitated, but I also know that not everyone will be. I do believe that it's what we should be aspiring for.

What happened to Sophie Lancaster was just horrific. I have also met her mum and was really moved by the work that she has done since Sophie's death to educate people about hate crime. However, I don't see any benefit in just punishing her killers without at least trying to rehabilitate them. That won't help anyone. Much better if they are truly able to get to a point where they deeply regret what they did, understand the impact that it has had and want to make some kind of contribution to society as a means of at least trying to atone for their crimes - even if we don't actually think that they could ever do enough because they can't undo what they have done. I don't see how leaving them to rot in jail helps anyone.

OnlyJoking1 · 20/03/2022 02:29

Having worked with young people in the care system, many have been or still are in prison for murder.
Several of them who had a parent in prison for murder.
A lot of the young people were badly let down by the system.
They didn’t get the input they needed.
These are reasons not excuses.
Rehabilitation hasn’t worked for quite a few of them, because they don’t have positive attachments to their parents, never have had.
Prison offers them things they were unable to get.
A huge amount of prisoners have many unmet needs, lots of prisoners have undiagnosed MH and neuro diversity is very high in prisons.
Some people can’t be rehabilitated.

Kanaloa · 20/03/2022 02:32

Absolutely impossible to know. It’s easy to sit and judge from your couch but unless you’re trained and educated and have met the people in question/been very involved in their case you simply can’t if they’ve been rehabilitated or not.

So much depends on circumstances as well - two people convicted of the same crime might have done it for very different reasons/have their own specific issues. One might be rehabilitated and the other might not.

Original poster

jobhunter7 · 20/03/2022 19:50

Knowing somebody that had done what Sophie Lancaster's murderers had done would probably make me not to be friends with them, myself...

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