do you know any young Christians

[zope]

MIL (in her 60s and religious) recently came to stay with us and I accompanied her to church when we got there i was really shocked by how few people under the age of 60 there seemed to be to the point where I (now in my mid 40s) felt young again. There were a number of small children with grandparents but virtually no one age 10-60. I haven’t been to church since I was a child myself so I was quite taken aback, is this what most churches are like nowadays or was this a one off. Do you personally know any young as in teenagers or in their 20s/30s Christians and do they have many friends who are also Christian? I would honestly be interested?

I think unless your parents actively instill the religion in you from youth most young people think it sounds like fairy stories. Those who find faith otherwise tend to have had terrible lives and are looking for hope or salvation.

I think a problem of rocking up at one church service is that there is no way to know how representative it is.

A church with multiple services will inevitably attract a different demographic at each service. A church in a populated area will be different from its neighbours.

In these pandemic times, when churches are live streaming services, more techy younger people are more likely to stay under the duvet and participate via YouTube.

Our olds' service is back to pre-pandemic attendance, whereas our younger and family service is running at about 70%. Our YouTube data suggests that we are tripling this deficit (our giving supports this too).

I am in my late 20s and attend a low-Anglican church with my DH who is in the process of applying to become an ordained CofE minister. We attend a weekly Bible study with other members of the congregation who are a similar age. Another member of this group is also applying for ordination training.

Our congregation has probably over 30 children under 12yrs but not everyone is there every week. Parents tend to be over 30.

There's also a growing youth group (secondary school age) headed by a small team between the ages of 55yrs and 17yrs.

From personal experience, high-Anglican churches and small village churches that strictly follow the liturgy will have an older congregation but evangelical churches and Anglican Churches that are more relaxed in their services will have a wider age-span.

@Calandor

I think unless your parents actively instill the religion in you from youth most young people think it sounds like fairy stories. Those who find faith otherwise tend to have had terrible lives and are looking for hope or salvation.

Yes. I'm always surprised at the thinking (although looking at this thread it seems to be somewhat effective) that if you have more modern religious music instead of hymns, or a school chaplain who's "down with the kids", you'll encourage young people into religion.

I highly doubt, that the big problem young (or old) people have with the church is the incense and organ music.

@CremeEggsForBreakfast

I am in my late 20s and attend a low-Anglican church with my DH who is in the process of applying to become an ordained CofE minister. We attend a weekly Bible study with other members of the congregation who are a similar age. Another member of this group is also applying for ordination training.

Our congregation has probably over 30 children under 12yrs but not everyone is there every week. Parents tend to be over 30.

There's also a growing youth group (secondary school age) headed by a small team between the ages of 55yrs and 17yrs.

From personal experience, high-Anglican churches and small village churches that strictly follow the liturgy will have an older congregation but evangelical churches and Anglican Churches that are more relaxed in their services will have a wider age-span.

@CremeEggsForBreakfast - that's interesting - I'm sure one of my cousins is or was training to be a CofE minister too.

But they're Scottish and unsure if they followed some sort of Scottish church.

My elder cousin (their DF) was headmaster of Christian boarding school Hebron in Ooty, India, a few years ago.

Christianity is in an utter death spiral in this country and has been for decades. The only reason little children are there are because the parents need the vicar to sign a form to get them into their local church school which has attendance rules.

I'm sure it's possible to be Christian without going to church every week.

DSIL & BIL are mid-twenties and go to church. They changed churches last year and went to several while looking for one which felt right and they said most of them had quite large numbers of younger members. Small city in SW.

@EdithRea

Christianity is in an utter death spiral in this country and has been for decades. The only reason little children are there are because the parents need the vicar to sign a form to get them into their local church school which has attendance rules.

Wow. Talk about looking at one circumstance and taking a massive leap to pretend that is the case for everyone

I know a couple but they are Jehovah’s Witnesses and were raised that why by parents. They are completely and utterly brainwashed and will preach robotically to you.

I get sad whenever I see them.

@Chocolattay

I know a couple but they are Jehovah’s Witnesses and were raised that why by parents. They are completely and utterly brainwashed and will preach robotically to you.

I get sad whenever I see them.

JW are not Christian

@EdithRea

Christianity is in an utter death spiral in this country and has been for decades. The only reason little children are there are because the parents need the vicar to sign a form to get them into their local church school which has attendance rules.

Tell me you have never been to a church without telling me you've never been to a church.....

@CraftyGin

They identify as Christians. The whole basis of their religion is to imitate Christ to a T.

[quote Chocolattay]@CraftyGin

They identify as Christians. The whole basis of their religion is to imitate Christ to a T.[/quote]
No JW is something different

@MasterBeth

The anti-abortion Salvation Army?

The Salvation Army that campaigned against equal marriage?

The Salvation Army that doesn't even have a policy position on LGBT issues?

Whatever they think, the Salvation Army are involved in a lot of worthy causes and do a lot for marginalised groups. Do you think homeless people are bothered about their core beliefs if they are cold, starving etc

[quote Chocolattay]@CraftyGin

They identify as Christians. The whole basis of their religion is to imitate Christ to a T.[/quote]
They can say whatever they like, but they are not orthodox Christians.

@EdithRea

Christianity is in an utter death spiral in this country and has been for decades. The only reason little children are there are because the parents need the vicar to sign a form to get them into their local church school which has attendance rules.

This is simply not true. You might be able to argue a case for it with the established churches - though I'd still contend against it there - but the non denominational churches are in growth rather than decline and even more so since lockdown with many churches offering different ways of doing church, online and off. In London, there are now more churches than ever before. It's hidden growth, to an extent, because the thing that always gets reported is the established church numbers

@Thebestwaytoscareatory

It’s an interesting post. What’s your view on a “perennial philosophy” certain religions and Gods are manifestations of this based on cultures separated by time and space? Therefore one Source?

It raises the same questions as I posed earlier really. If there is but one source then that means either none of the current religions are true and thus no one is following God's will correctly, or one religion is true and all others are false/wrong. Which brings me back to the question "how do you know you're following the right religion?" You don't, you just have faith it is, and having faith means you're accepting something without proof.

Many don’t believe in a personal God as you describe. Many do believe in this as being Nothing or No-thing.

I would argue that if you don't believe in the God that Christianity, Judaism, Islam, etc describes in their scriptures then you're not really a Christian, Jew, Muslim, etc. It's like saying I'm vegetarian but don't believe that chickens are animals so it's I'll eat them.

Most who do shape their lives around religion would most likely say they are not basing their lives on “nothing” you are confusing quantifiable data with existence.

I perhaps phrased that wrong. By nothing I mean no proof. Making a life choice based on an unknowable and unprovable assumption is not something we should aspire too and it is certainly not something that should be welcomed. Take homesexuality as an example. If I were to say I'm opposed to homosexuality because homosexuals are actually aliens sent here to subvert the human race I'd quite rightly be regarded as a lunatic and shunned. Yet we're supposed to accept the argument of "it goes against God's will" as a valid reason to marginalise and mistreat whole sections of society.

Maybe there is a symbiotic relationship between the divine and mankind? “God is dead [because] we have killed Him” maybe the human race is also on course for distinction. Or more likely we will create another God/gods to fulfil a basic human need that has existed throughout history. What makes us so special that out of nearly all of human existence we suddenly see the right way to view the world? Surely this is no better argument than the old one about which god?

I'm sorry but I am unclear on what you are trying to say here? That god(s) are a creation of mankind? Then yes, we agree I also think that God(s) and religion stem from our need as a species to know and our need to control.

But ultimately why would anyone want to change some one else’s mind? How about simple acceptance of different perspectives-evangelical thought processes exist outside of religion.

Why indeed? Why do religions seek to preach and convert? Why should I have to be accepting of their views if they're not accepting of mine? You also have to consider that many aspects of religion, like the aforementioned views on homosexuality as well as those on sex education, womens rights, etc, are damaging to society and should not be accepted or tolerated.

Thanks for your thoughtful response, re Perennial Philosophy I think the point is that all religions contain truth. Each religion of course has a “wrapper” for want of a better word to make it appropriate to the prevailing culture. There is no right or wrong religion in that context they are equally true.

Re believing in a personal God, I guess it depends on which strand of those belief systems you follow. Eg Christianity do you believe in the description in the Nicene creed? Or what we now collectively refer to as Gnostic Christian’s with their Dualistic beliefs and largely spiritual perception of Christ. Are we to interpret Elohim (the creator) as a masculine feminine pleural creator as the word suggests or apply other interpretations because surrounding wording suggests a single entity.

Interestingly I asked a question up thread about some of the more controversial aspects of Christian scripture when someone stated the church was trying to move with the times. I’m surely scripture was scripture? Apparently not, well actually on viewing one of the suggested videos it appeared that they were focusing more on the single commandment of the New Testament rather than largely Old Testament rules ( maybe they’re catching up with the Gnostics😂)

Re a symbiotic relationship, sorry if I didn’t explain this very well. This is largely predicated on the understanding that man is divine, he is capable of creating God at the same time God can create man, Gods need man to worship a bit like the Norse Gods golden apples. Man needs God for spiritual sustenance.

Why do we need God and why does God need man? God needs man to experience, to experience something outside itself if God just remains as everything/nothing there is no possibility of experiencing anything. Man needs God to experience outside of time space.

Imagination (of Coleridge’s poetic rather than primary or secondary kind) is of course key to this connection and creation.

Re changing peoples minds, I think this goes all ways, I really haven’t got a lot of time for people being evangelical on anything, I’m all for respect, questioning, understanding and freedom.

My personal belief system doesn’t really include religion (for many reasons) but that’s my belief, others think differently I don’t know their system is wrong or right, that’s not for me to decide, I can only decide if it’s right for me.

@Youally

The fact there are people who believe in god blows my mind!

I wonder if this may be because your idea of God is not actually what they believe.

I'm not sure but if you're picturing a beardy man on a cloud then yes, it would be mind blowing if many people believed in that.

But most people who have belief in God have a far more nuanced and sophisticated understanding of what it is to experience and have a relationship with the divine (including belief in the inner 'divine' with no belief in an external or interventionist God at all - those types might still use the word God').

DS1 is a devout Christian and has a handful of young friends at his church which is High Anglican. Our next door neighbours attend a very modern happy-clappy style church and the children who attend that seem to stay on during their teen years and twenties as it is very socially active too. So I know a fair few Christian teens.

EdithRea
Christianity is in an utter death spiral in this country and has been for decades. The only reason little children are there are because the parents need the vicar to sign a form to get them into their local church school which has attendance rules

We have a thriving church without this type of school in the local area. Our primary CofE schools don’t require church attendance to attend and the secondaries are non denominational.

It’s a modern, progressive, open church with a very diverse congregation. I think that makes the difference.

Just want to thank OMG12 and thebestwaytoscareatory for easily the most thoughtful and nuanced conversation I've read on here today!

My niece is. She is 21 and very active in her student christian union.

A few religious young families dotted around where I live. Not many. Loads of my friends go to the church play groups but I don't think that more than 5% go to the Sunday services, probably less.

@amusedbush

I'm 31 and an atheist, raised by atheist parents. There were a couple of religious people at my school but they very much in the minority and I have never had any religious friends at all. Someone I know through work (who is 26) mentioned church recently and I was surprised because I so rarely hear anyone my age talk about it.

It tends to be wayyyy more common in the US - a lot of the American people I follow on social media seem to be Christian by default, like it's just what people do there.

I will admit to being a bit judgemental about it, though, however that sounds. Obviously I would never, ever say anything to someone's face but I feel a bit when anyone admits to being religious. I'm so far removed from it though, it's just not my scene!

Yes, I agree with this.