Page 3 | Issues with missed private music lessons - AIBU??

sanbeiji · 17/02/2022 09:06

@Clarinet1

I have posted on other threads about similar situations because I am a keen musician with experience of giving private lessons. I would agree with PP who say that you have a verbal contract and that you are paying as much for the teacher’s time as anything else. I was always understanding if an adult pupil had, say, an unexpected work crisis (I didn’t expect them to risk their job or business for a hobby) or if severe weather conditions stopped someone attending at the last minute (? storms Dudley and Eunice) but otherwise I expected 24 hours notice or I charged for missed lessons. Some pupils/parents of pupils seem to think you’re like lesson vending machine not a person with the same 24 hours in the day as anyone else. As a slight aside, I remember one parent who, despite being my worst offender for last-minute cancellations, was the most insistent that her little darling should keep taking exams!

Interesting… and as the OP has given lots of notice , you’d let her off half term without paying? Thé teachers I’ve had were like this, no payment with sufficient notice. But they weren’t ‘just’ music teachers, they also coached for competitions, played at weddings etc. So there was always something else they could be doing… regular pupils happy to be moved around or take the original slot.

If you were ‘just’ a music teacher, nothing more, it could be harder hence the stricter terms

ZenNudist · 17/02/2022 09:09

You have to pay for booked lessons. I try and give my dc music teachers as much notice as possible so they can rearrange and not charge me.

I pay for sports clubs we miss. No option.

IntermittentParps · 17/02/2022 09:14

I'd point out politely that you could have taken two virtual lessons if they had been offered (I'm assuming it's just two, but obviously it's more if you would have been able to attend any online while you had bronchitis too). And that it's not realistic to want you to give half a term's notice for being ill; you don't have a crystal ball.

GabriellaMontez · 17/02/2022 09:17

How could you have online lessons if you were "very unwell"?

Pay the money you owe.

Smileyaxolotl1 · 17/02/2022 09:18

I do think she should have offered online tuition to you though if she was doing it for others.

IntermittentParps · 17/02/2022 09:19

@GabriellaMontez

How could you have online lessons if you were "very unwell"?

Pay the money you owe.

The OP missed two due to being Covid positive; she doesn't say she was actually very unwell, so she may just have not been able to attend because she had to isolate.

GabriellaMontez · 17/02/2022 09:20

@Walkingalot

On the basis that she didn't offer you 'on line' tuition, I'd not pay the full amount, maybe half.

Op says she was "very unwell"

Mummyoflittledragon · 17/02/2022 09:20

If you weren’t told you had to give half a term’s notice, YANBU to not continue to pay. If you want to continue with lessons, you need to pay. I’ve said YABU because you expected her to carry your fee over when she couldn’t fill the space.

GabriellaMontez · 17/02/2022 09:21

You're right the timings aren't exactly clear. But the OP does says she was "very unwell".

TeenTitan007 · 17/02/2022 09:48

You owe her for the booked/missed lessons but the notice is negotiable.

IntermittentParps · 17/02/2022 09:52

@GabriellaMontez

You're right the timings aren't exactly clear. But the OP does says she was "very unwell".

The OP says 'I contracted COVID at the start of the new term. I had to cancel my lessons whilst I was testing positive (2 in total). I then developed bronchitis and was very unwell.' This seems to suggest that she had to cancel two for Covid and then cancel further ones because of being very unwell with bronchitis. I find it hard to read it as though she is saying she was 'very unwell' with Covid.

NeedAHoliday2021 · 17/02/2022 09:59

If you cancel then you pay. That’s standard with music teachers. I’ve never had a written contract either. It’s the same with ballet. Terms and conditions are published and by paying you’re agreeing to those terms.

arethereanyleftatall · 17/02/2022 10:25

@BuanoKubiamVej

Yabu

This work is her income. If she is keeping Tuesdays at 4pm for you, she can't take on a different pupil in that slot, so there's nothing different she can do at 4pm on a Tuesday if you don't show up. The half term's notice is also reasonable, it gives her a chance to recruit a new pupil fir the slot.

All teachers of music and instruments like this will consider someone like you, who doesn't respect their time and expects them to take the financial hit whenever your own convenience requires it, to be a nightmare. They won't want you as a pupil. By all means refuse to pay if you wish, pp are right that without a written contract it's unlikely that she would be able to force it through the small claims court. But these teachers talk to each other, and you'll soon find that no one will accept you as a pupil without a tightly written contract requiring that you pay up when your own availability is unreliable.

Absolutely this. I run a swim school. I'm popular (this is relevant!). If anyone tries to get money back when they miss a lesson, and especially if they kick off, I have an ongoing 'banned' list. Next time they try to book on they get an 'I'm ever so sorry, I'm fully booked. I'll pop you on the waiting list' message'. And delete their message.

lanthanum · 17/02/2022 10:28

It's not like a hairdressing a ppointment, where there's a fair chance they can fill the cancelled slot.

It can be tough making a living doing any sort of tuition that is largely done out of school/work hours. There are a limited number of hours you can use, especially if you want to keep any time to see your own family. That often means you need all your slots to be full.

sanbeiji · 17/02/2022 10:41

@lanthanum

It's not like a hairdressing a ppointment, where there's a fair chance they can fill the cancelled slot.

It can be tough making a living doing any sort of tuition that is largely done out of school/work hours. There are a limited number of hours you can use, especially if you want to keep any time to see your own family. That often means you need all your slots to be full.

It’s similar with driving instructors… even harder actually as they have locations constraints. They still manage IMO fair enough for people to set their terms. But said terms should be clear …

Hankunamatata · 17/02/2022 10:50

Yabu. My kids have various lessons. Often pay a term upfront and yes I had to pay when they had covid and were isolating.

Hankunamatata · 17/02/2022 10:53

Yes you owe her the money for january term

Newnamefor2022 · 17/02/2022 11:00

You should pay her. She should offer you virtual lessons if she is offering them to others though.

INeedNewShoes · 17/02/2022 11:06

If I were your teacher I would offer to make up some of your missed lessons at a later date (by you having two lessons a week).

However, if you want your space reserved but don’t want to pay for it, that seems as though you just think the teacher should be left out of pocket entirely.

I do have my pupils on standing orders to protect my income from absences. However I do have the system set out clearly in my terms and conditions so that pupils know what they are signing up for. If anyone makes any negative noises at the outset about the system I don’t take them on.

LindaEllen · 17/02/2022 11:12

@EmbarrassedAllOver

YABU.

The reason you're not receiving the lessons is because YOU can't make them.

She is saving your timeslot so she needs paying. If you want to release it, ie not go back, let her know and pay the notice period.

She's been sloppy not to provide a contract though so legally you don't suppose you need to pay.

I'm a member of a gym. If I stop going I still need to pay until the 12 months is up, after which time I need to give 3 month's notice. It's pretty common place to pay a notice fee.

This.

Everyone who is saying otherwise has clearly never been self employed and had to suffer flaky clients.

IntermittentParps · 17/02/2022 11:16

Everyone who is saying otherwise has clearly never been self employed and had to suffer flaky clients.
I am and I do. I manage my money and cashflow so that when schedules and timings go tits-up I have a buffer.

Lou98 · 17/02/2022 11:20

I think YABVU.

You missed lessons, of course you should still pay.
If she had cancelled them then that would be different but she held the slot for you so each time you didn't make it she would be missing out on that money.

This is her job, it's how she makes a living, if multiple people do this she may be in a position where she can't pay her bills.

It's a different business but I'm a dog groomer but the amount of people that make appointments then decide not to show up/run extremely late/cancel last minute - we lose so much money, we're not doing the job for fun, we have mouths to feed and bills to pay. It's extremely selfish and entitled to book something and then think you don't need to pay.

She most likely didn't offer virtual lessons because you were off actually unwell (you had covid then bronchitis and said you were very unwell) - that's different to offering virtual lessons because people weren't allowed to leave the house even when they were well. She was trying to still make some sort of living through the pandemic

buddylicious · 17/02/2022 11:21

Surely it's not her fault.

You're the one who hasn't turned up for the lessons. Why should she lose out?

Sugarfreebaker · 17/02/2022 11:34

@Marvololo

Hello all,

I started having private music lessons last September and the teacher said I'd have to pay a half term upfront. I didn't sign a contract and no written terms and conditions were provided. I didn't have an issue with paying half a term upfront and I had to miss a couple of lessons due to my work commitments. However, on January, I contracted COVID at the start of the new term. I had to cancel my lessons whilst I was testing positive (2 in total). I then developed bronchitis and was very unwell. I asked the teacher if I could pause my lessons and start after the February half term because I needed time to recover. The teacher said I have to give half a term's notice to stop lessons so I owe her for all the lessons for this half term. I've also discovered that the teacher has been offering virtual lessons during the pandemic, however this was never offered to me when I couldn't attend.
I've had experience with a music teacher charging a late cancellation fee but I've never had such onerous terms as this. I don't feel it's right to be paying for half a term's lessons that I've not even received, especially with no written contract. In any event, I feel that the relationship with the teacher has broken down and I'm now receiving "robust" messages and emails demanding payment.
Am I being unreas

TIA

I voted YANBU , I understand why your music teacher would have wanted you to cancel in advance. I’ve been self employed and did 1:1 EFL tutoring myself so I know what the hustle is like and try and be respectable of everyone’s time.

However, the issue is if she did not tell you either verbally or in writing of these terms - they are basically unreasonable and unenforceable. You cannot just assume someone knows what is or isn’t standard practice. She’s a professional running a business, she could have easily sent you an email stating her key terms. How difficult is it to have a pre-prepared standard message you send to all new students making them aware of your terms?

There may or may not be an argument for a moral obligation to pay up, but IMO there is certainly no legal requirement to. Hopefully she will learn from this and outline her terms in writing. There is such a thing as a verbal contract, but it’s harder to prove. So for the benefit of all parties she needs to have it down in writing.

Jamnation · 17/02/2022 11:50

@TeenTitan007

You owe her for the booked/missed lessons but the notice is negotiable.

This. I think you're annoying her by trying to get money back for the lessons you were ill. Accept that you owe her for these, negotiate on the notice which was not made clear. I think a couple of weeks' notice may be fair but a whole half term does sound a lot, given you've already paid for 3 missed lessons.

Personally I would hold her to her side of the notice too, and turn up for the remaining lessons! Even if it's a bit uncomfortable.