Is teaching really that bad?

[Cremeegg456]

I did a secondary PGCE and gained a pass with Merit, and 'outstanding', that was 6 years ago and I've never completed my nqt year.
I know the PGCE isn't representative of what actual teaching is like though but I remember it being what seemed like a lot of unnecessary paperwork, but we also had the assignments on top.

I've done various work with young and elderly people since which I've enjoyed, but I've never made a lot more than minimum wage. Had zero hours contracts, agency work etc.

I did enjoy teaching but I am just not prepared to work evenings and weekends as well, it's just not worth having no life for me. Not prepared to work more than 45 hours a week.

But truthfully if I want a higher and more stable income I think I would have to go into it, if I'm thinking of buying a house, children etc in the next few years.

Would be interested to hear from people as to what their work life balance really is.

I love teaching but it is hard work and long hours. I work about 60 hours a week.
On these threads there is usually someone turns up and says 'work in an independent school'. Don't. I've worked in both sectors. Independent has better behaviour but just as many social/mental health problems as a state in a nice area, and far more hours. Some are better I'm sure, but the majority there is no cap on contact hours as in state, all staff have to do compulsory after school activities until 6 before they can even start planning and marking, and expectations on teachers from parents and SLT are unreasonable.
In my last school a colleague came from the state sector. He had been deemed an excellent teacher, had been in teaching 4 years. He failed in the first term in independent because he just couldn't keep up with the hours required.
Equally, I know people who have gone independent to state who have been unable to control their classes in state.
Basically what I'm saying is teaching is really really hard work and there are no ways round that by trying different types of school.
The only teacher friend I have who works reasonable hours works in a SEN school so very little marking - but when she is in school her job is the hardest of all and she is regularly physically attacked.

I enjoyed it for 10 years but always wanted to do something else eventually. In those 10 years It got worse. I wouldn't recommend it if there is another option for you.

It is particularly hard on nqt’s, or ect’s as they are now, and it is not getting any easier. It’s the same job as senior staff, held to the same standards by necessity, but paid a lot less and of course they find it easier after a few years. As usual nowadays as soon as you get anywhere the goalposts moved. What really did it for me was the way senior staff, at least in my area, seem to have it in for new starters. They never had to jump through as many hoops in one go themselves, but view themselves as morally superior, expect to be flattered, and too often will stab you in the back. Many are from teaching backgrounds themselves and can appear very judgemental on irrelevancies to those from outside. It’s not a supportive profession, or even very professional imo.

Special school? Ed psych? Educational wellbeing practitioner? Private tutor/governess type role? Some of the above require lots more training but would pay a lot more for less stress longer term.

Reading this thread makes me sad.
Teaching is a great job. It's a hugely important one, too.
Do we work harder than anyone else in any other job? No.
Someone upthread said it is a vocation. The danger with that description is that all the "stuff" that adds to the workload is just expected. I wasn't called to teaching by some higher power, and I don't expect to be expected to devote my entire being to it. "Doing it for the kids" is the drum beaten by those who want trips/clubs/sport/revision etc to run but don't want to pay to staff it.

Doing it for the kids" is the drum beaten by those who want trips/clubs/sport/revision etc to run but don't want to pay to staff it.
Very, very familiar.

"It seems bizarre to me to complete a PGCE, with all the work and stress that entails, but then not bother to do the NQT year." It's not that unusual I don't think.

I hated teaching (not the actual classroom bit the other parts of the job) but I was determined to finish the PGCE I was already half way through.

I've never known another job to be so unpleasant amd the worst bit is that I'm sure it doesn't have to be that way because in places like Finland teachers don't have such a horrible work environment.

The drop out rate at the end of the PGCE is high, especially in subjects with bursaries. A shocking number of trainees never enter the classroom after they've claimed their tax free amount.

I applied for the PGCE. As part of the interview process we had to prepare a presentation (spent ages prepping after the kids had gone to bed) and write an essay on current policies (ended up having a huge rant on why it's not teacher's fault we are in this mess). Decided that teaching wasn't for me in that moment 😂

It's horrendous. I did a primary PCGE, 3/4 of my NQT year and quit.

I was mentally in the worst place I've ever been in by the time i quit and dread to think what I would of done if I hadn't.

My starting salary was £21k and with the hours I had to work I was absolutely working for less than minimum wage.

My advice to anyone thinking of going into teaching (especially at the moment) is don't. Sorry OP 😟

I taught functional skills in an FE college for years. Never had to take work home unless I had been very badly organised that day.
That said there was more paperwork than teaching and the students were pretty difficult.

It’s worse than people realise and I am desperate to leave!

It's not just about the hours. A friend was an outstanding teacher for 20 years until the point that student behaviour in the school got so bad and there was so little senior management support in managing bad behaviour (no point giving detentions as the kids knew nothing would happen if they didn't turn up) that it broke her and she had to leave the profession. She then took an admin role is local business and was genuinely shocked to find that she was treated as a competent adult, trusted to get on with her job and not monitored constantly. She asked me if it was normal because she'd never experienced it in teaching :-(

@MillicentMargaretAmanda interesting insight. I used to work as a ta with children with behavioural issues. No support whatsoever from senior management. It's soul destroying. I have also had the sense of being respected as a human being working in administration in a non-education related job. It's insane what they expect teachers to put up with. No way josé!

I can relate to being hesitant about wanting to go into teaching now due to the general issues with that career: high stress levels, poor support etc...

But I have to say I think you are being quite naive: if you want a more stable income and better life prospects you can't have an absolute hard red line about working for more than 45 hours/week or doing weekends and evenings.

The reality is that in the world we live in if you want a fulfilling and well-paid career you can't expect to clock in at 9am and out at 5pm. You don't necessarily have to work investment banker hours but there are choices to be made. A career like this does involved some extra work. You must have known this before doing PGCE? It predates COVID by years.

I think in your position teaching with all its challenges would be infinitely more attractive than a series of minimal wage and zero hours contract jobs.

I don’t know if it’s already been mentioned but join the Facebook group:

Life After Teaching - Exit the Classroom and Thrive

It’s a closed group but some of the posts are heartbreaking to read. A lot of them are also really reassuring when people post about their post-teaching job.

"after they've claimed their tax free amount" I think this is quite unfair. No one knows what it really is like until you're a fair way into the course, even with the required 10 days (or whatever it was) work shadowing you have to do beforehand.

Yes, you could quit half way through a PGCE and not take the last remaining part of a bursary (and usually your loan as well), but by that point you might as well finish for some people so you're not damaging your CV by quitting.

DH is a secondary teacher, head of subject, and rarely works evenings or weekends. Occasionally he will bring home some marking, although he does concede that he is always behind with it and never does it as often as he should!

He has to do parents evening or open evening maybe a couple of times a term, but apart from that, is usually home by 5.

I think it probably does come down to the school. DH is at a grammar, in a area where the population is around 40% Asian, and he says that this does make a big difference in behaviour.
DH has been there 9 years and loves the school, he also has lots of colleagues who've been there for many years and wouldn't leave. The downside to that is that there isn't much room for progression, as the heads of dept don't tend to move on! His HOD has been hinting about retiring soon for a few years so he's hanging in for that

FIL was also a teacher for many years, never did any work outside of the classroom, and used to plan his lessons while he was walking to them

@thepeopleversuswork nah it wouldn't be for me. At least with zero hours minimal you would be there for your children.

Thanks again everyone. I think this has helped me confirm it isn't for me.

In response to another poster, it is absolutely not 'naive" to think you can have a 9-5 job that pays more than min wage. Many people, including my parents, work less than 45 hours for a salary that's probably double mine. Otherwise what a depressing World that would be.

@icecreamcart

At least with zero hours minimal you would be there for your children.

Maybe, but if you can't keep a roof over your head or feed them or provide any stability for them that's cold comfort.

Pleased to see FE mentioned a couple of times. It’s very different to school. Smaller classes of students who really need the support which, so far in my training, I have been able to offer. Most teachers in my little team of maths and English teachers are happy to be there. Less pay but also slower paced but I really believe here there is still the scope to ‘make a difference’ without starting to resent it or burn out. Yes a lot of admin etc but I think it will be doable. I plan to slide in gently with a 0.5 contract so I can get it right. We’re a relatively small college. Not perfect by any means but doing my training this year has only confirmed this is where I belong. I will return here in a couple of years if you like. Let you know how I feel then. ❤️

@Cremeegg456

Thanks again everyone. I think this has helped me confirm it isn't for me.

In response to another poster, it is absolutely not 'naive" to think you can have a 9-5 job that pays more than min wage. Many people, including my parents, work less than 45 hours for a salary that's probably double mine. Otherwise what a depressing World that would be.

But TBF your parents probably got those jobs decades ago in more economically secure times when there was a more favourable employment market and I assume have worked their whole careers to get to that point. They won't have started out at this point.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking you for not wanting to go into teaching. But the idea that you can walk into a secure, well-paid and stimulating job at the start of your career and be able to insist that you work 9-5 only is a bit deluded.

Ultimately you need to decide if you want a job or a career: if its the latter you will have to make peace with going above and beyond some of the time.

@SoftwareDev

It's not as bad as you think - it's worse.

There is a reason hundreds of us are leaving the profession!

This. It's the worst profession and I can say that from 17 years experience

Interesting way this thread is going. There was a thread on here a couple of months ago asking if you love your job what do you do? There were many happy teachers on there! They are out there!