Let's do the math for Kirsty regarding an affordable home

[kirstyalslap]

I'm sure everyone has heard that kirsty Allsopp has came out saying that people can afford homes if they only cut out netflix, the gym and takeaway coffees.

I just worked out a meal deal costs £3 a day. X that by 5 days a week 52 weeks a year is £720. Netflix is £8 for 2 screens (?) so times that by 12 months is £96 a year.
Let's add a £20 takeaway every 2 weeks for good measure. £520. Gym costs £14 a month so £168 a year.

So in one year of cutting back on netflix, lunch for work and takeaways I can save £1504
Wow
Now I need 14000 for a deposit so I'm only 10 years away (probably a little but more actually including fees.)

Right now let's think about increase in property value.
My parents bought their house 8 years ago for £90 thousand. A massive 2 reception with 4 bed and 2 huge gardens with a drive.
Bad condition.
Last year the neighbours sold for £230k
This year the other neighbours has been valued at £280k. My parents are thinking of selling for approx £290k.
So in 8 years their house has increased by £200k
(this hurts me as I started saving 8 years ago, nearly 9 and was looking at saving for a smaller house for about 80k needed 4k at the time and had a 5 year plan to get there. No family helping with deposit)

£90k now would get you nothing at all.
Also you need a 10% deposit.
Also rents back then was £500pcm for 2 bed flat. Now they are £700+pcm for same flat.

So how can we do it? How? Please tell me!

Oh also, everyone I know saving for a house has already cut out take away, meal deals, gym (first to go come on!) and much much more.
Batch cooking, shopping around for deals, having friends round rather than going out.
Every thing is rising in price now, I don't know how my children will afford to live away from us, it is scary because as much as we are okay now, we won't be able to have 3 grown adults living in one bedroom until they are in their 30s! Or will it be 40s or 50s by then?

Well for a start it's Kirstie and not Kirsty.

When I read the slating she was getting online, I thought about my 28 year old niece and her 29 year old boyfriend. Both live in the north-west, both still living at home with their parents, bemoaning how EXPENSIVE property is and how they will never save a deposit.

A three-bed terrace or 2 bed semi where they live costs £200k-£250k.

Niece works (full time) in an office. Her boyfriend is in the Police, also full time, and with shift allowance etc.They probably earn at least £50k between them.

The reason they cannot afford to move out of their respective parents' is their spending choices. Niece refuses to shop in Next/Zara/River Island and instead spends £300 on a pair of jeans from some chichi boutique where the footballer WAGs hang out. A new Michael Kors handbag every 2 months at £200 a pop. Hair done ever 6 weeks for £200. Botox and fillers. £300 trainers etc etc etc. Her partner has an expensive car on a lease agreement, and also runs a motorbike. He is similarly into his expensive branded gear, shirts from Ralph Lauren, Burberry, Ted Baker. Jeans from Armani. For Christmas, she spent about a grand on a Tag Heuer watch for him.

From an outsider's perspective it's so easy to see how they could easily make cutbacks and afford a house. But the "appearance" stuff is more important to them.

I love that Kirstie's advice never says 'get married. You can bet your bottom dollar if she was married to her partner* she'd be all over that one.

*being partners rather than spouses is definitely his choice rather than hers.

BestKnitterInScotland

How does that one example speak for everybody else though? Are you saying all people are like that? Where is the evidence?

Well for a start it's Kirstie and not Kirsty

Kirstie’s memo. There.

Of course there are always examples of profligacy that one can throw in to illustrate a point. However, that doesn’t detract from the point that Kirstie’s advice shows her to be an idiot who really hasn’t got a clue. Why would she, after all.

@SuitcaseOfWhine

BestKnitterInScotland

How does that one example speak for everybody else though? Are you saying all people are like that? Where is the evidence?

Of course not.

But I can easily see how it happens. You start earning, you start spending, get a "taste" for the expensive hairdos every 6 weeks, the pricey boutique clothing. And then trying to dial that down and start shopping at H&M or Primark is going to be a bit of a shock to the system.

@PenguinIce I slightly snickered at that, sadly. The reward is not just a 40 year mortgage, you can then have your home sold to pay for your care home fees- and the way that that is being proposed will disadvantage precisely those in slightly cheaper properties of the type young people are being encouraged to buy as it is dependant on capital bands...

I bought mainly so my kids can decorate their rooms any old how and not have to live with magnolia and a sense of impermanence...

whoever said we should be improving rental stock is correct.

@BestKnitterInScotland Mumsnet seems to know a lot of people with champagne taste and orange juice budgets. I am in my 20s, in London in a City job. I don't know anyone like that. There are lots of free spending people but they (a) tend to have good jobs, (b) tend to come from families who would help them out with the deposit (maybe its wrong for them to expect help; but their parents would probably help them out anyway). In fact a lot of the free spending people already own on account of generous parents (plus have good incomes)! The people on lower incomes and who don't have family help tend to be frugal, but they need to save so much more when others have £100k gifted to them!

@BestKnitterInScotland

Well for a start it's Kirstie and not Kirsty.

When I read the slating she was getting online, I thought about my 28 year old niece and her 29 year old boyfriend. Both live in the north-west, both still living at home with their parents, bemoaning how EXPENSIVE property is and how they will never save a deposit.

A three-bed terrace or 2 bed semi where they live costs £200k-£250k.

Niece works (full time) in an office. Her boyfriend is in the Police, also full time, and with shift allowance etc.They probably earn at least £50k between them.

The reason they cannot afford to move out of their respective parents' is their spending choices. Niece refuses to shop in Next/Zara/River Island and instead spends £300 on a pair of jeans from some chichi boutique where the footballer WAGs hang out. A new Michael Kors handbag every 2 months at £200 a pop. Hair done ever 6 weeks for £200. Botox and fillers. £300 trainers etc etc etc. Her partner has an expensive car on a lease agreement, and also runs a motorbike. He is similarly into his expensive branded gear, shirts from Ralph Lauren, Burberry, Ted Baker. Jeans from Armani. For Christmas, she spent about a grand on a Tag Heuer watch for him.

From an outsider's perspective it's so easy to see how they could easily make cutbacks and afford a house. But the "appearance" stuff is more important to them.

You can't extrapolate your neices spending to an entire generation, especially not the botox and fillers. I know people who spent like that in the 80s and 90s too but that doesn't mean that everyone was.

But I can easily see how it happens. You start earning, you start spending, get a "taste" for the expensive hairdos every 6 weeks, the pricey boutique clothing. And then trying to dial that down and start shopping at H&M or Primark is going to be a bit of a shock to the system.

Actually, the good quality clothing lasts longer so overall, it's not necessarily more cost effective to shop in Primark.

@Comefromaway

We bought our first house in the late 90’s for £20k in a midlands town. I was earning £12.5k a year and Dh was still doing his PGCE.

A similar house in the same street sold last year for £170k. The same job as I had back then pays £18k.

Salaries and house prices haven’t risen in line with each other.

This is the problem, prices have risen much more than wages. You wouldn't get a mortgage on the same house now, as the salary multiple would be too high.

You can save as much as possible, but you can't keep up with house price growth. I couldn't afford to buy the house I live in now, or the one I moved from as the prices have gone up so much. Both houses were bought in the last fifteen years.

@notacooldad

Notacooldad interested to hear about your boys - well done to them! Assume they would have needed a 10% deposit, is that right? So 17k. That's a hell of a lot to save by 25 - was he living at home with you perhaps? I'm not being a dick btw, all power to him - just trying to get my head around it! No Ds1 started work at 16 as an apprentice and did well. He did not want college or university Funny his employer us paying for him to do a degree now. I never thought he would do that! He got loads of overtime, would work away from home and would offer to do call out especially at unpopular times ( Christmas day , bank holidays) He is a saver and put money into different saving schemes. He had a small inherentence when he was about 19 so that went into savings. He lived with us sporadically but I never charged. Similar story with his brother but I'm concerned about him burning himself out as he has a full time jobs and two part time ones and doesn't seem to have much downtime. However that's another story for another time!!

I would say the "no help from me or DH needed" was a bit of an exaggeration then. Living rent-free & bill-free with you and DH, inheriting money and then nicking some furniture and textiles from you and DH is hardly an example of "no help". This thread is actually about those who acquire land without help.

What young people are doing wrong is not having a father who's a Baron contributing to their deposit and not having bought 29 years ago when the average house price was 51K. Like admirable Kirsty

It is incredibly difficult to get on the property ladder these days with prices as they are but I do think expectations are higher. I bought my 1st studio at 24. It was 100% mortgage which was 4 x my salary and the interest rate was over 13%. I lived on beans on toast and worked my butt off but I was young and healthy. It did get easier, thankfully. I'm sure in many parts of the UK it is possible but you do have to cut your cloth. Considering rental costs these days, I would do the same again.

Oh and I left home at 18 so no free housing costs beforehand, just lots of hard work.

I remember when she posted a picture of the contents of her handbag with a smug caption about how she'd replaced all plastic items with non plastic alternatives, travel cup, straws, etc etc. So basically she had THROWN AWAY ALL THE STILL USEABLE PLASTIC items for no reason under the deluded belief she was doing her bit for the environment. The irony of it was apparently lost on her. I realised at that moment she is a bit dim and I've not paid attention to her since.

OP, I hear you! The idea that all people renting are wasteful pi**ed me right off! I never go out, never holiday, never buy new clothes (or anything). All my money goes to rent, bills, essential medicine, savings. I shop in Lidls and never put the heating on, and for the last few years have told people I can no longer buy Xmas or birthday presents until I get on property ladder (and that no one should buy for me). I have a car (old second hand banger) that I need as my parents are getting on and need care, and I live somewhere with rubbish transport (which would frankly with the rising prices cost as much as my car maintenance anyway). Other than that my 'luxuries' are a cheap council run gym membership - £19.99 pcm and £5.99 Netflix. Both essential in my opinion given I work 60+ hours a week and never go out so I need the stress relief of the gym (and I shower there so money saved), and the entertainment of Netflix. She's a clueless trust fund kid, I cannot stand that woman.

Cittigirl given the average age of a first time buyer is now 33, if you would like to have children one day like most generations have enjoyed , what use is a studio?

@cittigirl the problem being 100% mortgages aren't available now and houses cost much more than 4x an average salary.

The problem is that house prices grow quicker than I can save. For example if I took a year to save £5000 for example, houses near me have increased by far more than that.

In my area house prices far out earn me! The house opposite me has sold last summer for 60,000 more than an identical one did the summer before.

You can't extrapolate your neices spending to an entire generation

It was like most things on Mumsnet an ancedotal example of how some young folk prioritise their spending. I recognise elements of this in many of the grads at my company. We take on about 30 each year and it is interesting observing their spending habits. You get the ones who make their own pack lunches, drink instant coffee, drive to work in a £600 old fiesta, rent in a less fashionable cheaper parts of town, forgo the use of the latest phones and buy suits from M&S etc. You get others eating out every lunchtime, wearing sharp designer gear, iPhones, BMW cars on finance, drinking in upmarket bars rather then the local boozer and paying crazy money for a room on a houseshare in the trendy parts of town. I know what these people are on and while it is not bad money their can't be much left over for savings with the latter group. It was hardly a surprise you hear that frugal ones are paying off student loans early and ultimately picking up keys for the first home way before the others. It is certainly not easy but I have been impressed with the savvy attitude and not give a shit what others think of what I am driving spirit.

stairway fair comment re ftb age now.
That's all I could afford as the market was very high at the time and i do live in the expensive South 😕

I think she was referring to the fact that If some people are willing to buy in cheap areas they may be able to buy her own house. Obviously it may still be a struggle and depending on area. You can still buy houses for less than 100k
www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/118630964?utm_campaign=property-details&utm_content=buying&utm_medium=sharing&utm_source=copytoclipboard#/&channel=RES_BUY

£3,35 each for fish and chips????? A medium portion of chips costs that where I live in the northwest fish and chips are pennies under a tenner EACH!

When my husband and I decided to buy (pre marriage) I lived in a council flat, worked 2 jobs, he was living in a flat share with mates. We cut out takeaways, just grabbing lunch or coffees, gym membership...basically what kirsty said. We dropped our spending to the bare minimum, but did allow ourselves 2 nights out a month to connect with each other and with friends. It took us 5yrs to save £11,000 between us. Then we bought our 3bed home for £96,000. It was in a poor state worth £25-30,000 less than other houses on the street and 6yrs on we only have the roof and drive left to do. Everything in life is hard work but our home was worth it as it's perfect for us and we have no plans to ever move. We were also lucky house prices in our area are not ridiculous.

I think she was referring to the fact that young women should rethink going to university, get themselves a boyfriend, have their babies at 27, and get a deposit from their parents.

Buying in a cheaper area is not practical or possible for many for obvious reasons.