City break with heavier drinker

[boringbertha1]

During the pandemic I made a lot of plans to spend more time with friends. This particular friend and I had a night away a few months ago and 5 days in March for a milestone birthday for her.

We generally get along great but I noticed on our last trip how much she drinks. I've pretty much stopped over the past couple of years as the hangovers just aren't worth it. She made a remark about how she 'hates people that don't drink' and there was a little bit of tension.

I will have a drink but for example, when we went out for dinner I had water with my meal and then a cocktail as a dessert and she had two double vodkas with her meal and then a cocktail with dessert and we were in the restaurant under an hour (then she halved the bill). We went out to the theatre and she got a bottle of wine for during the show. I had nipped to Tesco to get water and crisps etc for the hotel room and she said she didn't want anything and would just get something from the bar. She got another double vodka from the hotel bar.

This holiday is non refundable and I am looking forward to it but I'm already having concerns about her drinking and her attitude to me not drinking. She's suggested we book the airport lounge as you get 4 drinks included. I don't travel well so can see myself having a soft and her having 7 drinks. It's her birthday trip and I don't want to 'ruin' it by being boring but I can't think of anything worse than getting completely hammered all week out of awkwardness.

My DH and are like this, he drinks a lot, I may have a mini bottle of Prosecco and a cocktail once a month or one drink a night on holiday. It’s fine, I plan lots of nice activities for us and still enjoy the airport lounge.
It’s funny as I have a friend who’s tea total and she thinks I’m a big drinker and always mentions it as it just so happens I only seem to see her on my small bottle of Prosecco night. Best thing is just don’t mention her drinking and if she brings yours up then just say you’re not keen on it and have just as good time without it and then change the subject.

She really does have a problem if she sees something like a train journey in terms of how much alcohol she needs to bring with her (and then runs out, anyway), and a shorthaul flight (I'm assuming you're flying to London from Scotland or Ireland?) requiring a lounge booking for four free drinks because it's 'cheaper than the airport pub'.

Of course she 'hates people who don't drink' because they're not normalising her heavy drinking.

Just to add, ime, people who object to other people not drinking are rarely concerned with how much alcohol they are actually consuming, but more how they feel not drinking will impact the person's ability to be a fun companion. I drink about three drinks on a night out, but that doesn't stop me from throwing myself into all the evening has to offer with the same enthusiasm as my heavier drinking mates. I laugh at the same daft things, am happy to get on the dance floor, and never look askance at them from my position of sobriety. There's a big difference between not drinking and wanting to sit in a corner making polite and sensible conversation, and not drinking and going along with the sort of night out people expect with lots of alcohol involved. (And if that sort of thing has no appeal, then its better not to go out with drinkers to drinking environments.)

@5128gap

Just to add, ime, people who object to other people not drinking are rarely concerned with how much alcohol they are actually consuming, but more how they feel not drinking will impact the person's ability to be a fun companion. I drink about three drinks on a night out, but that doesn't stop me from throwing myself into all the evening has to offer with the same enthusiasm as my heavier drinking mates. I laugh at the same daft things, am happy to get on the dance floor, and never look askance at them from my position of sobriety. There's a big difference between not drinking and wanting to sit in a corner making polite and sensible conversation, and not drinking and going along with the sort of night out people expect with lots of alcohol involved. (And if that sort of thing has no appeal, then its better not to go out with drinkers to drinking environments.)

That's a different situation, though. The OP and her friend are going as a duo to London and they have either a concert or a theatre booked for every night. This is not a situation where the OP is sitting over a mineral water at 3 am saying 'Do you realise how ridiculous you look dancing?' on a night out clubbing with a bunch of drinkers.

I think drinkers mention others not drinking because they can’t imagine themselves having fun without it. They don’t understand it’s just as possible to have a real laugh and mess about with your friends when someone has only had a Diet Coke.

I would have a word before you go and tell her you hope she's not going to be overdoing the alcohol as you were a bit concerned last time! Buy her a nice present so you don't feel obliged to pay for her drink laden meals, and tell her you're only going to pay for what you consume as you were shocked at the cost on your previous trip!

I’ll sometimes “fake it” … pretend I have a cocktail, or a spirit, but just having the mixer .

Does mean you end up going to the bar - but worth

@5128gap

Just to add, ime, people who object to other people not drinking are rarely concerned with how much alcohol they are actually consuming, but more how they feel not drinking will impact the person's ability to be a fun companion. I drink about three drinks on a night out, but that doesn't stop me from throwing myself into all the evening has to offer with the same enthusiasm as my heavier drinking mates. I laugh at the same daft things, am happy to get on the dance floor, and never look askance at them from my position of sobriety. There's a big difference between not drinking and wanting to sit in a corner making polite and sensible conversation, and not drinking and going along with the sort of night out people expect with lots of alcohol involved. (And if that sort of thing has no appeal, then its better not to go out with drinkers to drinking environments.)

It's going to be quite a chilled week as it's all concerts and theatre we're doing rather than nightclubs. Which has all been okayed by her.

This was the sort of trip we had last time and she was still drinking heavily even though we were quietly sitting in a theatre.

I think you just need to be direct and say things like you dont want to pay for an airport lounge just for free booze you dont want to drink or you dont want to split the bill. Get in there first. Perhaps organise a few get togethers first to practice saying no and see if she bows out or gets arsey

Actually she sounds like a functioning alcoholic if this was all on one night - 2 x double vodkas, a cocktail, a bottle of wine and a further double vodka.

You're just not compatible, OP.

It doesn't matter if it's vegan food versus Argentinian beef; thriller seekers versus retreats and spa weekends.

You just have different ideas of fun and relaxation and you're not going to be able to achieve much more than a compromise which is not going to result in a trip to remember.

Bring it up with her and get it out in the open.

Invite other people? Meet up with people
In London? Dilute the difference?

Five days is quite a long time. Would it be a good idea to carve out some time apart during the break, e.g. book a spa treatment or arrange to meet up with someone else who you know who is in London? I think without a psychological pause the whole break could feel quite pressured.

As someone who spent her 20s as a party girl and who hasn't quite given that up, the amount she drinks seems... A LOT. Two double vodkas during dinner and a whole bottle of wine in the theatre? The thing is, that's not a house party or club where going a bit wild is part of the fun, that's a scenario in which you want to be compos mentis. Even in my 20s I wouldn't have wanted to be wasted at a restaurant or in the theatre. And even when I did get wasted every weekend, it was never a personality substitute and nor was it the central point of every sociable activity I did. And I would never have commented on a friend who wasn't drinking. So those are red flags, to me, that she doesn't just "like a drink" but "has a problem with drink".

In terms of how you get through the holiday - take as much of a lead in organising your days and nights if you can. Your various activities will be a good start. Plan out how you want to spend your days around them - decide what sights you want to see and places you want to go, decide when you want to go to them. "Oh, we have to leave to go to the next place now" is a good way to ensure someone stops drinking for at least the time it takes to travel to the next stop. If there's anything you want to do where drinking isn't an option, lock it into the itinerary.

You can't control her drinking but you can, to an extent, guide her movements, and you can have the city break you want regardless of whether she's drinking or not.

If she makes a sarky remark about non-drinkers, remember that's her issue, not yours. It's a rude comment. If it feels awkward, that's because she created the awkwardness, not you. You don't have to justify yourself.

In advance, tell her you have to stick to a budget (make up a reason if you want or just be vague about cash being tight at the moment), and if she tries to make you pay for her drinks just remind her of this every time.

@LagunaBubbles I don't know what the face is for, that's a ridiculous amount of alcohol, my liver is hurting just thinking about it.

I guess to me the key concern would be trying to drag me along to things when I don't want to go, so a drink or clubbing after the theatre are just a hard no - I'm tired and I want to go to bed. Are you sharing a room, as that would make a difference as well ?

@Oblomov22 I think you'll be ok in your scenario as long as there's at least two people who want to stay out drinking they can do it together.

Thankfully my ladies weekends away are all very sedate as most of us drink the same - maybe one cocktail before dinner and a bottle of wine between 4 of us. That's a few different groups as well, maybe it's just because we're old 40s/early 50s.

Actually she sounds like a functioning alcoholic if this was all on one night - 2 x double vodkas, a cocktail, a bottle of wine and a further double vodka

What do you mean ?
I am an alcoholic and I'd agree with this if she's doing it on the reg. Your averaged sized woman shouldn't be able to tolerate that much booze in one night without being ill unless they drink enough to give themselves a very high tolerance.

I am with PP who suggest mentioning your budget beforehand and not paying for her drinks. As a non-drinker myself, I confirm that is is f*cking irritating when someone says "let's just go halves" after 5 glasses of wine and you look like the petty one when you only want to pay for the water.

If the lounge is expensive for soft drinks, then tell her that you don't want to pay £x for 4 soft drinks. If she says "but I'll have yours", just jokingly say "oh that's a better deal, £x for 1 soft drink!". If there is food I'd go for it anyway and stuff a bunch of coke bottles in my bag.

Longer term, it's up to you whether you want to mention to her that you don't really enjoy really boozy socialising and find other things to do together. My social life changed enormously when I stopped drinking, but I can still "go for a drink" with people who's company I enjoy. It is the boring, repetitive drunks that have dropped off of my radar.

Re the 'functioning alcoholic' comment earlier to which I also take umbrage. I have a very high natural alcohol tolerance. Lots of medical studies look at the many possible reasons for this. Also with food actually. I've always been able to eat quite a lot considering I'm so small and people often wondered and actually questioned me - where does she put it all away / where does it go.

It's not Something I'm actually proud of, only because it's viewed very negatively as if because I can hold my alcohol I must be a heavy drinker drinker secretly behind closed doors. But I've always been the same since I was young teen, I can drink quite a bit, I don't get pissed, I don't get lairy. I don't have hangovers. I always drink a lot of water alongside it. Mn has a very negative view of drinking, anything other than a thimble of sherry at Christmas. I often don't drink for ages, then do, can do dry January easily. So don't assume that when I have 2 cocktails and then wine with dinner that there's anything more going on that what there is.

I think I'm probably in between you and your friend when it comes to drinking.
I don't think the splitting the bill 50/50 is fair. You need to address this. She is your friend after all. Some people drink more than others. You think she drinks too much and she thinks you don't drink enough.
I do think you are projecting a bit. If she is just as pleasant when drinking, what does it matter if you are drinking or not? You do you. She probably senses your judgement!

OP I feel for you but think this trip away could end up being a disaster.

Just out of interest, why 5 days? That seems a long time for a trip to London, especially with just one other person. There's potential for just getting on each other's nerves in general spending all that time together and that's without the added complication of you being a bit incompatible with the drinking.

I drink, really enjoy a good 'boozy' night out (though only once a month now, can't be doing with hangovers anymore) and tbh, tend to pick friends that are similar to me in that respect. Having said that, even I draw the line at fizz at 7am and I can't do more than one night in a row if it's really boozy, my hangovers are awful. But in a 5 day break away, theatre etc I wouldn't be getting hammered on any night as it's not that type of break by the sounds of it, but I would be enjoying 2-3 glasses of wine per evening probably and it wouldn't be the same for me if the person I was with was drinking orange juice the whole time so I can see both sides.

It does sound like she drinks a fair bit so I think I'd prepare yourself for her being drunk most of the time on this trip and if that doesn't appeal (and it wouldn't to me either) then I would either try and shorten it, cancel altogether or be honest with her before you go (in which case it might end up getting cancelled anyway!)

Oh and her expecting you to split the bill as a non-drinker is HUGE CF no, no. I would never expect that, you need to address that before you go.

She's an alcoholic.

This should be your final trip with her.
If you go, refuse to pay for her drink and tell her beforehand.
I couldn't be doing with that. I would actually cancel the trip myself. Fuck the lost money.

She's only using you as someone have a drunken yarn with and to help foot the bill for her boozing.
Some 'friend'.

@Oblomov22

Re the 'functioning alcoholic' comment earlier to which I also take umbrage. I have a very high natural alcohol tolerance. Lots of medical studies look at the many possible reasons for this. Also with food actually. I've always been able to eat quite a lot considering I'm so small and people often wondered and actually questioned me - where does she put it all away / where does it go.

It's not Something I'm actually proud of, only because it's viewed very negatively as if because I can hold my alcohol I must be a heavy drinker drinker secretly behind closed doors. But I've always been the same since I was young teen, I can drink quite a bit, I don't get pissed, I don't get lairy. I don't have hangovers. I always drink a lot of water alongside it. Mn has a very negative view of drinking, anything other than a thimble of sherry at Christmas. I often don't drink for ages, then do, can do dry January easily. So don't assume that when I have 2 cocktails and then wine with dinner that there's anything more going on that what there is.

I think the OP’s friend has a drinking problem, but it has less to do with how much she drinks than the fact that she seems to plan her drinking ahead of time as a priority, and for occasions that would not normally involve alcohol in most people’s minds — their last trip was via a three-hour train journey for which the friend bought four cans of pre-mixed drinks (presumably g and t s or similar) and had drunk them all after an hour and a half, and she bought a bottle of wine for them to drink in their seats at the theatre.

Now, before their planned short haul flight to London, the friend wants to book a lounge because of the four ‘free’ drinks per head, plus the OP anticipates she herself will only have one, meaning her friend knows she will have seven alcoholic drinks before they fly.

She sounds as if she can’t conceive of even short, daytime travel or leisure, a quick pre-theatre meal where you’re in a rush, or even something like a play or musical where you’re absorbed in what’s happening on stage, without drinking.

That’s why I think she has a problem.

I think it’s a mark of problem drinking if she can’t bear for the other person not to be.

Most people who like a drink can happily rein in and just have a couple (say, or chose not to drink) if the other person isn’t up for it, as it’s not sociable drinking then.

@GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing

I think it’s a mark of problem drinking if she can’t bear for the other person not to be.

Most people who like a drink can happily rein in and just have a couple (say, or chose not to drink) if the other person isn’t up for it, as it’s not sociable drinking then.

This.

She's rude to say she "hates" people who don't drink and you do sound incompatible.

I disagree with people saying she's an alcoholic. When I go on a weekend away I drink a lot, let my hair down and enjoy myself. I can drink 8 or 9 cocktails in one night over a few hours. I'm not an alcoholic, I don't drink at all in the week. Those pre mixed cans are only about 5% strength and they're tiny, they're hardly a lot!