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Original poster

To think This Is Going To Hurt is awful to women?

390 replies

justanoldhack · 13/02/2022 13:39

Watching the show and can't help but shake a really uncomfortable feeling that its writer just...really doesn't like women.

I get that doctors are super overstretched, so tired, giving the job everything at the expense of their personal lives. I also get that it's a 'comedy' and not real, although it is based on his true life experiences.

But the way the women are portrayed as silly, a nuisance, stupid, battleaxes, or simply a vessel that 'covers his pubes in blood'... feels so off. These are women at one of the most vulnerable moments in their lives, but they're just props, the butt of the jokes. I can't shake the feeling that Adam Kay really, really doesn't like women. Definitely does not respect them.

Thanks goodness, I guess, that he's not longer practicing medicine. And not surprised either to learn that when he was younger he wrote 'comedy' songs about babies with Down's Syndrome and women from the North.

OP posts:
airbalonz · 14/02/2022 18:46

As I wrote previously I highly doubt extra time and resources and whatever would suddenly change his attitude to care about consent or trauma or women’s experiences.

And of course women can research and have some kind of idea about what they are happy to consent to or not in different scenarios (which is essentially what a birth plan is) is certainly worked for me giving birth in an NHS hospital in a birth that required intervention but I was able to actually feel informed and make choices about my body.

I’d also fail to see how a birth plan allegedly that long wouldn’t take things going wrong into account. Birth plans are PRECISELY about considering that things do go ‘wrong’ in labour and it’s not necessarily going to be straightforward.

If I recall correctly the woman in his story ended up having a ‘woman-centered’ type cesarean birth which made her better about the whole thing (which he obviously sneers at) I have read about more NHS trusts offering this option, including a male obstetrician who admitted he was initially bemused by the idea but that his mind had been completely changed after seeing them in practice.

airbalonz · 14/02/2022 18:55

www.midwifery.org.uk/blog/this-is-going-to-hurt-and-it-certainly-does/

Another good piece

Particularly this bit-

Was Adam unaware of the numbers of women who have suffered from sexual abuse in their lifetime before setting foot into his do-whatever-you-need-to-do-and-eyeroll-at-anyone-who-thinks-otherwise workplace? Did he consider some may be rape victims? The statistics might make him rethink his cavalier attitude to breaking and entering women at will, without much pause for such things as consent?

Blossomtoes · 14/02/2022 18:58

So right @Ionlydomassiveones. I can assure anyone here that when your baby’s being given CPR and you can hear your blood splashing on the floor, the last thing on your mind is your birth plan. You’d consent to anything that would get you out alive.

twominutesmore · 14/02/2022 19:02

"But his book illuminated clearly, page by page, why the NHS hasn’t got the capacity for this introspection. Especially in life and death crisis moments."

Heartbreaking to see him desperately trying to secure psychiatric support for one of his patients. While he was busy elsewhere, she left. Just as he was asking the psychiatrist what could be done next, just as she was telling him 'nothing' because genital mutilation wasn't life or death, he was paged - one of three pagers he was responding to - and that was that, no time to reflect or follow up or anything really.

If poking fun at an 11 page laminated birth plan raises awareness of such issues, if an element of brevity means more people read his book, then so be it.

rifling · 14/02/2022 19:11

But his book illuminated clearly, page by page, why the NHS hasn’t got the capacity for this introspection. Especially in life and death crisis moments. Ultimately, as a doctor his priority is getting mother and child through the birth alive and well. If there is something going wrong medically, he’s not going to sit on his arse analysing the birth plan for deep meaningfuls. He’s going to get the crash team in and dump the laminate in the bin. Please get real.
There are plenty of doctors who manage not to insult women and also save lives. It's not an either/or. I also know women who have ptsd from how they were treated in labour. It really doesn't help to be told that "at least you and the baby are alive" and that excuses everything else.

rifling · 14/02/2022 19:12

And as for "introspection" presumably he wasn't actually writing the book on the ward. He was pondering his words, his actions and decided to poke fun at worried patients.

Blossomtoes · 14/02/2022 19:14

It really doesn't help to be told that "at least you and the baby are alive" and that excuses everything else.

It would have done for me.

rifling · 14/02/2022 19:25

It would have done for me.

I am really sorry to hear that - and of course I am so grateful that ultimately things were not critical for myself or my baby. I think though that we should be aiming higher. Many serious mistakes were made in my treatment, some with far-reaching consequences. It would have meant the world to me if someone had apologized rather than just tell me I should be grateful. (To be clear, the mistakes were absolutely not made in haste in a crisis they were due to bad practice, poor communication and a bone-headed refusal to listen to patients).

twominutesmore · 14/02/2022 19:44

@rifling

And as for "introspection" presumably he wasn't actually writing the book on the ward. He was pondering his words, his actions and decided to poke fun at worried patients.
I see it as telling some funny anecdotes about his life as a doctor.

In amongst an absolute sea of serious, harrowing stuff.

I realise not everyone agrees but I do wonder whether he would have raised awareness as he has, to a wide audience, if it had been an entirely serious expose.

Coffeeonmytoffee · 14/02/2022 19:50

Yes! I stopped watching.

IamMala · 15/02/2022 09:20

I absolutely hated the book! NO way would I watch the show. Entitled nasty little bastard. "Nobody at the NHS gave me support" - but he went on "supporting" a suicidal acquaintance on the phone - without any training or understanding. It could have ended terribly. And the failures he describes, if IRC, were totally due to his arrogance and reluctance to follow rules. I feel sorry for any woman who had anything to do with him in hospital. He was even making fun of his colleagues' spelling but the book itself had at least one spelling mistake (Caesarean section - but of course it might be the fault of the stupid woman copy editor, innit, Adam?). I would love to hear what the midwives who had the misfortune to work with him say about him.

Sweetpeasaremadeforbees · 15/02/2022 09:52

I hated the book so haven't watched the programme.

I guess the important thing (for me) is would his book put women off seeking help for gynae issues? Well yes it would put me off.

For years people on here have said don't worry about smears or intimate exams because HCPs have seen it all, don't judge etc. But apparently some do!

Blossomtoes · 15/02/2022 10:59

@Sweetpeasaremadeforbees

I hated the book so haven't watched the programme.

I guess the important thing (for me) is would his book put women off seeking help for gynae issues? Well yes it would put me off.

For years people on here have said don't worry about smears or intimate exams because HCPs have seen it all, don't judge etc. But apparently some do!

Why would it put you off? It’s always been possible to request a woman HCP for intimate stuff. I have for my entire life and it’s never been questioned.
Sweetpeasaremadeforbees · 15/02/2022 11:19

My understanding is that you can request to see a woman but if there isn't one available you'll have to wait for treatment. Which would probably be seen by some HCPs like AK as the issue not being urgent if you were 'willing' to wait. I think for issues to do with gynae women should automatically be asked whether or not they would prefer to see a female HCP rather than the woman having to ask.

RedRobyn2021 · 15/02/2022 11:31

I agree with you op

He is not a good person, if I ever met him IRL I think I would struggle to remain polite

I've actually complained to the BBC about this program, it's really awful especially considering everything women have been through during the pandemic

Thymeout · 15/02/2022 13:40

@RedRobyn2021

I agree with you op

He is not a good person, if I ever met him IRL I think I would struggle to remain polite

I've actually complained to the BBC about this program, it's really awful especially considering everything women have been through during the pandemic

This is exactly what I mean. especially considering everything women have been through during the pandemic

Women? What about other categories? e.g. the elderly, children in dysfunctional homes, cancer, cardiac and MH patients? Suffering during the pandemic was unisex. What's so special about women per se?

I'm of the generation who did the heavy lifting for you lot during the 60s and 70s. Why this pursuit of victimhood? The determination to see being a woman as a disadvantage needing special treatment, legislation, allowances to be made for our hormones - turning the clock back by years and years?

As for Adam Kay, here's a suggestion. Take off your blinkers and see how he treats men in the series. Take note of his care for the elderly woman with vulval cancer. And what about his ghastly mother? She's barely mentioned in criticism of the series. Or does she get a free pass cos she is female?

Ilovemycat13 · 15/02/2022 14:09

@IamMala

I absolutely hated the book! NO way would I watch the show. Entitled nasty little bastard. "Nobody at the NHS gave me support" - but he went on "supporting" a suicidal acquaintance on the phone - without any training or understanding. It could have ended terribly. And the failures he describes, if IRC, were totally due to his arrogance and reluctance to follow rules. I feel sorry for any woman who had anything to do with him in hospital. He was even making fun of his colleagues' spelling but the book itself had at least one spelling mistake (Caesarean section - but of course it might be the fault of the stupid woman copy editor, innit, Adam?). I would love to hear what the midwives who had the misfortune to work with him say about him.
But that is spelt correctly…? Unless you’re American
airbalonz · 15/02/2022 14:10

I’m seeing so many midwives on Twitter appalled by it

Blossomtoes · 15/02/2022 14:16

Yes on every point @Thymeout. I’m the same vintage as you and it appalls me to see how all the achievements of feminism are being undone.

Hertsgirl10 · 15/02/2022 14:21

@Thymeout

Totally agree.
But we live in a ‘Im a victim’ generation where people can’t watch a tv program with out, not only complaining but sending links to places like this to encourage more complaints.

IamMala · 15/02/2022 15:00

@airbalonz

I’m seeing so many midwives on Twitter appalled by it
You are right, I actually went and checked - my mistake Blush. He's still a horrid little shit though as far as I am concerned
IamMala · 15/02/2022 15:02

ooops quote fail in addition to spelling fail! this was meant for @Ilovemycat13

Weirdwonders · 15/02/2022 15:32

I really liked it. It really stuck in our heads. It left us thinking about how traumatic it would be for that to be your job. Obviously (obviously?) it makes sense that you become desensitised to it. How else would you cope? I’m glad other people do that job. I don’t care if they’re not perfect humans thinking perfect thoughts all the time. I don’t want my tv viewing censored because people hold others to impossible standards. It’s dramatised, the first episode is obviously going to be glib to set up the rest of the series.

Goooglebox · 15/02/2022 15:35

But we live in a ‘Im a victim’ generation

Yes, that's why Kay is being given a few pass to make cheap jokes about how stupid he finds women. It's all fine because he's a victim. Despite being the only party on a pay roll and not pushing a baby out. Still in some strange way a victim so he can say what he likes.

Blossomtoes · 15/02/2022 15:38

@Goooglebox

But we live in a ‘Im a victim’ generation

Yes, that's why Kay is being given a few pass to make cheap jokes about how stupid he finds women. It's all fine because he's a victim. Despite being the only party on a pay roll and not pushing a baby out. Still in some strange way a victim so he can say what he likes.

Except he doesn’t make cheap jokes about how stupid he finds women. 🤷‍♀️