Trying to find legal status of a sports club

[tripodd]

My DC's have been a member of a local sports club for several years. It is run by a committee and has an AGM each year where they present accounts, but they don't seem to be registered with either Companies House or the Charity Commission. If I want to find out their status (to help me resolve a potential issue) is there somewhere else to look? They are recognised by the sport's national governing body as a club, so presumably they have some sort of valid constitutional status.

as stated above, he is 18, so not a 'child'

And yet you're treating him like one. If he doesn't want the position then he doesn't have to take it. How much are they offering him as minimum wage for an 18 year old is currently £6.56.

Would your DS be happy if they withdrew the offer because mummy got involved?

The only people overthinking it are those offering opinions that haven't been asked for (but hey, its aibu, so I know it goes with the territory). But again, thanks to those others who have helped answer my questions.

He's an 18 year old with his whole future ahead of him and already has another casual job that pays twice as much, so he doesn't 'need' this. There are benefits to him of taking it, and he will enjoy it, but he also needs to learn about employment law and how to keep the right side of HMRC. A morally dubious steer from me to "take cash in hand" would set him on the wrong path for the future.

But now I know a few more facts, I think we'll work out a solution.

Minimum wage does not applied to self employed.

At a guess he is a decent volunteer they would like to keep, train up more and they have some money in coffers for coaching so offering an amount to keep him turning up.

What your son needs to clarify if this is expenses or they are classifying him as self employed so he needs to do tax each year.

* A morally dubious steer from me to "take cash in hand" would set him on the wrong path for the future.*

Oh good Lord

So you never ever paid a babysitter cash in you years of parenting. Ever

How vulnerable is your 18 year old
That a steer from you to take this job
Would set him off down a dodgy path
He must be…. Vulnerable? Does he have special needs perhaps?

To answer your original question - The club may not have a legal status at all. An unincorporated association - one that has a management committee and constitution but isn't a registered charity etc. - isn't a legal entity. The constitution may not be published anywhere. The people involved bear responsibility. Your son should seek advice from the governing body they are registered with as a club. They will have standard policies/expectations that the club will have singed up to and should be able to offer advice.

OP we were in exactly this situation a few years ago with DS.

First up, the HMRC would only be interested if this were to have tax implications ie if the role was paying minimum wage would your DS then earn enough from all his jobs to be over the ta-paying threshold? I thinks that's highly unlikely but if it were the case, he can always submit a tax return.

As for your more general concern about whether he's being taken advantage of – well, yes, he probably is. But what it comes down to is whether he wants the 'job' or not. Ime these amateur sports clubs are not going to put themselves in a position of having to offer a set amount, so if your DS insists it should pay NMW they will probably just withdraw the offer completely. In the real world his choice is ultimately likely to be between taking it as offered or turning it down.

[quote tripodd]@Justkeeppedaling as stated above, he is 18, so not a 'child' and has a coaching qualification, dbs, also a first aid certificate. He has lots of volunteering (and playing) experience already.

But actually I'm not after opinions on whether he takes the role - that is up to him - I want him to make sure the role is properly defined, and not breaking HMRC rules, and I also need to decide whether to mention anything (gently) to the club.

Thanks for your help everyone. I will try to work out if some of the full coaches are self employed, but most of them do have 'day jobs', e.g. as teachers.[/quote]

Just drop it. You're being over pedantic, and worse case you'll affect the future of the club, which probably relies heavily on people like your DS doing a bit of informal volunteering for expenses.

You're also being over protective of your adult son, Let him mane his own mind up, and learn a lesson from it if he makes a wrong decision. At 18, I would have been absolutely mortified if my mother demanded a copy of my job description from anyone I was volunteering or working for.
The club will probably refuse to give it to you anyway as DS is an adult.

We all know someone like the Op

Whether at school, work or a sports clubs like this

They regularly take their grievances
They get no where or they spoil it for all
Everyone rolls their eyes or grimaces when they see them approaching

You're so right.

My dad was a qualified assistant coach for a club. It wasn't paid at all.

I guess if he's worried about the financial aspect but wants to be involved, he could do it for free?

As PP suggested, you may want to look at what exactly the nature of the employment is - or if it's volunteering with reasonable expenses paid.

www.gov.uk/employment-status

How much does he earn per year in his other job? If it's over £12.5k he will have to declare his earnings on a self assessment.

@SlipperyLizard

If it is a sports club it may be an “unincorporated association”, which means it has no legal “personality” of its own (so not like a company) and won’t be registered anywhere.

@Ginger153 and @SlipperyLizard - that’s not quite right - charity registration is dependent on whether the organisation’s objectives are charitable under the legal definition of what a charity is, and is required if the income is over £5k a year (although an organisation can choose to register as a charity below that threshold). It’s not dependent on their legal form. Unincorporated organisations which operate under a constitution can be registered charities.

However, I think the legal form of this organisation is a bit of a red herring - given the issue the OP is taking about, it’s much more to do with the jaw around employment/workers/employees vs volunteers, plus what perhaps issues of choice around what the potential volunteer comforts acceptable to do for free /almost free.