Page 3 | Driving licence expired help!

BuritoCat · 2022-02-10T11:47:24+00:00

Just reliezed my driving licence is 3 years out of bloody date!!! I haven't been driving for two years but that's not the point. I feel so stupid. It's a photo ID card, will I have to pay the £1,000 fine and retake my test? I'm devastated at how stupid I've been! Sat in tears, never received a reminder and it's been shoved in my purse and never needed. [blush][sad] I'm going to the post office this afternoon to get the forms and have my photo done and immediately send it off.

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 10/02/2022 13:50

[quote BuritoCat]@mistermagpie told me I can "legally" drive as I don't turn 70 for another 40 odd years but if stopped by police I might get into trouble for not having it on me, until DVLA confirm they have my application so I'm best waiting. [/quote]
if stopped by police I might get into trouble for not having it on me
Unlike a lot of other countries there is no legal requirement to have your licence "on you" to drive in the UK.

Original poster

BuritoCat · 10/02/2022 13:51

@daimbarsatemydogsbone I did think that! It's not a proper post office to be fair it's in a phone shop so there advice is a bit dodgy but I believe they're correct about the insurance.

OP posts:

Justkeeppedaling · 10/02/2022 13:52

The govt extended the deadline for updating driving licences that expired over the last couple of Covid ridden years. Not sure if that's lifted or not now, but you've reminded me to renew mine as it expired a while ago.

The paper copy is still valid, so you can still drive - I know because I used mine to hire a car a while ago.

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 10/02/2022 13:53

[quote BuritoCat]@daimbarsatemydogsbone I did think that! It's not a proper post office to be fair it's in a phone shop so there advice is a bit dodgy but I believe they're correct about the insurance.[/quote]
They are correct about the insurance - since you have entitlement to drive, your insurance is not affected. The previous poster was just posting bollocks as so often happens on threads like these.

Original poster

BuritoCat · 10/02/2022 13:53

The laws on licences are fairly confusing aren't they? I thought paper parts of licence were expired now and you didn't need it? I lost mine a long time ago.

OP posts:

Original poster

BuritoCat · 10/02/2022 13:53

^ and didn't get a new one when I updated my address.

OP posts:

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 10/02/2022 13:54

@Justkeeppedaling

The govt extended the deadline for updating driving licences that expired over the last couple of Covid ridden years. Not sure if that's lifted or not now, but you've reminded me to renew mine as it expired a while ago.

The paper copy is still valid, so you can still drive - I know because I used mine to hire a car a while ago.

I and millions of others don't have a "paper copy" any more - it's no longer issued and isn't needed.

DobbyTheHouseElk · 10/02/2022 13:54

The paper part doesn’t change, so once you have your license you are ok to drive. The photo must be the only thing which needs updating.

titchy · 10/02/2022 13:54

You're still entitled to drive chill. As long as nothing has changed like a medical condition.

It will take about six months for the new licence to arrive though be warned.

Original poster

BuritoCat · 10/02/2022 13:55

Thank you @daimbarsatemydogsbone I did think that was the case as I'd been pulled over when I drove for the first year!

OP posts:

titchy · 10/02/2022 13:56

@inheritancetrack

Don't drive until it's renewed otherwise you are not insured. I believe they accept it being in the post but as you haven't had an official one for 3 years I would not risk this. I wouldn't say anything. It wasn't deliberate, a fraud and you haven't had an accident, so don't risk a fine. Once you have it it's all ok anyway.

Oh FFS this old chestnut - you are insured and you can drive. (Not having an MOT doesn't invalidate insurance either btw.)

titchy · 10/02/2022 13:57

[quote BuritoCat]@mistermagpie told me I can "legally" drive as I don't turn 70 for another 40 odd years but if stopped by police I might get into trouble for not having it on me, until DVLA confirm they have my application so I'm best waiting. [/quote]
No you won't. There's no requirement to carry a driving licence with you.

Original poster

BuritoCat · 10/02/2022 13:59

So say if I drove and I got a speeding fine and licence still with dvla how does that work? My brain is getting confused. Not likely I would get a speeding fine as I drive like a sloth but still 😂

OP posts:

fairylightsandwaxmelts · 10/02/2022 14:02

You actually may not be insured:

www.lawble.co.uk/driving-licence-expired/

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 10/02/2022 14:07

[quote fairylightsandwaxmelts]You actually may not be insured:

www.lawble.co.uk/driving-licence-expired/[/quote]
Incorrect -

Some insurance providers argue that expiration of the photo invalidates vehicle insurance as the licence is invalid. Again this is untrue as a licence is valid until the DVLA revoke it. Some police forces continue to prosecute on grounds of the license being invalid and some may try to seize the vehicle on grounds of no insurance. If this happens, it is highly recommended you seek legal advice urgently.

lawplainandsimple.com/has-your-driving-licence-really-expired/

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 10/02/2022 14:12

Also this "invalidates your insurance" bollocks is bollocks anyway. In 99.9% of cases if you hold insurance it will pay any valid third party claim as that's the whole point of the provisions of a legal requirement to have insurance.
There really is a lot of bollocks posted about insurance posted on the internet.

Comefromaway · 10/02/2022 14:15

Please do it online as there is a massive backlog with postal DVLA renewals.

fairylightsandwaxmelts · 10/02/2022 14:15

@daimbarsatemydogsbone

But according to the DVLA themselves:

"If your entitlement has expired, you can drive as soon as the DVLA receives your correct and complete application for a new licence as long as you meet the Section 88 criteria. You must only drive vehicles you have applied for on your current application and were entitled to drive on your previous licence."

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/695575/inf188x6-can-i-drive-while-my-application-is-with-dvla.pdf

and here:

"Renewing late won't prompt a fine, but if your licence has expired the DVLA says you shouldn't drive until it has received your completed renewal application"

www.moneysavingexpert.com/travel/renew-driving-licence/

Which says to me that driving on an expired license before you've submitted your renewal is a bit iffy, legally speaking?

Comefromaway · 10/02/2022 14:16

You are however entitled to drive under Section 88 unless your license has actually been revoked. DH and FIL have been driving on Section 88 since last summer.

PheasantsNest · 10/02/2022 15:52

@Comefromaway you can only do that if you have a passport or are over 70. If you don't you have to apply on paper.

SprintingAtlas · 10/02/2022 16:16

@DobbyTheHouseElk

The paper part doesn’t change, so once you have your license you are ok to drive. The photo must be the only thing which needs updating.

The paper part of a licence no longer exists and hasn't for nearly 7 years

www.gov.uk/government/news/driving-licence-changes

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 10/02/2022 17:16

[quote fairylightsandwaxmelts]@daimbarsatemydogsbone

But according to the DVLA themselves:

"If your entitlement has expired, you can drive as soon as the DVLA receives your correct and complete application for a new licence as long as you meet the Section 88 criteria. You must only drive vehicles you have applied for on your current application and were entitled to drive on your previous licence."

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/695575/inf188x6-can-i-drive-while-my-application-is-with-dvla.pdf

and here:

"Renewing late won't prompt a fine, but if your licence has expired the DVLA says you shouldn't drive until it has received your completed renewal application"

www.moneysavingexpert.com/travel/renew-driving-licence/

Which says to me that driving on an expired license before you've submitted your renewal is a bit iffy, legally speaking?[/quote]
As mentioned on the site I linked to - there are actually two different offences. There is a fine of up to £1000 for driving on an expired licence where the 10 year licence hasn't been renewed - that doesn't carry any penalty points. That is section s.99.5 RTA 1988 and has actually applied since before photo licences as it's a catch-all for the information being out of date and includes not telling DVLA you have moved house.
There is a separate offence for driving "not in accordance with licence" S.87.1, which is an offence that carries penalty points.
Of course if you drive with an expired photocard licence you may get the former, but you are not subject to the latter.
The chances of a fine being issued are vanishingly small, but of course DVLA's published advice will be to comply at all times.

Hoghedge10 · 10/02/2022 17:59

Thing is its OK to say as long as DVLA have your application on the system you can still drive (this is what their website says) but the backlog for renewals means you have absolutely no idea if it's on their system yet.

I sent mine off, because I don't have a passport, over 6 weeks ago and not heard anything so I don't know if I'm OK to drive or not tbh.

AnnaSW1 · 10/02/2022 18:10

It's fine. I did the same. I just applied for a new one at the usual cost and no issues.

Bintymcbintface · 10/02/2022 19:15

Just send off for a renewed one now, very unlikely you'll be fined or anything will happen beyond being sent another one. Don't be upset these things happen and those who are fined for expired licenses are usually caught because they've committed some other driving offence such as speeding or driving without insurance and its picked up when they've handed their license over to the police when they've been pulled over