re my reaction to a rottweiler dog ? Or would you be the same ?

[chankins]

Not sure if I over reacted today or not, but was at the beach with my three dc, my sister and her three dc, and my mum and her jack russel dog. All was fine until we saw approaching a large rottweiler off the lead, with a young couple and their toddler in a buggy close behind. TBH we said amongst ourselves why do people with little kids have dogs like that ? but then proceeded to pass without comment.
However then another large dog bounded up and started hassling the rottweiler, who didn't like it and started racing around, growling and snapping at the other dog. This ended up bascially on top of my mum and her little dog, and three of the children. (The other three were in buggies.) Neither owner had any control of their dog and they ignored the owners calling them away. I kept calling my dd1 (5) away from the scene as I was worried a fight would break out and she and her cousins would be caught in the middle. In the end I walked over, grabbed her arm and pulled her over to me and the buggies, and her cousins followed. I said to her ' come away from all those dogs'. The girl then got very shirty and offended and made comments about the rottweiler obviously not biting anyone. This was at the same time she shouted at her toddler to shut up as he was crying. We ignored and walked away. But honestly, why do people with small kids own such powerful dogs, and then can't even control them ?

The dog threads always seem to end up on "dangerous bastards, should be banned" and "it's the training, not the animal, my slavering great wolf is lovely". Perhaps we should have an Agree to Disagree section for discussions like dogs and private schools.

That said, I used to walk a friend's boxer now and again (always on a lead). It was perfectly trained, but whenever somebody walked past I would tell it to sit and we would wait until they had walked past. I knew it was trained but they didn't, so it was only polite to reassure any passer-by that it was under full control.

wikipedia is full of inconsistencies - that's a fact

a few things yes, a dog is not showing an aggresive nature by barking at the fence when people walk by, most dogs do this. My Jack Russel does this. My first rotweiller used to throw himself at the fence barking and snarling when people walked past. He would head butt the door when the bell rang - i would often find my visitors standing out on the street. Neither of these dogs were aggresive in ANY way. My 2nd rotweiller through no fault of his own, did have aggression issues, he NEVER barked at the fence, or barked when the door rang. But he WOULD bite you if you tried to get in my house uninvited.

I do agree that the rotweiller is a dangerous dog and i would be very wary about having one around small children who's faces are dog height, i just don't think they are naturally aggresive. In fact, most responsible breeders will only breed from dogs with a known stable temprement. It is the back yard breeders that have a problem. My rotweillers were HUGE, even for the breed and the times i would get idiots approaching me with "corr he's a big one, my mate has got a bitch/i have got a bitch, do you want to mate them" to which i would reply, no thankyou, he is castrated.

I am not saying that the wikipedia artical is wrong per se, as it is reporting "facts" however, it does seem to have to have trawled for them, and it is somewhat biased.

Rotweillers are also used in Germany as GUIDE DOGS! The french police use them as they are generally more hardy and self assured than GSDs.

It is irresponsible ownership that makes this a dangerous breed of dog. The only dangerous thing my Tiny would do is screwdriver people into the sofa - he would push his head into your tummy and wriggle around like a mad thing, usually squashing the breath out of anyone He was a star, and a brilliant sled dog for my DD1 in the snow.

I know i go on, but i do feel so very strongly about this breed of dog. Yes, they are lovely, but i still think they should be banned, or at least ownership regulated.

Coby, i love newfies too - although i dont think they would look right on the end of a chavs lead

LEM - I don't understand - you think they are wonderful dogs but think they should be banned!!?? I can't believe someone as rational as you can actually say that in the same post as reporting their usefulness in society as guide dogs and police dogs - it doesn't make sense.

I think all owners of dogs, whatever the breeds, should need to be registered and controlled to be honest - a labrador/ JRT and even a chihuahua can do a fair amount of damage to someone if trained to as well - as you say it's the owners that need controlling!

Message withdrawn

Wisteria, the reason i support a ban is simply because they are the dog of choice of the lesser spotted thug at the moment, and this is resulting in bad breeding, bad ownership and it is a time bomb waiting to go off. I certainly would not support a ban in the form that happened with the pit bull terrier. This resulted in a lot of distress for many responsible dog owners.

Rotties will always be my favourite breed of dog, but the breed is suffering at moment.

Thankyou for describing me as rational, that would be a first .

Ideally, some sort of registration scheme would weedle out incapable owners but i cannot see how that could be succesfully implemented. I definately think the dog license should return, and that owners should have to demonstrate a capability at least to be able to care for, and control their dogs. The kennel club do a good citizen scheme, which is a bit patronising in some respects, but this as an essential to owning dogs would be a start. So, whilst i would hate to see a ban and rather see something along these lines, i just dont think that it is likely to happen.

It is more for the protection of the dogs themself that i would support restriction, so whilst my argument may seem a little paradoxical (is that the right word?) and contradictory, that is how i feel.

Haven't read the whole thread but I believe ALL dogs owners should have to prove they are capable of looking after an animal, pity we couldnt do the same for children.

LEM - yes I see what you mean but banning them would just make them even more of a choice (like the pit bulls), people like that don't generally care whether what they're doing is legal or not do they?

Not to mention the fact that if they could no longer get hold of Rotties they would just train another 'different' breed to attack - like an alsatian or a collie and then we'd be in the same position.

The only way to do it is, as you say through a registration scheme (which the lesser minded thug would probably also avoid)!

i agree VS!

that is very true wisteria, i concur that one Especially about the thugs moving on to the next breed - lol, we could find ourself in a situation with a burberry clad skin head will be strutting down the road with a chihuahua in a studded collar Interestingly, i used to own a chihuahua too, he lived with my parents, he DID have a studded collar and i used to walk him with my rottie

LOL - You see I would happily ban chihuahuas - nasty little yappy things

my uncle used to have a chihuhua that would terrify grown men! complete little bastard

To be totaly honest the breed I have found through personal experience to be the most viscious is the jack russell.
I used to have the most adorabley soppy staffordshire bull terrier, my xMIL had two of them that would guard her grandchildren and inform us if the babies cried, xBIL also had two staffs and every one of them was trained well and treated well, although I would never leave a baby with any dog unattended I felt truly safe with all of those dogs, my nans JR and my mums however were horrible little things that would 'snap'.

My gorgeous lab is petrified of them, which always amuses me greatly, since she will quite happily go up the the Alsatian we meet on one of our walks, tail wagging etc despite the fact he is snarling and gnashing his teeth at her

A friend brought one round, horrid little thing, in clothes etc , put it on the floor, it barked yapped at Sacha who hot footed it to the top of the garden with her tail between her legs

I totally agree VS, they're the only things that have ever bitten me but I wouldn't see them banned or decide they're all nasty as people seem to do with the bigger dogs - in fact I don't think I have ever met a really nice JRT, am sure they exist though

I've got a lovely adorable sweet natured but well trained JRT - I agree they are known to be snappy but not if you put the time and effort needed to train them properly. I have a lab too - she loves the JRT and it is a pleasure to watch them play.

Thats the big issue though I think, well trained, as a breed they tend to be snappy so anyone who has one needs to really put effort into them, whereas many people will get them as dogs that need 'less attention' because they are small, causing the breed to get a bad name.

VS - i used to hate JRs until i got to know them working at the vets, now i have one. I know exactly what you mean though, as they are small people tend to be lazy about training, i know i am . Luckily mine is a little star and fits in perfectly with our family. I think they have great personality and are really robust little dogs. However, i agree that they can indeed be snappy little shits and it would always be when i saw one of those sitting protectively on its elderly owners lap that my heart would sink a vet nurse.

my heart would sink, as a vet nurse

When we first got our JRT she was just 10wks old - she'd been seen being thrown out of the boot of a car at 6wks. She spent those 4 wks in between in kennels at a rescue centre. Fortunately being just 10wks old we had her at an early age so easy to adapt to our way of living and she proved to be a very receptive dog with training.

She is such a happy little dog. She adores other dogs and doesn't bark - mainly due to her wearing a halti collar which she wears primarily to stop her pulling on the lead.

I started socialising her with other dogs immediately - the same day we brought her home - we have another dog so she had no choice but to 'get on'. I walk her to and from school everyday so has got used to other dogs, traffic, and lots of children.

I am also quite firm with her at home - she still has her crate which she sleeps in, eats in and has her toys in - she goes in there quite a lot during the day and we have told the kids to leave her alone when she is in her crate because it is her way of telling us she wants some peace.

I'm no expert, I'm no vet or dog behaviourist but what I have gained over the 12yrs of owning my own dogs is that all dogs can be lovely given the time and attention they need from their owners.

You only have to watch 'Dog Borstal' on tv whereby the majority of those dogs who come to them are badly behaved simply because they have had little/no training and the guys on there quite often say they have to train the owners first!

great post whispy, i think you have it bang on there with your little dog mine is a spoilt wee thing, and im a bit crap about walking him, but he is a little star. We have been very lucky with all our dogs. Our second rottie was our first rescue and was very hard work, i didnt do any formal training with him as it really didnt suit him, i dread to think what had happened to him as a pup - we had to leave the room when he was eating as he would gaurd his food so aggresively. No technique apart from time for him to trust us, and us to learn to trust him (he was in the car twice ready to go back in the first six months after sinking his teeth in my arm, and head!). Im so glad we had him, it was sad the way things ended up, with him getting sick, but at least he was with us til the end. I really miss having a big dog around, but know we have made the right decision getting our little terroist

Hi lucyellen - Having said all that...training Millie (my JRT) was a hard job...whilst JRTs are, imo, quite clever little dogs it did take plenty of effort (on my part) to get her to the way she is now. She is an excellent house dog. A really lovely family pet. She plays non-stop with the kids and absolutely adores my other dog.

Unfortunately JRT's do have the reputation to be snappy/yappy but then again all dogs seem to carry labels for their bad points and not for their good points!

What has impressed me no end with my little dog is that he takes no end of stick from DD, she smothers him with kisses, can be a little ott, so i dont leave them together obviously, he clearly doesnt mind as he plays with her non stop, i think to myself, just get up and walk away dog, but he comes back for more, over and over, he loves it - sucker

As for formal training, um, im crap, my rotties became very obedient and always did as they were told, Bob has selective deafness. He has sooo much energy, and lots of love - hes my boy